isolating new clone drive for 1st bootup

I assume you mean 0.20.8 and 0.20.9 (the latest 2 beta versions).
xxClone sounds like it'll be a good utility after a little more
polishing. Thanks for the info.

*TimDaniels*


"Shailesh Humbad" replied:
Yes, I reported the problems to them. The versions I had used were
2.08 and 2.09.

Thanks for the elaboration on xxClone. I hope you reported
the problems to xxClone so they could squash those bugs. What
version were you using?

"Rod Speed" wrote:

USB clearly connects power and ground at the same time,

Nope, you're ignoring the metal surround connection.

You're right, I did forget about that.

as does Compact PCI (cPCI).

Wrong again. You're mangling the story completely with OV there.

I looked again, and there are indeed some little feelers that
ground-out the boards as they slide into the chassis. Must be for
static dissipation...

"Timothy Daniels" wrote:

"chrisv" wrote:
chrisv wrote:

"Timothy Daniels" wrote:

My question really hinges on the effect of unpowered
devices connected in various combinations and configurations
to a 2-device IDE cable. What would happen if the Master
HD at the end of a cable were unpowered while the Slave
were powered?

THAT is what I don't think will work. Rod says it will, and
maybe it will, for some controller/HD combinations. But it's
quite hokey to do that, even if you get away with it.

If the Slave were unpowered and the Master
powered? If Master/Slave positions were reversed? Etc.,
etc.

I should have noted that switched master and slave around is
irrelevant to this situation.


As I pointed out in a response to Rod Speed, I meant the
devices at the middle connector and end connector, whatever
their jumpering. That is, would a dead device at the middle impair
the signaling for the end device, and would a dead device at the
end impair signaling for the middle device?

Obviously irrelevant to the point I was making. You must not be
listening to what I've said.

"chrisv" weaseled on a long thread:
Obviously irrelevant to the point I was making. You must not be
listening to what I've said.


What was "the point you were making"?

*TimDaniels*

Timothy Daniels wrote in
message ...
Timothy Daniels asked

BTW, does is matter a whit if there are 2 devices
(e.g. HDs) on a cable and the device jumpered "Master"
is at the mid connector and the device jumpered "Slave"
were at the end connector? I have been assuming that
there is no difference other than which device will default
to being the boot device. Is that correct?

Yes, it apparently is. I've just done some experimenting
with switching 2 HDs on the same IDE cable between
being Master and Slave, and it doesn't affect the cloning,
nor does it affect boot capability. But it does affect the
default BIOS boot sequence. For 2 HDs on the same
cable, the default BIOS boot sequence has the Master
HD at a higher priority than the Slave HD. So unless one
adjusts the BIOS boot sequence, the Master HD will
boot (if it's bootable).

Thats just whether its master or slave, not which connector is used.

"Timothy Daniels" wrote in message news
"Rod Speed" wrote:
The problem is potentially with an unpowered drive physically
connected to the ribbon cable...

I guess "potentially" is the critical word, because I just
cloned my primary HD (containing WinXP Pro) to my
secondary HD, and then I simply unplugged the power
cable that ran to the primary HD, leaving the data (ribbon)
cable still connected to it. Without resetting the BIOS' boot
sequence, I restarted the PC. Since the BIOS found only
the secondary HD, it booted from it, and the clone OS was
born, and I was able to surf, get mail, etc. with it. Then I
reconnected the primary HD, and thereafter, I could choose
which OS to boot by adjusting the boot sequence in the
BIOS. So, at least for Maxtor DiamonMax Plus 9 HDs
used with a SIIG IDE controller card, it's OK to use simple
power removal to "hide" a drive from the system.

That simple test doesnt prove that it will work reliably.

chrisv wrote in message
...
Rod Speed wrote

USB clearly connects power and ground at the same time,

Nope, you're ignoring the metal surround connection.

You're right, I did forget about that.

as does Compact PCI (cPCI).

Wrong again. You're mangling the story completely with OV there.

I looked again, and there are indeed some little
feelers that ground-out the boards as they slide
into the chassis. Must be for static dissipation...

Nope, to ensure that OV connects first on insertion
and last on removal, just like with USB.

Thats easier to see with SATA.

Timothy Daniels wrote in
message ...
Rod Speed wrote
Timothy Daniels wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Timothy Daniels wrote:

as a search of Groups.Google.com will show.

It isnt even feasible to search for its use there as a transitive verb.

Wrong.

Right.

Just search for its use, as in "fang you", "fang him",
"fang them", "got fanged", "were fanged", etc.,

Not feasible, child.

You just don't know how.

Just not feasible, because there as so many possibilitys
that need to be included to hope to find them all.

"Fang you", for instance, is easy to find,

Pity its a small subset of all possible uses as a transitive verb.

and when used, it is usually a pun on "Thank you".

Wrong again.

The rest are rare because, as I said, "fang" as
a verb is almost not used in American English.

You originally claimed it aint used at all, child.

You are just plain wrong. It even appears in Webster.

Keep desperately digging. You'll be out in china any day now, child.

"Rod Speed" wrote:
Timothy Daniels reported:
Timothy Daniels asked

BTW, does is matter a whit if there are 2 devices
(e.g. HDs) on a cable and the device jumpered "Master"
is at the mid connector and the device jumpered "Slave"
were at the end connector? I have been assuming that
there is no difference other than which device will default
to being the boot device. Is that correct?

Yes, it apparently is. I've just done some experimenting
with switching 2 HDs on the same IDE cable between
being Master and Slave, and it doesn't affect the cloning,
nor does it affect boot capability. But it does affect the
default BIOS boot sequence. For 2 HDs on the same
cable, the default BIOS boot sequence has the Master
HD at a higher priority than the Slave HD. So unless one
adjusts the BIOS boot sequence, the Master HD will
boot (if it's bootable).

Thats just whether its master or slave, not which connector is used.


Yes, that's what I said - the default boot sequence for
devices on the same ribbon cable has the device jumpered
as Master at a boot priority higher than that for the Slave,
regardless of location on the cable. That is, if the two devices
are bootable, the one jumpered as Master will be booted
unless the BIOS's boot sequence is manually altered.

*TimDaniels*

"Timothy Daniels" wrote:

"chrisv" weaseled on a long thread:
Obviously irrelevant to the point I was making. You must not be
listening to what I've said.


What was "the point you were making"?

From my first post to this thread:

"Having un-powered electronics connected to your bus is generally a
sure-fire way to drag the bus down to nothing."