Motherboard for P4.

Why not get an Atholon 64 3800+ instead of an FX-51? It looks like AMD
may be phasing out the FX-51 and replacing it with the Athlon64 3800+, so if
you want an FX-51, you better buy it soon. As for the choice between the two,
it depends on whether your software makes better use of the extra cache
or the extra clock speed. Just off the top of my head, I would guess that on
average most games tend to make better use of the extra clock speed
rather than the extra cache for an Athlon64, since the Athlon 64 isn't
heavily pipelined.

Dennis E Strausser Jr wrote:

"JK" wrote in message
...
Take a look at this review, which includes the lower priced
Athlon 64 chips.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...spx?i=2065&p=1


Dennis E Strausser Jr wrote:

Sorry for more then one reply here..

But..
http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/200...caling-09.html

You people still think Intel is better for gaming then AMD??

Denny. :-)

Ok, and???
On a lot of tests they keep up well.
Hmm?
FX53 = around 800 or 830$
P4 3.4 C EE 999$
Which would you rather have?
I'm starting to do everything I can think of just to get a FX53, but I
might
just get a FX51 and overclock the **** out of it.
I still have a water cooler, all I need is a new water block and I'm all
set.
Denny.

Notice the absence of the FX-51 in this story.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/07...ces/print.html

JK wrote:

Why not get an Atholon 64 3800+ instead of an FX-51? It looks like AMD
may be phasing out the FX-51 and replacing it with the Athlon64 3800+, so if
you want an FX-51, you better buy it soon. As for the choice between the two,
it depends on whether your software makes better use of the extra cache
or the extra clock speed. Just off the top of my head, I would guess that on
average most games tend to make better use of the extra clock speed
rather than the extra cache for an Athlon64, since the Athlon 64 isn't
heavily pipelined.

Dennis E Strausser Jr wrote:

"JK" wrote in message
...
Take a look at this review, which includes the lower priced
Athlon 64 chips.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...spx?i=2065&p=1


Dennis E Strausser Jr wrote:

Sorry for more then one reply here..

But..
http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/200...caling-09.html

You people still think Intel is better for gaming then AMD??

Denny. :-)

Ok, and???
On a lot of tests they keep up well.
Hmm?
FX53 = around 800 or 830$
P4 3.4 C EE 999$
Which would you rather have?
I'm starting to do everything I can think of just to get a FX53, but I
might
just get a FX51 and overclock the **** out of it.
I still have a water cooler, all I need is a new water block and I'm all
set.
Denny.

Ralph Wade Phillips wrote:
"~misfit~" wrote in message
...

Of course it is. Sorry guys, Woger is the village idiot from my local
computer newsgroup, nz.comp, where he has posted under over 100
different alias' in the last few years as people killfile him. I
don't know how he got out, I thought we had him locked in the
basement.

That's what you get for running an unsecured 802.11b node,
Misfit.

LOL. He actually lives at the other end of the island from me. (North
Island).
--
~misfit~

Yea, he likes to make *ass*umptions about others. VIA has a bad
history and only a dumbass would choose a VIA chipset over the 865 and
875 chipsets for a P4 build.

What do you know that the experts don't? All the experts agree that the
taiwanese chipmakers are holding their own against Intel as far as
stability
AND performance goes. I'm waiting . . . enlighten us . . . -Dave



Still waiting, but not holding my breath . . .

On Sun, 1 Aug 2004 20:01:56 -0400, "Dave C." wrote:


Still waiting, but not holding my breath . . .


I already told you, the internet is rife with VIA horror stories. Now
be a smart boy and go do your own homework.

maggot wrote:

On Sun, 1 Aug 2004 20:01:56 -0400, "Dave C." wrote:

Still waiting, but not holding my breath . . .


I already told you, the internet is rife with VIA horror stories. Now
be a smart boy and go do your own homework.

