pluging into USB port crashing system

On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:56:19 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote:


"Allen Drake" wrote in message ...
On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 07:22:06 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote:


"Allen Drake" wrote in message news On Thu, 29 Dec 2011 19:10:45 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote:


"Allen Drake" wrote in message ...

When I even get close to plugging anything into either of my front
panel USB ports the system crashes and reboots. When it boots this
time the report says there is no CPU present. I double checked to make
sure the cable is plugged in correctly and tried another set of pins
on motherboard, there are three, but the result is the same. I have
been searching and find others claiming a underpowered PSU is to blame
but I have a Termaltake 750 which is new. This is a newly build system
and has no other problems. I am using an M4A87TD/US3 board with AMD
Phenom and Supertalent RAM.

If anyone has any ideas I would appreciate the help.

Thanks.

Al.

It's possible you have a faulty PS. Do you by chance have a spare you could use temporarily? (I know, not exactly a
closet shelf item.) Is it possible that the pinout is different from the previous MB (had that happen to me going
from
one ASUS MB to another)? If you have the manual for your MB (or check it out online), you can compare them.

Is this a new problem, or did it manifest itself right after the build was completed? And by "newly build", does
that
include the case and all?

I did check the pin out and actually moved the cable to another
position on the board. I am getting a similar reaction by using the
rear ports but in that case the system simply locks up. I have a USB3
external drive attached which I will remove and try more debugging
later tonight.

I am not sure if this just started or not. I have several builds
going at one time and sometimes I lose focus. That and the 12 hour
days at my day job wears me down a bit.


Oh yeah, I remember those days all too well. When I worked at a Ford assembly plant back in the mid 70s, we were on an
80 hour work week for three months. My kids forgot my name and my wife found someone else (although she sure loved
that
40 hours of overtime paycheck). We worked from 3PM to 3:30AM M-Sat, and 3-11:30PM on Sunday. After they got the number
of vehicles they wanted in storage, they laid off everyone, some for up to two years. Not a good time in southeastern
Michigan.

I love work so I will take the OT any time I can get it. I have been
in the work force since the 60s have done all shifts. I like the grave
yard myself but now am confined to 6 AM to 6PM and 8 hrs on Saturdays.
My last job I got one Sunday off a month. Defense industry and NASA
but that has been cut back somewhat too.


But I digress. Keep us posted on your PC. The USB3 ports are only in the back, on the MB, aren't they? The front panel
ports are USB2 IIRC from glancing through the manual for your MB.

Yes the USB 3 is on the back but the Antec Nine Hundred Two case has
a USB 3 and two USB 2 posts on the top front. I think I will get out
the multi meter now and see what I can find. I'll let you know what
happens.


The 3 plug-ins for USB78, 1112, and 910 are allUSB2.0, if I'm reading the manual right. So if the 3.0 on the case is
plugged into any of them, that may be where your problem lies. I don't know if the pin-outs are different between USB2.0
and 3.0, but I wouldn't think so. There's no pin-out difference between 1.0 and 2.0, IIRC. (Just guessing here :-) )

I found the problem. It was a bad ground. I connected a wire with
alligator clips on each end to the connector on the front to a part of
the case that was not painted. It was crude as the small clip was
connecting to the small rim of the outer edge of the connector. It
barely held on while I looked for a place to connect the other end to
and took a chance but it worked. Then I noticed a wire connecting
underneath the top next to the large fan. It was a bit loose so I
tightened it and so that must have been the real problem. I replaced
it with a slightly longer screw and tightened it so it will hold. It
seems that little screw is just not long enough to stay tight. I
removed the alligator clip wire and all seems well. Now both the front
and rear USB posts work as intended.

On 12/29/2011 5:29 PM, Allen Drake wrote:

When I even get close to plugging anything into either of my front
panel USB ports the system crashes and reboots. When it boots this
time the report says there is no CPU present. I double checked to make
sure the cable is plugged in correctly and tried another set of pins
on motherboard, there are three, but the result is the same. I have
been searching and find others claiming a underpowered PSU is to blame
but I have a Termaltake 750 which is new. This is a newly build system
and has no other problems. I am using an M4A87TD/US3 board with AMD
Phenom and Supertalent RAM.

