Nero UDF & UDF/ISO confusion

.. --------------------------------------
Mike Richter, were you born with
"Scam Artist" emblazoned on your face?
--------------------------------------
(Mike Richter, any Material Connection w/ Roxio?)

K2 wrote:
smh wrote:

Please note that Nero does not yet support Multisession UDF-CDs and
that therefore UDF or UDF-Bridge Sessions must be written on blank
CDs.

Just burned a couple of sessions in both CD-ROM (UDF) and CD-ROM
(UDF/ISO) without any problems - despite what Help says - and the files
were all readable. Are you using quality media?

For a few weeks I thought the same thing; multisessions seemed to work
fine. Then I noticed recent files were getting corrupted, even though
the burning seemed to go fine and they appeared intact from their size
and names. I'd give it more time if I were you. Be sure you actually
try to launch the files you've copied.

Sounds more like a bad burn rather than problems with file system. Try
quality media? Burn at slower speed? Burn in Mode 1 (for UDF/ISO)?

"K2" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 20:19:31 GMT, smh wrote:

Please note that Nero does not yet support Multisession UDF-CDs and
that therefore UDF or UDF-Bridge Sessions must be written on blank
CDs.

Just burned a couple of sessions in both CD-ROM (UDF) and CD-ROM
(UDF/ISO) without any problems - despite what Help says - and the files
were all readable. Are you using quality media?

For a few weeks I thought the same thing; multisessions seemed to work
fine. Then I noticed recent files were getting corrupted, even though
the burning seemed to go fine and they appeared intact from their size
and names. I'd give it more time if I were you. Be sure you actually
try to launch the files you've copied.

K2

Hi

Probably adding to the confusion here but where does *Mt Rainer* (don't
think I've used the correct term here?) fit into the picture? I thought this
was designed to improve the effectiveness of Packet Writing to CDRW's ?

Regards

BillL

In article ,
says...
I have tried various techniques of making an incremental backup CD-R
with Nero 5.5.10.54 using UDF and UDF/ISO formats. I mainly want to
backup digital camera photos as months go by, filling up one CD-R at a
time.


Like others have said, treat any packet writing format
as being only as reliable as the old 5.25" floppy discs
were. (As in... not very, but they were good enough to
sneaker-net stuff around.)

Since you're archiving digital photos, which I would
assume are of some sentimental value, you'll want to do
anything possible to not depend on a single piece of
media. And you should use quality CD-R media as well.
That means that every month, you should take the last
650MB worth of pictures that you've shot and burn them
to a new CD-R. So if you only shoot 200MB worth of
images per month, this scheme allows you to fit 3 months
of shots onto each CD-R. Since you're burning a new
disc every month, images will end up archived on 3 CD-
Rs.

You may also wish to add PAR2 recovery data using
QuickPar to your CD-Rs to fill up any remaining space.
That way, when the disc starts to go bad, you can repair
any damaged files up to the amount of recovery data that
you created.

Day-to-day backups of your images are better handled by
a 2nd hard drive and mirroring software like Second Copy
2000. (External firewire/USB drives work well too,
especially if you have older smaller hard drives that
can be put into an empty enclosure.)

In article ,
says...
On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 17:33:12 +0100, "Graham Mayor"
wrote:

Use ISO format multisession with Nero to ensure that your files are
preserved. This is the most robust of the data formats.

I assumed for some reason that UDF was superior for multisession work,
but I can see that the same options are in the "plain" ISO format.
I'll take your advice there.

InCD is flaky and generally considered less reliable than Direct CD. Unless
they have changed it recently, InCD will not work with CDR discs.

InCD is still for CD-RWs only. It worked fine up until 450-500 MB for
several rotating Memorex CD-RWs I was using. Then, they suddenly
became unreadable. I had trusted InCD until that point, but I don't
know if it was just a brand problem. I recently bought some TDK CD-RWs
but the initial InCD formatting process stalled on a test disc after
45 minutes. Not sure what the cause is.

I would not recommend the use of CDRW discs for archival purposes - or, come
to that, for any purpose that is not involved with testing.

I've always followed that rule, too.

K2


Until purchasing a DVDRW player, and really doing a lot fo research
about packet writing (InCD or Roxios Direct CD or Stomp's Intsntat
CD/DVD, I though packet writing was great!

However, it trouble med that people on this board, a lot more
knoweledgeable than I, were very opposed to it and didn't trust the
integrity of the data.

I got Nero and stared making ISO disks. They are always readabler -
everytime I trty it somehwere else, they too can read it.

When you install an ISO disk i the drive, it finds its files
approximately 3 times as fast as any udf file I've ever used. The
experience of the immediate usability of the ISO disk, and the loss by
corruption on another disk on which packet writing was used, has
convinced me to try to avoid packet writing.