I find that I sometimes get a lot of stick for choosing the 'safe' choices such
as e.g. Intel cpu and chip set. However, this is not a comment on AMD and others
which may work equally well, it is just that a choice has to be made, and since
I was spending my own scarce money, I didn't want any hassle and just want it
to work. It may seem unfair, but life is harder for newcomers.

"Dennis E Strausser Jr" wrote in message
...
"Johannes H Andersen" wrote
in message
news:410AF477.32FAE761@nsuvuooiaiosizefitterwiuove swernuaz.com...


JK wrote:

The dual channel of the P4 is relatively slow though since the
memory controller is not on the chip. Look at the actual benchmarks
comparing the two. The article has benchmarks for both socket
754 and socket 939 Athlon 64 chips.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...spx?i=2065&p=1

So?

The dual channel memory 2xDDR400 for the P4 matches the fsb = 800 MHz,
this is the optimal situation.
The P4 is not 800 fsb, it's 200
It works something like the Athlon Xp, but does it twice.
To better explain this, here's an email I got from AMD

Hello Dennis,

Thank you for contacting AMD's Technical Service Center.

The Athlon XP has a Front Side Bus (FSB) that operates at either 266,
333, or 400Mhz. While the physical signal is 133, 166, or 200Mhz, data
is transferred on both the rising and falling edges of the clock
signal. This effectively doubles the data throughput. This is similar
to the operation of DDR memory and 2X AGP. Motherboards that support a
400, 333, 266, and 200MHz front-side bus (FSB) will typically have a
factory-default FSB setting of 200MHz (100MHz system clock) to protect
200MHz FSB processors from accidentally being overclocked. If an Athlon
XP processor, which supports a 400, 333 or 266MHz FSB, is installed on
a motherboard that is configured to operate the FSB at 200MHz, it will
operate at a lower frequency. This is a result of the processor's
multiplier. The function of the multiplier is to multiply the bus
frequency to derive the processor operating frequency.

The actual setting of the FSB may be controlled by the motherboard BIOS
or by a hardware jumper on the motherboard itself. Please consult your
motherboard manufacturer directly to determine how to correctly set the
FSB for your motherboard.

Hope this helps. If you have any other questions, please feel free to
contact me.

Regards,
Jesus
Customer Support Analyst
AMD TSC


We welcome your feedback and suggestions to help us improve our
services to you. To provide this information to us, we ask that you
please click on this link, or copy/paste into your browser, and
complete our short survey. Thanks, in advance, for your comments. Click
here (link

http://asksurvey.amd.com/servicesoft...@comc ast.net).


P.S. Please visit our online technical support tools, Ask AMD
(http://ask.amd.com) and our Processor Support Forums
(http://forums.amd.com). Ask AMD is our online knowledgebase that
contains many solutions to common questions. Our Processor Support
Forums are an online community where users can assist each other with
many different issues. There's a good chance these tools can help
answer your next question!


Original Message Follows:
------------------------


Form Message

Processor Type: Athlon XP
Escalated From: startup
Processor Model: 2200+
Knowledge Base: Processor
Email Address:
Full Name: Dennis E Strausser Jr
Message Body: (FSB) & Bus Speed. If a CPU has a FSB of 133, that would
mean the Bus Speed is 266? So like My 2200+ I have is 266 Bus Speed, and
133 (FSB)? And a 2800+ would be 166 FSB (166.5)? What I need is a link
if I'm right, if I'm wrong, I still want that link. I was trying to tell
some1 that I thought that's the way it works, and he said I'm wrong. So
I'm sure you guys can tell me, after all, they are your CPU's 2200+?
2600 @ 2.17 GHz,,, But you didn't need to know I'm Overclocking one of
your CPU's. Denny. :-)
Subject: FSB & Bus Speed
User Type: Reseller/System Builder
Knowledge Job Ticket: 0000000000169818213:5486
Knowledge Session Log URL:
http://139.95.253.213:80/SRVS/CGI-BI...g,e=0000000000
169818213,K=5486
Location: USA/Canada

What this all means?
I'll break it down.
the rising and falling edges of the clock
signal are still working for the most part, the same way as an amd.
But.
200 x 200 rising and falling edges of the clock signal.
200 x 200 rising and falling edges of the clock signal.
Don't take my word for it, this is just a guess.
But it does seem like a good guess to say that's how it's Hyperthreading
works.
Back when it was just Hyperpipline, I think it helped to keep the cpu
running smooth.
And keep the bottle neck as low as possible.

