If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. |
|
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#1
|
|||
|
|||
Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
On 22 Jul 2006, Dorothy Bradbury wrote:
Stick 2x 10,000rpm HD against one another in a drive cage. Provide sufficient cooling for 2x 8-17W drives. I will provide the data recovery firm name to use... o Motor-IC overheats from lack of linear-feet-per-min airflow o Motor-IC dumps heat into surroundings, motor/spindle heat o Motor-spindle dumps heat into FDB accelerating aging o FDB aging causes higher current draw (startup & continuous) ---- S.M.A.R.T. data measures startup Ima &/or startup Tsecs o Higher current draw heats motor/spindle & Motor-IC ---- Reinforcing System Loop of increasing thermal dissipation The above reminds me of hard drive hot spots because the Motor-IC gets referred to a few times. My question is simpler: If I have a hard drive which has a protective sheet of metal on one side and the circuit board on the other side then which of these two side should get the most cooling? |
#2
|
|||
|
|||
Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
Jon D wrote
If I have a hard drive which has a protective sheet of metal on one side and the circuit board on the other side then which of these two side should get the most cooling? Varys with the drive design. The only real way to answer that question is to try it both ways and monitor the drive SMART temp. |
#3
|
|||
|
|||
Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 07:56:58 +1000, "Rod Speed"
wrote: Jon D wrote If I have a hard drive which has a protective sheet of metal on one side and the circuit board on the other side then which of these two side should get the most cooling? Varys with the drive design. The only real way to answer that question is to try it both ways and monitor the drive SMART temp. NO, it does not vary per drive design, or rather, all drive designs are putting the board on the bottom, and a thin cover on the top, thus need more cooling on the bottom circuit board than (if any on) the top cover. In the majority of drives, the top cover is barely (if at all) even joined to the rest with a reasonably conductive junction, instead they typically have a silicone or some other type of flexible gasket. They may feel warm but this is more a function of heat rising because it wasn't removed more immediately from the hot areas instead of left to heat up surrounding areas. I'm sure you'll argue Rod, but you're quite wrong in general and offhand I don't recall any hard drive EVER MADE that needed as much, let alone more cooling on the top metal. In other words, a drive can be completely cooled with airflow over the bottom only. It cannot with airflow only over the top. |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
kony wrote
Rod Speed wrote Jon D wrote If I have a hard drive which has a protective sheet of metal on one side and the circuit board on the other side then which of these two side should get the most cooling? Varys with the drive design. The only real way to answer that question is to try it both ways and monitor the drive SMART temp. NO, it does not vary per drive design, Fraid it does. Most obviously with the older Barras which have a metal plate and rubber mat over the logic card etc. or rather, all drive designs are putting the board on the bottom, and a thin cover on the top, Plenty of top covers arent thin. thus need more cooling on the bottom circuit board than (if any on) the top cover. Not a ****ing clue, as always. Plenty of drives still get rid of quite a bit of heat thru the metal body of the drive. In the majority of drives, the top cover is barely (if at all) even joined to the rest with a reasonably conductive junction, Not a ****ing clue, as always. instead they typically have a silicone or some other type of flexible gasket. Separate matter entirely. They may feel warm but this is more a function of heat rising because it wasn't removed more immediately from the hot areas instead of left to heat up surrounding areas. Have fun explaining how come that cover STILL gets warm even when the drive is mounted upside down. I'm sure you'll argue Rod, but you're quite wrong in general Never ever could bull**** its way out of a wet paper bag. and offhand I don't recall any hard drive EVER MADE that needed as much, let alone more cooling on the top metal. Have fun explaining those early Barras, child. In other words, a drive can be completely cooled with airflow over the bottom only. It cannot with airflow only over the top. Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you have never ever had a ****ing clue about anything at all, ever. |
#5
|
|||
|
|||
Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 17:52:52 +1000, "Rod Speed"