If anyone has any ideas I would appreciate the help.

Thanks.

Al.


It sounds like static electricity problem. I solved the same problem by
putting a humidifier in the computer room.

"Allen Drake" wrote in message ...
snip
I found the problem. It was a bad ground. I connected a wire with
alligator clips on each end to the connector on the front to a part of
the case that was not painted. It was crude as the small clip was
connecting to the small rim of the outer edge of the connector. It
barely held on while I looked for a place to connect the other end to
and took a chance but it worked. Then I noticed a wire connecting
underneath the top next to the large fan. It was a bit loose so I
tightened it and so that must have been the real problem. I replaced
it with a slightly longer screw and tightened it so it will hold. It
seems that little screw is just not long enough to stay tight. I
removed the alligator clip wire and all seems well. Now both the front
and rear USB posts work as intended.


Great! At least it was something simple and didn't involve anything other than lost time.
Good on you for finding it as soon as you did :-)
--
SC Tom

On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 21:30:38 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote:


"Allen Drake" wrote in message ...
snip
I found the problem. It was a bad ground. I connected a wire with
alligator clips on each end to the connector on the front to a part of
the case that was not painted. It was crude as the small clip was
connecting to the small rim of the outer edge of the connector. It
barely held on while I looked for a place to connect the other end to
and took a chance but it worked. Then I noticed a wire connecting
underneath the top next to the large fan. It was a bit loose so I
tightened it and so that must have been the real problem. I replaced
it with a slightly longer screw and tightened it so it will hold. It
seems that little screw is just not long enough to stay tight. I
removed the alligator clip wire and all seems well. Now both the front
and rear USB posts work as intended.


Great! At least it was something simple and didn't involve anything other than lost time.
Good on you for finding it as soon as you did :-)


Once in a while you get lucky. I did spend a few days searching for
any other instances of this but nothing about that loose screw. I
stumbled onto it by luck. I happened to look up and there it was.

On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:56:19 -0500, SC Tom wrote:

The 3 plug-ins for USB78, 1112, and 910 are allUSB2.0, if I'm reading the manual right. So if the 3.0 on the case is
plugged into any of them, that may be where your problem lies. I don't know if the pin-outs are different between USB2.0
and 3.0, but I wouldn't think so. There's no pin-out difference between 1.0 and 2.0, IIRC. (Just guessing here :-) )

USB 3.0 has five extra pins compared to previous versions, see:

http://www.usb3.com/usb3-info.html

--
Regards - Rodney Pont
The from address exists but is mostly dumped,
please send any emails to the address below
e-mail rpont (at) gmail (dot) com

"Rodney Pont" wrote in message
fohit.me.uk...
On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:56:19 -0500, SC Tom wrote:

The 3 plug-ins for USB78, 1112, and 910 are allUSB2.0, if I'm reading the manual right. So if the 3.0 on the case is
plugged into any of them, that may be where your problem lies. I don't know if the pin-outs are different between
USB2.0
and 3.0, but I wouldn't think so. There's no pin-out difference between 1.0 and 2.0, IIRC. (Just guessing here :-) )

USB 3.0 has five extra pins compared to previous versions, see:

http://www.usb3.com/usb3-info.html


Yeah, I probably should have looked it up before posting that. Thanks for setting me straight :-)
--
SC Tom

On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 07:18:30 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote:


"Rodney Pont" wrote in message
nfohit.me.uk...
On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:56:19 -0500, SC Tom wrote:

The 3 plug-ins for USB78, 1112, and 910 are allUSB2.0, if I'm reading the manual right. So if the 3.0 on the case is
plugged into any of them, that may be where your problem lies. I don't know if the pin-outs are different between
USB2.0
and 3.0, but I wouldn't think so. There's no pin-out difference between 1.0 and 2.0, IIRC. (Just guessing here :-) )

USB 3.0 has five extra pins compared to previous versions, see:

http://www.usb3.com/usb3-info.html


Yeah, I probably should have looked it up before posting that. Thanks for setting me straight :-)


Even the cables are different. I wonder why make different cables if
the USB3 is downward compatible.

