Motherboard failure, ram failure, or other?

Hi,
I'm fairly computer savvy when it comes to software issues, but a
novice when it comes to hardware issues. I have a clone desktop that
recently started randomly restarting itself w/o warning.To understand
why this was happening, I selected the control panel button which
brings about the BSOD instead of a restart when an error occurs. As a
result, I started getting two types of errors: Machine_check_error and
IRQ_less_than errors. At the bottom of the BSOD, it usually says
'memory dump.' In addition to these errors, I was having a problem with
the bios when attaching an Epson printer to the usb port before the
bios loaded. If the printer is attached during startup, the computer
freezes on 'memory test' and the computer's clock resets itself. But,
if attached after the bios loads, the computer and printer start up
just fine.

Needless to say, I was baffled by these errors and brought the computer
into Best Buy to have it checked out. They told me I have a bad
motherboard and showed me a bunch of corossion on the capacitors. They
didn't, however, check the ram because the computer kept crashing on
them. I don't particularly understand this excuse, because I've run it
for hours at a time w/o it crashing. And even so, they could've put the
ram in another computer. So my question is this, how do I really know
if it's a bad motherboard, bad ram, or a bad cpu (or all of the above)?
What are chances that motherboard corrosion would cause these errors?
Also, if the motherboard got corroded, is it likely the cpu and ram
followed suit? I just don't want to buy a new motherboard only to find
out the ram is dead or the cpu is dead.

On 18 Jan 2005 00:56:43 -0800, "Stockmoose16"
wrote:

Needless to say, I was baffled by these errors and brought the computer
into Best Buy to have it checked out. They told me I have a bad
motherboard and showed me a bunch of corossion on the capacitors.

How old is your PC? Is it ancient?

What do you mean by a bunch of corrosion? Ive never seen anything
really on my MB caps. Maybe a slight discoloration thats it and I live
in a place near the ocean thats super humid which causes lots of
corrosion problems. I was fixing yet again a neighbors PC , his AMD 64
and the chrome fan grill is completely pitted and discolored from
corrosion. Theres usually rust breaking out on the case too with the
PCs here.

It really helps to have two PCs so you can swap parts. Other than that
you can do some limited things. The best thing to do is to take
everything out - all cards and test it with just the video card. Test
it with one stick of ram and alternate sticks and use a clean install
of windows. Use motherboard monitor to check your temps too.
After you get it sort of stable you could use memtest to check the
memory.

The rest of it is probably OK if its just the MB. But then how old is
the system? If its ancient youre better off buying new parts anyway.

Do a find on this group about bad capacitors if you wish more info.
There was a bad run of Chinese caps several years ago, which
did what yours did. There were several manufacturers affected.
It's unlikely that you could fix the problem.

" wrote in message
...
On 18 Jan 2005 00:56:43 -0800, "Stockmoose16"
wrote:

Needless to say, I was baffled by these errors and brought the
computer
into Best Buy to have it checked out. They told me I have a bad
motherboard and showed me a bunch of corossion on the capacitors.

How old is your PC? Is it ancient?

What do you mean by a bunch of corrosion? Ive never seen anything
really on my MB caps. Maybe a slight discoloration thats it and I live
in a place near the ocean thats super humid which causes lots of
corrosion problems. I was fixing yet again a neighbors PC , his AMD 64
and the chrome fan grill is completely pitted and discolored from
corrosion. Theres usually rust breaking out on the case too with the
PCs here.

It really helps to have two PCs so you can swap parts. Other than that
you can do some limited things. The best thing to do is to take
everything out - all cards and test it with just the video card. Test
it with one stick of ram and alternate sticks and use a clean install
of windows. Use motherboard monitor to check your temps too.
After you get it sort of stable you could use memtest to check the
memory.

The rest of it is probably OK if its just the MB. But then how old is
the system? If its ancient youre better off buying new parts anyway.

The computer is less than 2 years old. The capacitors aren't just
corroded, the metal, plus-shaped piece at the top of each capacitor has
bubbled upward (rather than being flat). The ram I have is one stick of
512 mb, so I can't really swap it for anything else. Does this sound
like simply a motherboard issue, or could it be something else? In
addition, if I just get a new motherboard, can I still use the same
heatsink and cooling fan?

You definitely have the *bad capacitor* problem. Either take it
somewhere and
have them replaced or get a new mobo. It is impossible to
say with any certainty whether anything else has a problem
or not. Since you didn't say what your old mobo is and what the
new one might be, we can't comment on the cpu heatsink question
although usually you can if you're not replacing the cpu.