If anyone has more input on this, or if I'm wrong, correct me.
thx..
Denny. :-)

Hmmm, good questions.

I have some that can be added. To get the 800MHZ data rate do you need 4
memory DIMMs (sticks) or can it work with only two standard ones?

Dave

Dave wrote:

"Dennis E Strausser Jr" wrote in message
...
"Johannes H Andersen" wrote
in message
news:410AF477.32FAE761@nsuvuooiaiosizefitterwiuove swernuaz.com...


JK wrote:

The dual channel of the P4 is relatively slow though since the
memory controller is not on the chip. Look at the actual benchmarks
comparing the two. The article has benchmarks for both socket
754 and socket 939 Athlon 64 chips.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...spx?i=2065&p=1

So?

The dual channel memory 2xDDR400 for the P4 matches the fsb = 800 MHz,
this is the optimal situation.
The P4 is not 800 fsb, it's 200
It works something like the Athlon Xp, but does it twice.
To better explain this, here's an email I got from AMD

Hello Dennis,

Thank you for contacting AMD's Technical Service Center.

The Athlon XP has a Front Side Bus (FSB) that operates at either 266,
333, or 400Mhz. While the physical signal is 133, 166, or 200Mhz, data
is transferred on both the rising and falling edges of the clock
signal. This effectively doubles the data throughput. This is similar
to the operation of DDR memory and 2X AGP. Motherboards that support a
400, 333, 266, and 200MHz front-side bus (FSB) will typically have a
factory-default FSB setting of 200MHz (100MHz system clock) to protect
200MHz FSB processors from accidentally being overclocked. If an Athlon
XP processor, which supports a 400, 333 or 266MHz FSB, is installed on
a motherboard that is configured to operate the FSB at 200MHz, it will
operate at a lower frequency. This is a result of the processor's
multiplier. The function of the multiplier is to multiply the bus
frequency to derive the processor operating frequency.

The actual setting of the FSB may be controlled by the motherboard BIOS
or by a hardware jumper on the motherboard itself. Please consult your
motherboard manufacturer directly to determine how to correctly set the
FSB for your motherboard.

Hope this helps. If you have any other questions, please feel free to
contact me.

Regards,
Jesus
Customer Support Analyst
AMD TSC


We welcome your feedback and suggestions to help us improve our
services to you. To provide this information to us, we ask that you
please click on this link, or copy/paste into your browser, and
complete our short survey. Thanks, in advance, for your comments. Click
here (link

http://asksurvey.amd.com/servicesoft...@comc ast.net).


P.S. Please visit our online technical support tools, Ask AMD
(http://ask.amd.com) and our Processor Support Forums
(http://forums.amd.com). Ask AMD is our online knowledgebase that
contains many solutions to common questions. Our Processor Support
Forums are an online community where users can assist each other with
many different issues. There's a good chance these tools can help
answer your next question!


Original Message Follows:
------------------------


Form Message

Processor Type: Athlon XP
Escalated From: startup
Processor Model: 2200+
Knowledge Base: Processor
Email Address:
Full Name: Dennis E Strausser Jr
Message Body: (FSB) & Bus Speed. If a CPU has a FSB of 133, that would
mean the Bus Speed is 266? So like My 2200+ I have is 266 Bus Speed, and
133 (FSB)? And a 2800+ would be 166 FSB (166.5)? What I need is a link
if I'm right, if I'm wrong, I still want that link. I was trying to tell
some1 that I thought that's the way it works, and he said I'm wrong. So
I'm sure you guys can tell me, after all, they are your CPU's 2200+?
2600 @ 2.17 GHz,,, But you didn't need to know I'm Overclocking one of
your CPU's. Denny. :-)
Subject: FSB & Bus Speed
User Type: Reseller/System Builder
Knowledge Job Ticket: 0000000000169818213:5486
Knowledge Session Log URL:
http://139.95.253.213:80/SRVS/CGI-BI...g,e=0000000000
169818213,K=5486
Location: USA/Canada