On Dec 30, 7:56 pm, Allen Drake wrote:
On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:56:19 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote:

"Allen Drake" wrote in messagenews:gk9sf7tqvh0qf3qi0rk364vcikfjgocg1b@4ax .com...
On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 07:22:06 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote:

"Allen Drake" wrote in messagenewskvqf7d8jmf1b8f40rogio8onsf2aeglta@4ax .com...
On Thu, 29 Dec 2011 19:10:45 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote:

"Allen Drake" wrote in messagenews:cdtpf7lhcrnjoq8v21s4ua7tvffqrkeea9@4ax .com...

When I even get close to plugging anything into either of my front
panel USB ports the system crashes and reboots. When it boots this
time the report says there is no CPU present. I double checked to make
sure the cable is plugged in correctly and tried another set of pins
on motherboard, there are three, but the result is the same. I have
been searching and find others claiming a underpowered PSU is to blame
but I have a Termaltake 750 which is new. This is a newly build system
and has no other problems. I am using an M4A87TD/US3 board with AMD
Phenom and Supertalent RAM.

If anyone has any ideas I would appreciate the help.

Thanks.

Al.

It's possible you have a faulty PS. Do you by chance have a spare you could use temporarily? (I know, not exactly a
closet shelf item.) Is it possible that the pinout is different from the previous MB (had that happen to me going
from
one ASUS MB to another)? If you have the manual for your MB (or check it out online), you can compare them.

Is this a new problem, or did it manifest itself right after the build was completed? And by "newly build", does
that
include the case and all?

I did check the pin out and actually moved the cable to another
position on the board. I am getting a similar reaction by using the
rear ports but in that case the system simply locks up. I have a USB3
external drive attached which I will remove and try more debugging
later tonight.

I am not sure if this just started or not. I have several builds
going at one time and sometimes I lose focus. That and the 12 hour
days at my day job wears me down a bit.

Oh yeah, I remember those days all too well. When I worked at a Ford assembly plant back in the mid 70s, we were on an
80 hour work week for three months. My kids forgot my name and my wife found someone else (although she sure loved
that
40 hours of overtime paycheck). We worked from 3PM to 3:30AM M-Sat, and 3-11:30PM on Sunday. After they got the number
of vehicles they wanted in storage, they laid off everyone, some for up to two years. Not a good time in southeastern
Michigan.

I love work so I will take the OT any time I can get it. I have been
in the work force since the 60s have done all shifts. I like the grave
yard myself but now am confined to 6 AM to 6PM and 8 hrs on Saturdays.
My last job I got one Sunday off a month. Defense industry and NASA
but that has been cut back somewhat too.

But I digress. Keep us posted on your PC. The USB3 ports are only in the back, on the MB, aren't they? The front panel
ports are USB2 IIRC from glancing through the manual for your MB.

Yes the USB 3 is on the back but the Antec Nine Hundred Two case has
a USB 3 and two USB 2 posts on the top front. I think I will get out
the multi meter now and see what I can find. I'll let you know what
happens.

The 3 plug-ins for USB78, 1112, and 910 are allUSB2.0, if I'm reading the manual right. So if the 3.0 on the case is
plugged into any of them, that may be where your problem lies. I don't know if the pin-outs are different between USB2.0
and 3.0, but I wouldn't think so. There's no pin-out difference between 1.0 and 2.0, IIRC. (Just guessing here :-) )

I found the problem. It was a bad ground. I connected a wire with
alligator clips on each end to the connector on the front to a part of
the case that was not painted. It was crude as the small clip was
connecting to the small rim of the outer edge of the connector. It
barely held on while I looked for a place to connect the other end to
and took a chance but it worked. Then I noticed a wire connecting
underneath the top next to the large fan. It was a bit loose so I
tightened it and so that must have been the real problem. I replaced
it with a slightly longer screw and tightened it so it will hold. It
seems that little screw is just not long enough to stay tight. I
removed the alligator clip wire and all seems well. Now both the front
and rear USB posts work as intended.

