Are mains surge protectors needed in the UK?

On Thu, 08 Jul 2004 15:47:28 +0100, Lem wrote:


snip


Am I being too complacent?

I've never used one. I've never had a surge blow anything either. My
next door neigbour as one for her PC, but makes SFA difference. Of
course in our house the fuse box has one of those quick trip over
fueses where even if a light bulb blows you have to reset the trip
switch, but even then its only ever the light bulb circuit that trips.

On Thu, 08 Jul 2004 16:10:40 +0100, Bagpuss
wrote:

On Thu, 08 Jul 2004 15:47:28 +0100, Lem wrote:


snip


Am I being too complacent?

I've never used one. I've never had a surge blow anything either. My
next door neigbour as one for her PC, but makes SFA difference. Of
course in our house the fuse box has one of those quick trip over
fueses where even if a light bulb blows you have to reset the trip
switch, but even then its only ever the light bulb circuit that trips.

We are the same with regard to the fuse box tripping out.

I do have surge protectors on my PC equipment. For an extra few quid
it seemed a good safety measure.

Chances of a power surge are probably 5000 to 1. But wouldnt you feel
silly if you were that 5000th person?

At then end of the day its your call. Do you feel lucky? Just how many
thunderstorms are we having compared with last year, and the year
before?

cheers

from "The Harbinger of Doom"
)

On Thu, 08 Jul 2004 16:58:57 +0100, Lem wrote:

Am I being too complacent?

I've never used one. I've never had a surge blow anything
either. My next door neigbour as one for her PC, but makes SFA
difference. Of course in our house the fuse box has one of
those quick trip over fueses where even if a light bulb blows
you have to reset the trip switch, but even then its only ever
the light bulb circuit that trips.


Harry wrote:

I do have surge protectors on my PC equipment. For an extra
few quid it seemed a good safety measure.

Chances of a power surge are probably 5000 to 1. But wouldnt
you feel silly if you were that 5000th person?

At then end of the day its your call. Do you feel lucky? Just
how many thunderstorms are we having compared with last year,
and the year before?


I don't want to take stupid risks. But I don't stupidly want to
spend money to prevent almost non-existent risks.

I don't have a surge protector on my TV or my stereo. So, do I
need one on my PC?

The only time I know of a lighting strike potentially affecting
equipment round here was where I used to work. But then the lighting
hit a cable outsite, passed down into the network switch then fanned
out from there blowing several PCs and melting the switch unit and the
wall mounted box it was located in. Of course a mains surge protector
would have done nothing for that.

If you have a quick trip fuse box in the house its probably not worth
it. If you don't then OK your PC is saved, but your TV, HiFi, Fridge
e.t.c is screwed :-)

The frequency of destructive surges is about once every
eight years. What is that frequency in your neighborhood?
That is a question that only you (and your long term
neighbors) can answer. Surge damage is a function of
underlying geology, frequency of CG lightning, and a properly
wired building. Properly wired means all incoming utilities
enter at same location and use the same single point earth
ground.

What can affect your frequency of surges? How and what kind
of trees are nearby (that might act as lightning rods)?
Underground utilities such as transcontinental pipeline?
Monolithic earth means better equipotential geology and
therefore less probability of transients. Again, time to
discuss history with the neighbors.

Effective 'whole house' protectors cost about £1 per
protected appliance. Is it necessary? Only you can provide
the other numbers.

In the meantime, plug-in protectors are not effective, cost
tens of times more money per protected appliance, and are
typically undersized. No sense wasting good money on
ineffective protectors that don't even claim to protect from
the typically destructive transient. A protector is only as
effective as its earth ground - which plug-in power strip and
UPS manufacturers fear you might learn.

Lem wrote:
I don't want to take stupid risks. But I don't stupidly want to
spend money to prevent almost non-existent risks.

I don't have a surge protector on my TV or my stereo. So, do I
need one on my PC?

Bagpuss wrote:

On Thu, 08 Jul 2004 16:58:57 +0100, Lem wrote:


Am I being too complacent?

I've never used one. I've never had a surge blow anything
either. My next door neigbour as one for her PC, but makes SFA
difference. Of course in our house the fuse box has one of
those quick trip over fueses where even if a light bulb blows
you have to reset the trip switch, but even then its only ever
the light bulb circuit that trips.


Harry wrote:

I do have surge protectors on my PC equipment. For an extra
few quid it seemed a good safety measure.