Louise

Louise

.. --------------------------------------
Mike Richter, were you born with
"Scam Artist" emblazoned on your face?
--------------------------------------
(Mike Richter, any Material Connection w/ Roxio?)

http://groups.google.com/groups?selm...mindspring.com
(Messages 10, 12 -- 34, 54 -- 69)

( No pipsqueaks have been able to prove ANY of the above is a libel )
( -- despite Mikey's supposed to have proof of misquotes!!! )


Bill L wrote:

Probably adding to the confusion here but where does *Mt Rainer* (don't
think I've used the correct term here?) fit into the picture? I thought this
was designed to improve the effectiveness of Packet Writing to CDRW's ?

Info on MRW may indirectly answer your questions:

http://www.mt-rainier.org/
http://www.licensing.philips.com/inf...uments805.html
http://www.licensing.philips.com/inf...uments102.html
http://www.licensing.philips.com/information/mtr/ew/

http://www.users.on.net/parker/mt_ra...mat_cd-mrw.htm

Bill L wrote:
Probably adding to the confusion here but where does *Mt Rainer*
(don't think I've used the correct term here?) fit into the picture?
I thought this was designed to improve the effectiveness of Packet
Writing to CDRW's ?

Regards

BillL

It doesn't change anything other than allowing the formatting of the disc on
the fly.

--

Graham Mayor

Graham Mayor Mon, 19 Apr 2004 08:05:24 +0100
wrote ...

Bill L wrote:
Probably adding to the confusion here but where does *Mt Rainer*
(don't think I've used the correct term here?) fit into the picture?
I thought this was designed to improve the effectiveness of Packet
Writing to CDRW's ?


It doesn't change anything other than allowing the formatting of the disc on
the fly.


It has much less "data quantum" to be written.
I think 2 or 4 kB instead of 32KB.
Then CD can withstand? more writes.
And error managing is made by drive/firmware, not software drivers.

--
"Libor the Wanderer"
Sorry for my english in case of such troubles.
As dialup user I am sorry for late response.
ForPrivateResponseRemoveDelAndThisFromAboveAddress .

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 11:48:50 -0400, Toshi1873
wrote:

In article ,
says...
I have tried various techniques of making an incremental backup CD-R
with Nero 5.5.10.54 using UDF and UDF/ISO formats. I mainly want to
backup digital camera photos as months go by, filling up one CD-R at a
time.


Like others have said, treat any packet writing format
as being only as reliable as the old 5.25" floppy discs
were. (As in... not very, but they were good enough to
sneaker-net stuff around.)

Well, I had good luck with DirectCD on CD-Rs for a few years, then I
switched to Windows XP and Nero at the same time. I couldn't tell you
if DirectCD is better than InCD, but that's how it goes.

As someone else suggested, I've tried regular ISO CD-Rs (instead of
UDF/ISO) with multisessions and have had no problems so far. I'm
wondering if there's a limit to the number of sessions you can do per
disc?

Since you're archiving digital photos, which I would
assume are of some sentimental value, you'll want to do
anything possible to not depend on a single piece of
media. And you should use quality CD-R media as well.
That means that every month, you should take the last
650MB worth of pictures that you've shot and burn them
to a new CD-R. So if you only shoot 200MB worth of
images per month, this scheme allows you to fit 3 months
of shots onto each CD-R. Since you're burning a new
disc every month, images will end up archived on 3 CD-
Rs.

I read conflicting reports about CD-R life, ranging from 3 years to
100 years, so I'm not sure what to believe. I store them in total
darkness and I try to use known brands like Imation and TDK. Memorex
CD-RWs are the only media I've had obvious problems with.

You may also wish to add PAR2 recovery data using
QuickPar to your CD-Rs to fill up any remaining space.
That way, when the disc starts to go bad, you can repair
any damaged files up to the amount of recovery data that
you created.

I've never heard of PAR2 - I'll check it out. I had been assuming that
an app like ISOBuster could recover most data from any problem CD-R,
but I guess that's only if critical parts of a file stay intact.

K2

On Wed, 21 Apr 2004 01:49:25 GMT, K2 wrote:

As someone else suggested, I've tried regular ISO CD-Rs (instead of
UDF/ISO) with multisessions and have had no problems so far. I'm
wondering if there's a limit to the number of sessions you can do per
disc?


99, according to some colored book (I don't remember which one).


Pierre Duhem
Logiciels & Services Duhem, Paris, France
http://www.macdisk.com

Please remove the X from the address to answer through email

K2 wrote:


For a few weeks I thought the same thing; multisessions seemed to work
fine. Then I noticed recent files were getting corrupted, even though
the burning seemed to go fine and they appeared intact from their size
and names. I'd give it more time if I were you. Be sure you actually
try to launch the files you've copied.

If you are using a UDF file system in Nero, you are *not* I think
using a packet written format, as in InCD (which then implements a UDF
file system on that). The terms are often confused but are not
interchangeable. So were you doing this in Nero itself - or in InCD



--
Alex Nichol
Bournemouth, U.K.