wrote: kony wrote Rod Speed wrote Jon D wrote If I have a hard drive which has a protective sheet of metal on one side and the circuit board on the other side then which of these two side should get the most cooling? Varys with the drive design. The only real way to answer that question is to try it both ways and monitor the drive SMART temp. NO, it does not vary per drive design, Fraid it does. Most obviously with the older Barras which have a metal plate and rubber mat over the logic card etc. plate and rubber don't suddenly make a cover plate more conductive than it is, if you cool the area with longest conduction path and least tRise, you've let the rest get hotter than it otherwise would. or rather, all drive designs are putting the board on the bottom, and a thin cover on the top, Plenty of top covers arent thin. On modern drives? Which ones? thus need more cooling on the bottom circuit board than (if any on) the top cover. Not a ****ing clue, as always. Plenty of drives still get rid of quite a bit of heat thru the metal body of the drive. Bottom, yes. The top only gets hot as a function of how hot the interior was, because the bottom wasn't cooled enough, and of course a minor friction of platter/air inside the chamber but again, it is not only as well but better cooled by the bottom because the top is still secured by a gasket material which impedes heat transfer from other portions of the drive which likewise heat up. In the majority of drives, the top cover is barely (if at all) even joined to the rest with a reasonably conductive junction, Not a ****ing clue, as always. Rod, stop looking in the mirror. instead they typically have a silicone or some other type of flexible gasket. Separate matter entirely. So sorry but wrong again. It is entirely applicable, heat conduction and removal depends on the thermal gradient, cooling of the hotter parts or at least those with best thermal junctions to the other areas needing cooled more than passively-without-sink. They may feel warm but this is more a function of heat rising because it wasn't removed more immediately from the hot areas instead of left to heat up surrounding areas. Have fun explaining how come that cover STILL gets warm even when the drive is mounted upside down. Because heat radiates on all directions, not just UP. Particularly so in a semi-sealed chamber the platters are in. However, if your drive is mounted in a case and the cover feels warm, you didn't have ample cooling on the circuit board side which was what I'd written in the first place. If your drive is sitting upside down on a desk, the desk would have to be a better thermal conductor than air for the temp of the adjacent cover to be cooler than any other part. I'm sure you'll argue Rod, but you're quite wrong in general Never ever could bull**** its way out of a wet paper bag. It seems you always paste that line in when you already know you've goofed. and offhand I don't recall any hard drive EVER MADE that needed as much, let alone more cooling on the top metal. Have fun explaining those early Barras, child. There were other drives I ignored, some had the circuit board on the rear-top, but the same concept applied, that the side with the circuit board was still the one more important to cool (though chip densities being lower then, the airflow for the board was not as important). In other words, a drive can be completely cooled with airflow over the bottom only. It cannot with airflow only over the top. Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you have never ever had a ****ing clue about anything at all, ever. LOL. Funny how you can't even keep a drive cool, claiming it's "warm" then simultaneously ignoring those who manage to keep drives cool to the touch by ignoring your false advice. |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
Kony:
So, do you think drives would be better off upside-down, so the heat could rise off the bottom? If so, I just might flip mine. -- Ed Light Smiley :-/ MS Smiley :-\ Send spam to the FTC at Thanks, robots. Bring the Troops Home: http://bringthemhomenow.org |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 20:12:06 -0700, "Ed Light"
wrote: Kony: So, do you think drives would be better off upside-down, so the heat could rise off the bottom? If so, I just might flip mine. If you were trying to entirely, passively cool them, yes that should help, or even better is a sideways orientation so there is flow-by of the heated air instead of a shorter circular path. However, this is considered in isolation, once the drive is mounted in a chassis, that chassis should always have air intake, path on the far side of the drive (from the chassis exhaust point(s), meanting right in front of the drive rack) if not an intake fan before the drive rack. By having this airflow the difference between top or bottom drive side up is minimized, there is no hot air stagnating so they might as well be mounted bottom down. This is in general, certain positions and numbers of drives in particular drive racks might be slightly cooler one way or the other, with the goal being to put more of the airflow across the circuit board side of the drive, AND if possible to keep the intake air flowing within the drive rack. This last point is where a lot of cheaper chassis fail, they have drive racks sitting back from the front intake holes stamped in metal and nothing to force (or guide, however you want to consider it) the majority of the air to flow along the length of the drives. Quite a wasteful case design to save the manufacturer a few dozen cents? At least hard drives use solid capacitors, for all the brand bashing that goes on, they're built better than most other PC parts towards long term service... except those mechnical parts, pity we still need them. |