That is weird, for a faulted ground connect to show up as a USB
error. When I've had subsequent problems after assembling a system, I
may rebuild it either in two ways: a) breadboarded, everything on
plastic and connected for powering up together, or b) totally taken
down, just for the MB and PS to be meticulously secured into the case,
with care in watching for how it's powering up, one by one, then as
any extra component are also added. Really ticks me off if I can't
get it up and finally right, like the 775 MB/CPU Newegg sent me last
time on a special sale. On the box it was shipped, in Newegg's big
letters, the sticker says: You may have gotten quite a deal !! . . .A
big deal, yep, up half the night tearing apart other systems to try
and find a temporary fix for a working-parts combo, giving up, calling
Newegg the next morning, and him telling me they're only paying half
shipping if I return it?

Oh, yea - he did it offer it to me again, at one over again and half
off. . . .Be like a $75 MB for $35 on sale, he's finally offering at
$17 if I'll just take it and get it out of his hair. Thanks, I said.
Only, I just can't take the excitement of another sales frenzy, no
more and no thanks.

Used to love their open-box sales, but tend these days to look twice
for reputable manufacturers and reviews within reasonable pricing on
new sealed equipment.

On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 13:14:05 -0500, Allen Drake wrote:

USB 3.0 has five extra pins compared to previous versions, see:

http://www.usb3.com/usb3-info.html


Yeah, I probably should have looked it up before posting that. Thanks for setting me straight :-)


Even the cables are different. I wonder why make different cables if
the USB3 is downward compatible.

Have a look at the URL above, it explains it all. USB3.0 has 9
conductors while earlier versions have 4. You can fit an earlier cable
into a USB3.0 socket but you can't fit a USB3.0 plug into an earlier
socket.

--
Regards - Rodney Pont
The from address exists but is mostly dumped,
please send any emails to the address below
e-mail rpont (at) gmail (dot) com

Allen Drake wrote:
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 07:18:30 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote:

"Rodney Pont" wrote in message
fohit.me.uk...
On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:56:19 -0500, SC Tom wrote:

The 3 plug-ins for USB78, 1112, and 910 are allUSB2.0, if I'm reading the manual right. So if the 3.0 on the case is
plugged into any of them, that may be where your problem lies. I don't know if the pin-outs are different between
USB2.0
and 3.0, but I wouldn't think so. There's no pin-out difference between 1.0 and 2.0, IIRC. (Just guessing here :-) )
USB 3.0 has five extra pins compared to previous versions, see:

http://www.usb3.com/usb3-info.html

Yeah, I probably should have looked it up before posting that. Thanks for setting me straight :-)


Even the cables are different. I wonder why make different cables if
the USB3 is downward compatible.

The USB3 socket has two sections. A high speed section and a low
speed section.

The USB1.1 or USB2 connector, fits into the low speed section of the USB3 socket.

If a USB3 peripheral is plugged in, then it has access to the high speed interface.

The reason it was done that way, is because they needed two diff pairs, to
do a nice interface similar to how SATA and PCI Express work. They wanted
to be competitive with those standards, and as time passes, USB3 will be
able to evolve to match the speeds of the other standards.

One thing that differs on USB3, compared to SATA and PCI Express, is the USB3
interconnect cabling can be longer. And that causes some difference in what
you can safely do, when designing a standard for higher speeds.

http://www.usb3.com/

"One thing to note is that operating simultaneously in SuperSpeed and
Hi-Speed is not allowed. It is an either or scenario."

So of the nine signals, they're not using all of them at exactly the
same time. That page also mentions the names of the signals.

VBUS \
D- \___ Traditional USB2 set of pins, includes bus power
D+ /
GND /
RX- \
RX+ \
GND_Drain \___ Full duplex USB3 interface
TX- /
TX+ /
Shield --- outer shield

The diagram for that, is easier to see here.

http://www.interfacebus.com/usb-cable-diagram-30.html

Paul