"Stockmoose16" wrote in message
ups.com...
The computer is less than 2 years old. The capacitors aren't just
corroded, the metal, plus-shaped piece at the top of each capacitor
has
bubbled upward (rather than being flat). The ram I have is one stick
of
512 mb, so I can't really swap it for anything else. Does this sound
like simply a motherboard issue, or could it be something else? In
addition, if I just get a new motherboard, can I still use the same
heatsink and cooling fan?

The old motherboard is a jetway p4mfp533 (pentium 4, 533 FSB, 2.4 ghz).
Given that I can't tell whether the cpu, motherboard, or ram (or all of
them) are causing the problem, would I be better off buying a package
that includes both the motherboard and the cpu. It seems to me a cpu
alone is almost as expensive as buying it as a combo. I found this
website with a cpu and motherboard for a good deal:

http://shop2.outpost.com/product/399...H:MAIN_RSLT_PG

Will this combo work with my current heat sink and fan?

Also, would it be worthwhile to upgrade to a 3.2 ghz with new MB for
$100:

http://shop2.outpost.com/product/428...H:MAIN_RSLT_PG

If so, will this cpu and motherboard combo work with my current fan and
heat sink?

On 18 Jan 2005 12:48:13 -0800, "Stockmoose16"
wrote:

The old motherboard is a jetway p4mfp533 (pentium 4, 533 FSB, 2.4 ghz).
Given that I can't tell whether the cpu, motherboard, or ram (or all of
them) are causing the problem, would I be better off buying a package
that includes both the motherboard and the cpu. It seems to me a cpu
alone is almost as expensive as buying it as a combo. I found this
website with a cpu and motherboard for a good deal:

http://shop2.outpost.com/product/399...H:MAIN_RSLT_PG

Will this combo work with my current heat sink and fan?

That combo says CPU FAN INCLUDED.

Outpost has some good deals on packages. The sort of bad news is that
they use ECS boards in their packages all the time which is made my PC
chips which probably made your Jetway board. Yeah you have the classic
bad caps problem. It figures is your board was made my PC chips though
many other brands also had the problem. Youve got to wonder about
these ECS boards too but many say they are decent enough.

If this is, indeed, the "classic case" of a MB corroding, then is it
safe to say my CPU and ram are probably okay?

If this is, indeed, the "classic case" of a MB corroding, then is it
safe to say my CPU and ram are probably okay?

Also, I'm a little confused, is this "PC Chips" you speak of, what does
that mean?

On 18 Jan 2005 18:30:09 -0800, "Stockmoose16"
wrote:

If this is, indeed, the "classic case" of a MB corroding, then is it
safe to say my CPU and ram are probably okay?

Also, I'm a little confused, is this "PC Chips" you speak of, what does
that mean?

Who knows but Id say the odds are the rest of your stuff is OK. Id
just get a motherboard if thats all you want.

PC chips is one of the huge makers of motherboards. They got a rep of
making bottom of the barrel junk. They sell their boards under a lot
of names and are usually priced way below everyone else. I hate to
repeat the old charge again but they were accused long ago using fake
cache. That was when cache mem was a separate chip on the board. They
were accused of just making plastic blobs that looked like a chip I
guess to reduce costs. So some actually created websites listing all
the brands that might be PC chips to avoid the brand.

However they are still going strong I think they bought SOYO or at
least invested in them. And they seem to be popular in Europe etc as a
super cheap alternative under various names. They are popular here as
ECS - I think all of the combos FRYs offers are ECS bundles probably
cause they are so cheap as usual. Does that mean avoid them? I dont
know. The Frys deals are really popular and I havent seen wholesale
comdemnation of them. However obviously if there is a bad cap issue or
any other QC issue - ECS being the bottom of the barrel is probably
going to have the problem. But like I said there are plently of people
who are happy with their ECS frys deals. Hey of I lived near a frys Id
go for it myself if it was cheap enough for a second PC.

Just be aware thats its not exactly the top of the heap in motherboard
names - ASUS, ABIT, GIGABYTE, MSI and Chaintech etc are the more
mainstream brands though they all have their boosters and detractors
too. You can look at Newegg in the refurb section sometimes they have
killer deals there. And they generally carry decent boards though once
in a while you literally get a barebones box -- no backplate , and
extras.