#8
|
|||
|
|||
Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
kony wrote
Rod Speed wrote kony wrote Rod Speed wrote Jon D wrote If I have a hard drive which has a protective sheet of metal on one side and the circuit board on the other side then which of these two side should get the most cooling? Varys with the drive design. The only real way to answer that question is to try it both ways and monitor the drive SMART temp. NO, it does not vary per drive design, Fraid it does. Most obviously with the older Barras which have a metal plate and rubber mat over the logic card etc. plate and rubber don't suddenly make a cover plate more conductive than it is, It does however mean that the LOGIC CARD gets significantly less cooling from the airflow than with drives with exposed logic cards, child. if you cool the area with longest conduction path and least tRise, you've let the rest get hotter than it otherwise would. Irrelevant waffle to that stupid pig ignorant claim that all drives are the same on that cooling question, child. or rather, all drive designs are putting the board on the bottom, and a thin cover on the top, Plenty of top covers arent thin. On modern drives? Yep. Which ones? Depends on how you define modern, child. thus need more cooling on the bottom circuit board than (if any on) the top cover. Not a ****ing clue, as always. Plenty of drives still get rid of quite a bit of heat thru the metal body of the drive. Bottom, yes. The top only gets hot as a function of how hot the interior was, because the bottom wasn't cooled enough, Not a ****ing clue, as always. and of course a minor friction of platter/air inside the chamber but again, it is not only as well but better cooled by the bottom because the top is still secured by a gasket material which impedes heat transfer from other portions of the drive which likewise heat up. Not a ****ing clue, as always. And have fun explaining how come some drive manufacturers explicitly state that the drive temp limits apply to a specific location on the top cover, child. In the majority of drives, the top cover is barely (if at all) even joined to the rest with a reasonably conductive junction, Not a ****ing clue, as always. Rod, stop looking in the mirror. Never ever could bull**** its way out of a wet paper bag. instead they typically have a silicone or some other type of flexible gasket. Separate matter entirely. So sorry but wrong again. Never ever could bull**** its way out of a wet paper bag. It is entirely applicable, Nope, not when the top cover is only part of the metal structure of the drive, child. heat conduction and removal depends on the thermal gradient, Wrong again, most obviously with significant airflow over the drive. cooling of the hotter parts or at least those with best thermal junctions to the other areas needing cooled more than passively-without-sink. Meaningless waffle with hard drives. They may feel warm but this is more a function of heat rising because it wasn't removed more immediately from the hot areas instead of left to heat up surrounding areas. Have fun explaining how come that cover STILL gets warm even when the drive is mounted upside down. Because heat radiates on all directions, not just UP. Pathetic, really. It cant 'radiate' from the logic card thru the body of the drive, to the top cover, child. Particularly so in a semi-sealed chamber the platters are in. Pity about the platters, child. However, if your drive is mounted in a case and the cover feels warm, you didn't have ample cooling on the circuit board side Wrong, as always. If you have ample cooling over the logic card, with the drive mounted with that on top, THE COVER WILL STILL BE WARM, child. which was what I'd written in the first place. Pity it was always pure pig ignorant drivel. In spades with those early Barras, child. If your drive is sitting upside down on a desk, the desk would have to be a better thermal conductor than air for the temp of the adjacent cover to be cooler than any other part. I wasnt even considering the drive on the desk, child. I'm sure you'll argue Rod, but you're quite wrong in general Never ever could bull**** its way out of a wet paper bag. It seems you always paste that line in when you already know you've goofed. Never ever could bull**** its way out of a wet paper bag. and offhand I don't recall any hard drive EVER MADE that needed as much, let alone more cooling on the top metal. Have fun explaining those early Barras, child. There were other drives I ignored, some had the circuit board on the rear-top, but the same concept applied, that