What this all means?
I'll break it down.
the rising and falling edges of the clock
signal are still working for the most part, the same way as an amd.
But.
200 x 200 rising and falling edges of the clock signal.
200 x 200 rising and falling edges of the clock signal.
Don't take my word for it, this is just a guess.
But it does seem like a good guess to say that's how it's Hyperthreading
works.
Back when it was just Hyperpipline, I think it helped to keep the cpu
running smooth.
And keep the bottle neck as low as possible.

If anyone has more input on this, or if I'm wrong, correct me.
thx..
Denny. :-)

Hmmm, good questions.

I have some that can be added. To get the 800MHZ data rate do you need 4
memory DIMMs (sticks) or can it work with only two standard ones?

Dave

Two standard ones, that is two DDR400. The DDR means Double Data Rate,
dual channel is on top of that, hence 800MHz transfer rate = 6400000000 bits/s.

"Johannes H Andersen" wrote
in message news:410E37F8.3FE1B60A@nsaeccueuesizefitterwruovwe swernuao.com...


Dave wrote:

"Dennis E Strausser Jr" wrote in message
...
"Johannes H Andersen"
wrote
in message
news:410AF477.32FAE761@nsuvuooiaiosizefitterwiuove swernuaz.com...


JK wrote:

The dual channel of the P4 is relatively slow though since the
memory controller is not on the chip. Look at the actual
benchmarks
comparing the two. The article has benchmarks for both socket
754 and socket 939 Athlon 64 chips.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...spx?i=2065&p=1

So?

The dual channel memory 2xDDR400 for the P4 matches the fsb = 800
MHz,
this is the optimal situation.
The P4 is not 800 fsb, it's 200
It works something like the Athlon Xp, but does it twice.
To better explain this, here's an email I got from AMD

Hello Dennis,

Thank you for contacting AMD's Technical Service Center.

The Athlon XP has a Front Side Bus (FSB) that operates at either 266,
333, or 400Mhz. While the physical signal is 133, 166, or 200Mhz, data
is transferred on both the rising and falling edges of the clock
signal. This effectively doubles the data throughput. This is similar
to the operation of DDR memory and 2X AGP. Motherboards that support a
400, 333, 266, and 200MHz front-side bus (FSB) will typically have a
factory-default FSB setting of 200MHz (100MHz system clock) to protect
200MHz FSB processors from accidentally being overclocked. If an
Athlon
XP processor, which supports a 400, 333 or 266MHz FSB, is installed on
a motherboard that is configured to operate the FSB at 200MHz, it will
operate at a lower frequency. This is a result of the processor's
multiplier. The function of the multiplier is to multiply the bus
frequency to derive the processor operating frequency.

The actual setting of the FSB may be controlled by the motherboard
BIOS
or by a hardware jumper on the motherboard itself. Please consult your
motherboard manufacturer directly to determine how to correctly set
the
FSB for your motherboard.

Hope this helps. If you have any other questions, please feel free to
contact me.

Regards,
Jesus
Customer Support Analyst
AMD TSC


We welcome your feedback and suggestions to help us improve our
services to you. To provide this information to us, we ask that you
please click on this link, or copy/paste into your browser, and
complete our short survey. Thanks, in advance, for your comments.
Click
here (link


http://asksurvey.amd.com/servicesoft...@comc ast.net).