Chances of a power surge are probably 5000 to 1. But wouldnt
you feel silly if you were that 5000th person?

At then end of the day its your call. Do you feel lucky? Just
how many thunderstorms are we having compared with last year,
and the year before?


I don't want to take stupid risks. But I don't stupidly want to
spend money to prevent almost non-existent risks.

I don't have a surge protector on my TV or my stereo. So, do I
need one on my PC?


The only time I know of a lighting strike potentially affecting
equipment round here was where I used to work. But then the lighting
hit a cable outsite, passed down into the network switch then fanned
out from there blowing several PCs and melting the switch unit and the
wall mounted box it was located in. Of course a mains surge protector
would have done nothing for that.

If you have a quick trip fuse box in the house its probably not worth
it.

Circuit breakers and fuses, quick trip or not, will not prevent equipment
faults. They are there to prevent fires after the equipment fault.

If you don't then OK your PC is saved, but your TV, HiFi, Fridge
e.t.c is screwed :-)

On Thu, 8 Jul 2004 23:41:08 UTC, w_tom wrote:

The frequency of destructive surges is about once every
eight years. What is that frequency in your neighborhood?

Lightning isn't the only cause of surges. I've seen excessive voltage
several times over the last few years. Switching transients, etc.
--
Bob Eager
begin a new life...dump Windows!

Harry wrote:

On Thu, 08 Jul 2004 16:10:40 +0100, Bagpuss
wrote:

On Thu, 08 Jul 2004 15:47:28 +0100, Lem wrote:


snip


Am I being too complacent?

I've never used one. I've never had a surge blow anything either. My

I have, and a couple of friends too. We have a flaky power supply round
here and usually have about half a dozen power cuts each winter but we
had a strange one last winter; for several seconds before the power went
off there were big voltage fluctuations. When the power came back I had
a dead PS/2 port on one machine and two friends both had dead PSUs. I've
now got all my kit plugged into and 8-way trailing socket with surge
protector.

next door neigbour as one for her PC, but makes SFA difference. Of
course in our house the fuse box has one of those quick trip over
fueses where even if a light bulb blows you have to reset the trip
switch, but even then its only ever the light bulb circuit that trips.

We are the same with regard to the fuse box tripping out.


The solution to that is to replace the type B MCBs with type C on the
lighting circuit. I did and have not had a problem with nuisance
tripping since.

In article , w_tom
writes

[drivelectomy]

typically undersized. No sense wasting good money on
ineffective protectors that don't even claim to protect from
the typically destructive transient. A protector is only as
effective as its earth ground - which plug-in power strip and
UPS manufacturers fear you might learn.

And in Europe, the "earth ground" on mains wiring is good, hence plug-in
surge protectors do the job they were designed to do, shunting the surge
to earth.

In the States, not all power outlets can be assumed to have an earth
connection, so plug-in surge protectors have to shunt surges to the
other phase line, which makes them vastly less effective.

--
A. Top posters.
Q. What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?

Mike Tomlinson wrote:

In article , w_tom
writes

[drivelectomy]


typically undersized. No sense wasting good money on
ineffective protectors that don't even claim to protect from
the typically destructive transient. A protector is only as
effective as its earth ground - which plug-in power strip and
UPS manufacturers fear you might learn.


And in Europe, the "earth ground" on mains wiring is good, hence plug-in
surge protectors do the job they were designed to do, shunting the surge
to earth.

In the States, not all power outlets can be assumed to have an earth
connection,

You mean a separate earth. Neutral is, of course, earthed. The problem is,
even though it is supposed to be on the large terminal in two prong sockets
you can't always count on the wiring to be proper in older homes. Modern
construction is 3 prong.

so plug-in surge protectors have to shunt surges to the
other phase line, which makes them vastly less effective.


No, they expect an earth ground too. The problem is people who don't
understand it and use 3 to 2 wire plug converters (actually, it has the
earth terminal brought out for a separate connection but no one uses it)
and then wonder why the surge protector didn't work.

Bob Eager wrote:

On Thu, 8 Jul 2004 23:41:08 UTC, w_tom wrote:

The frequency of destructive surges is about once every
eight years. What is that frequency in your neighborhood?

Lightning isn't the only cause of surges. I've seen excessive voltage
several times over the last few years. Switching transients, etc.

Ignore w_tom, his pontification has run before at lentht. He doesn't
understand the UK wiring system.