the side with the circuit board was still the one more important to cool (though chip densities being lower then, the airflow for the board was not as important). Never ever could bull**** its way out of a wet paper bag. In other words, a drive can be completely cooled with airflow over the bottom only. It cannot with airflow only over the top. Thanks for that completely superfluous proof that you have never ever had a ****ing clue about anything at all, ever. LOL. Village eejut immitations aint gunna save your bacon, child. Funny how you can't even keep a drive cool, Fraid I can, child. claiming it's "warm" Only a fool blows enough air over a drive so it isnt warm, child. then simultaneously ignoring those who manage to keep drives cool to the touch by ignoring your false advice. Never ever could bull**** its way out of a wet paper bag. AND it CANT be 'false advice' to try it both ways, you pathetic excuse for a lying bull**** artist. |
#9
|
|||
|
|||
Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
Kony,
Thanks for the composition. Luckily my HD stays between 16C and 29C. It's up in a 5 1/4" bay, though, without great air flow. -- Ed Light Smiley :-/ MS Smiley :-\ Send spam to the FTC at Thanks, robots. Bring the Troops Home: http://bringthemhomenow.org |
#10
|
|||
|
|||
Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
On Sun, 30 Jul 2006 15:08:25 +1000, "Rod Speed"
wrote: kony wrote Rod Speed wrote kony wrote Rod Speed wrote Jon D wrote If I have a hard drive which has a protective sheet of metal on one side and the circuit board on the other side then which of these two side should get the most cooling? Varys with the drive design. The only real way to answer that question is to try it both ways and monitor the drive SMART temp. NO, it does not vary per drive design, Fraid it does. Most obviously with the older Barras which have a metal plate and rubber mat over the logic card etc. plate and rubber don't suddenly make a cover plate more conductive than it is, It does however mean that the LOGIC CARD gets significantly less cooling from the airflow than with drives with exposed logic cards, child. Yes clueless one, that makes the airflow over that area all the more important. if you cool the area with longest conduction path and least tRise, you've let the rest get hotter than it otherwise would. Irrelevant waffle to that stupid pig ignorant claim that all drives are the same on that cooling question, child. Rod, what's with this "child" notion? I may easily be older than you. And more important, I don't have the need to BS my way out of a paper bag, a skill you seem to have thought you mastered. Is it a shock, now, that you are finding no way out of your bag? or rather, all drive designs are putting the board on the bottom, and a thin cover on the top, Plenty of top covers arent thin. On modern drives? Yep. Which ones? Depends on how you define modern, child. Ah, so you have nothing, just a black hole of knowledge. thus need more cooling on the bottom circuit board than (if any on) the top cover. Not a ****ing clue, as always. Plenty of drives still get rid of quite a bit of heat thru the metal body of the drive. Bottom, yes. The top only gets hot as a function of how hot the interior was, because the bottom wasn't cooled enough, Not a ****ing clue, as always. Didn't need a clue. Drives run cool here, unlike those you keep mentioning as warm or hot, every 3rd thread about HDDs. Did it ever occur to you that you might have no concept whatsoever about the most basic fundamentals of HDD cooling? Really Rod, it's not a hard thing... you argue that you know something and yet drives are warm, contrasted with the opposing strategy that results in cool drives. Seems almost ironic. and of course a minor friction of platter/air inside the chamber but again, it is not only as well but better cooled by the bottom because the top is still secured by a gasket material which impedes heat transfer from other portions of the drive which likewise heat up. Not a ****ing clue, as always. And have fun explaining how come some drive manufacturers explicitly state that the drive temp limits apply to a specific location on the top cover, child. Show us this spec Rod. You've made up so much BS recently I can't take anything you write at face value anymore. Oops, I deleted the rest of the post. Was it a loss or did you just write something about BS and paper bags a few dozen times? |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Typical mains power for mid-range PC? | Jon D | General | 52 | August 1st 06 02:18 PM |
My monitor went black in Linux/Debian (X) and text mode earlier today... | [email protected] | Nvidia Videocards | 9 | June 15th 06 12:00 AM |
24 pin power supplies, stability issues? | Don Burnette | General | 28 | March 13th 06 10:25 PM |
Newbie: OC Advice: AMDXP2200 CPU | Donald Bock | Overclocking AMD Processors | 2 | March 12th 05 12:14 AM |
Processor heat dissipation, Leakage current, voltages & clockspeed | The little lost angel | General | 21 | November 1st 04 02:43 AM |