P.S. Please visit our online technical support tools, Ask AMD
(http://ask.amd.com) and our Processor Support Forums
(http://forums.amd.com). Ask AMD is our online knowledgebase that
contains many solutions to common questions. Our Processor Support
Forums are an online community where users can assist each other with
many different issues. There's a good chance these tools can help
answer your next question!


Original Message Follows:
------------------------


Form Message

Processor Type: Athlon XP
Escalated From: startup
Processor Model: 2200+
Knowledge Base: Processor
Email Address:
Full Name: Dennis E Strausser Jr
Message Body: (FSB) & Bus Speed. If a CPU has a FSB of 133, that would
mean the Bus Speed is 266? So like My 2200+ I have is 266 Bus Speed,
and
133 (FSB)? And a 2800+ would be 166 FSB (166.5)? What I need is a link
if I'm right, if I'm wrong, I still want that link. I was trying to
tell
some1 that I thought that's the way it works, and he said I'm wrong.
So
I'm sure you guys can tell me, after all, they are your CPU's 2200+?
2600 @ 2.17 GHz,,, But you didn't need to know I'm Overclocking one of
your CPU's. Denny. :-)
Subject: FSB & Bus Speed
User Type: Reseller/System Builder
Knowledge Job Ticket: 0000000000169818213:5486
Knowledge Session Log URL:

http://139.95.253.213:80/SRVS/CGI-BI...g,e=0000000000
169818213,K=5486
Location: USA/Canada

What this all means?
I'll break it down.
the rising and falling edges of the clock
signal are still working for the most part, the same way as an amd.
But.
200 x 200 rising and falling edges of the clock signal.
200 x 200 rising and falling edges of the clock signal.
Don't take my word for it, this is just a guess.
But it does seem like a good guess to say that's how it's
Hyperthreading
works.
Back when it was just Hyperpipline, I think it helped to keep the cpu
running smooth.
And keep the bottle neck as low as possible.

If anyone has more input on this, or if I'm wrong, correct me.
thx..
Denny. :-)

Hmmm, good questions.

I have some that can be added. To get the 800MHZ data rate do you need
4
memory DIMMs (sticks) or can it work with only two standard ones?

Dave

Two standard ones, that is two DDR400. The DDR means Double Data Rate,
dual channel is on top of that, hence 800MHz transfer rate = 6400000000
bits/s.
Righ, ty.
If you use two, also make sure they are installed right.
What I mean is, don't just use dimm slots 1 & 2 Most boards will just give
you the ram you just installed.
Like 2 x 512 for 1Meg
Use dimm slots 1 & 3 or 2 & 4, if your board has 4
This gives dual channel mode.
Denny. :-)

"Dennis E Strausser Jr" wrote in message
...
"Johannes H Andersen" wrote
in message
news:410E37F8.3FE1B60A@nsaeccueuesizefitterwruovwe swernuao.com...


Dave wrote:

"Dennis E Strausser Jr" wrote in message
...
"Johannes H Andersen"
wrote
in message
news:410AF477.32FAE761@nsuvuooiaiosizefitterwiuove swernuaz.com...


JK wrote:

The dual channel of the P4 is relatively slow though since the
memory controller is not on the chip. Look at the actual
benchmarks
comparing the two. The article has benchmarks for both socket
754 and socket 939 Athlon 64 chips.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...spx?i=2065&p=1

So?

The dual channel memory 2xDDR400 for the P4 matches the fsb = 800
MHz,
this is the optimal situation.
The P4 is not 800 fsb, it's 200
It works something like the Athlon Xp, but does it twice.
To better explain this, here's an email I got from AMD

Hello Dennis,

Thank you for contacting AMD's Technical Service Center.

