Intel wants to slow down platform changes

Bill Todd wrote:
"Dean Kent" wrote in message
.com...

"Rob Stow" wrote in message
...

Try talking to the guys - including me - who actually repair
the damage. They'll tell you that AMD users tend to buy *upgrades*
for *working* CPUs while Intel users tend to bring in *dead* CPUs
and ask for *replacements*.


Sorry, but I've been on vacation for awhile and just saw this one from

over

a week ago, but...

I think it is somewhat interesting that you say this, since at the last
several AMD Tech Tours I've attended, the support guys emphasize how
important using the proper thermal solution is for AMD processors, and

they

claim that the #1 problem with AMD processors is death due to 'use of
improper thermal solutions' (previously, it was improper installation of
heat sinks - which included the damage of the die due to uneven pressure).
I also find it interesting that AMD recently emphasized that warranties

will

not be honored when anything other than the recommended thermal solutions
are used (including the use of Arctic Silver and such - which is not
recommended).

While it has been quite some time since I did any support, I find it very
difficult to believe that Intel customers "tend to bring in dead CPUs".
From my experience, motherboards were the #1 problem - at about a 1% to 3%
failure rate (depending upon manufacturer), with dead CPUs being a rarity.
With increased power dissipation, I can certainly see more CPU failures -
but the way it is stated, it sounds like in your experience users of AMD
processors rarely, if ever, have 'dead' CPUs (contrary to what AMD says),
while Intel users typically have dead CPUs (which is contrary to my
experience, and common sense).


I don't think anything you've said serves to refute anything Rob said.

Whether some form of heat death is the #1 *problem* with AMD processors is
irrelevant if far more users (likely of the 'enthusiast' variety) choose to
replace working AMD processors than come in with dead ones. And the
relative importance of MB problems for Intel users really says nothing about
the reasons why an Intel owner may want another CPU: it's still entirely
possible that *when* they want one it's usually to replace a dead one, even
if that happens rarely.

Rob's statements could still be true even if (not that I'm suggesting that
this is the case) AMD CPUs failed a lot more frequently than Intel's do: it
would simply indicate that the ratio of AMD enthusiast-replacers to Intel
enthusiast-replacers was even higher.


Bill's last paragraph gets to the heart of the matter. To clarify my point
a little further, lets look separately at the three largest groups of cpu
purchasers:

1.) Upgraders:

The AMD'er goes into the store to buy a processor faster
than the one he currently has, walks out with same, and installs it.
The Intel owner goes into the store with the same intentions and goes
home empty handed because he's already got the fastest cpu his
motherboard can handle or is so close to that limit that an upgrade is
not worthwhile. Intel owners vastly outnumber AMD owners, but AMD
upgraders outnumber Intel upgraders simply because they *can* do a
simple cpu upgrade - no motherboard upgrade required until you want to
try a Barton. The Intel average upgrade costs about twice as much
as an AMD upgrade simply because the processor is more expensive, a
new motherboard is often required, and sometime new RAM is required.



2.) Replacers:

These are the guys who have fried their cpu. There are fewer of them
than you might think: overclockers are more common and more vocal in
newsgroups like this than they are out in the real world. The
overwhelming majority of computer users are too conservative for OC'ing:
the want all the speed they can get, buy not at the risk of sacrificing
reliability. In my experience the number or Intel vs. AMD replacers is
pretty much proportional to the number of Intel vs AMD owners.

The most common sub-category of replacers are the upgraders who botched
the job - this tilts the numbers against AMD, but only because AMD
owners are much more likely to try an upgrade in the first place. AMD
upgraders do *not* seem to be more likely to botch the upgrade - there
are simply more of them.

3.) New buyers:

Buying a processor for building a new system, as opposed to upgrading or
replacing an existing cpu. These buyers are not relevant to this discussion.