The Athlon XP has a Front Side Bus (FSB) that operates at either
266,
333, or 400Mhz. While the physical signal is 133, 166, or 200Mhz,
data
is transferred on both the rising and falling edges of the clock
signal. This effectively doubles the data throughput. This is
similar
to the operation of DDR memory and 2X AGP. Motherboards that support
a
400, 333, 266, and 200MHz front-side bus (FSB) will typically have a
factory-default FSB setting of 200MHz (100MHz system clock) to
protect
200MHz FSB processors from accidentally being overclocked. If an
Athlon
XP processor, which supports a 400, 333 or 266MHz FSB, is installed
on
a motherboard that is configured to operate the FSB at 200MHz, it
will
operate at a lower frequency. This is a result of the processor's
multiplier. The function of the multiplier is to multiply the bus
frequency to derive the processor operating frequency.

The actual setting of the FSB may be controlled by the motherboard
BIOS
or by a hardware jumper on the motherboard itself. Please consult
your
motherboard manufacturer directly to determine how to correctly set
the
FSB for your motherboard.

Hope this helps. If you have any other questions, please feel free
to
contact me.

Regards,
Jesus
Customer Support Analyst
AMD TSC


We welcome your feedback and suggestions to help us improve our
services to you. To provide this information to us, we ask that you
please click on this link, or copy/paste into your browser, and
complete our short survey. Thanks, in advance, for your comments.
Click
here (link



http://asksurvey.amd.com/servicesoft...@comc ast.net).


P.S. Please visit our online technical support tools, Ask AMD
(http://ask.amd.com) and our Processor Support Forums
(http://forums.amd.com). Ask AMD is our online knowledgebase that
contains many solutions to common questions. Our Processor Support
Forums are an online community where users can assist each other
with
many different issues. There's a good chance these tools can help
answer your next question!


Original Message Follows:
------------------------


Form Message

Processor Type: Athlon XP
Escalated From: startup
Processor Model: 2200+
Knowledge Base: Processor
Email Address:
Full Name: Dennis E Strausser Jr
Message Body: (FSB) & Bus Speed. If a CPU has a FSB of 133, that
would
mean the Bus Speed is 266? So like My 2200+ I have is 266 Bus Speed,
and
133 (FSB)? And a 2800+ would be 166 FSB (166.5)? What I need is a
link
if I'm right, if I'm wrong, I still want that link. I was trying to
tell
some1 that I thought that's the way it works, and he said I'm wrong.
So
I'm sure you guys can tell me, after all, they are your CPU's 2200+?
2600 @ 2.17 GHz,,, But you didn't need to know I'm Overclocking one
of
your CPU's. Denny. :-)
Subject: FSB & Bus Speed
User Type: Reseller/System Builder
Knowledge Job Ticket: 0000000000169818213:5486
Knowledge Session Log URL:

http://139.95.253.213:80/SRVS/CGI-BI...g,e=0000000000
169818213,K=5486
Location: USA/Canada

What this all means?
I'll break it down.
the rising and falling edges of the clock
signal are still working for the most part, the same way as an amd.
But.
200 x 200 rising and falling edges of the clock signal.
200 x 200 rising and falling edges of the clock signal.
Don't take my word for it, this is just a guess.
But it does seem like a good guess to say that's how it's
Hyperthreading
works.
Back when it was just Hyperpipline, I think it helped to keep the
cpu
running smooth.
And keep the bottle neck as low as possible.

If anyone has more input on this, or if I'm wrong, correct me.
thx..
Denny. :-)

Hmmm, good questions.

I have some that can be added. To get the 800MHZ data rate do you
need
4
memory DIMMs (sticks) or can it work with only two standard ones?

Dave

Two standard ones, that is two DDR400. The DDR means Double Data Rate,
dual channel is on top of that, hence 800MHz transfer rate = 6400000000
bits/s.
Righ, ty.
If you use two, also make sure they are installed right.
What I mean is, don't just use dimm slots 1 & 2 Most boards will just
give
you the ram you just installed.
Like 2 x 512 for 1Meg (1Gig) Oops....
Use dimm slots 1 & 3 or 2 & 4, if your board has 4
This gives dual channel mode.
Denny. :-)


In reply to myself,,,, Oops. 1Gig..
Denny. :-)