HALF FILLED cartridges in new printers?

In article ,
Flasherly wrote:
On Aug 25, 12:35 pm, "007" wrote:
Is it a true that all new printers come with half filled cartridges?

My Samsung laser cartridge part# is specified for (approx. 1/3) lesser
yield, although apart from toner volume I couldn't say how many units,
if at all, beyond that would be assembled with parts (the blade and
optics) capable of not providing a much longer duty cycle.

After market refillers - at least here in the UK seem
to rely upon this. Remanufactured cartridges may be
a different matter ..as parts are often replaced with
heavier components, designed for a much longer life.

Then again, the cost of replacement toner - as parts
and new printers - seems to be around four to eight
times the cost of the identical machines and other
consummablesin North America. (Why such a price
difference, I've no idea)...

They do
have a fuse intended to blow at a specified "count" -- I haven't
figured how that works (apart the workaround, which is simply to
replace).

Although I'm not party to the full rulings etc, HP have
recently appeared in Court (?EU/UK?) regarding their self
imposed 'limits' on the use and replacement of cartridges.

For those printers that need it, they now appear to have
a counter-bypass system designed to kick in if the User
requests it through the firmware..

A laser site in U.K. even provides instructions/materials
for burning a hole (apparently -some- cartridges are self-contained
and show no intent of being refilled).

I think, although I have no personal experience, that most
cartridges may possibly be re-filled by drilling a hole into
the body exactly as you realistically suggest, Flasherly! )

It's just that should any toner 'escape' then, like an
Espresso or Turkish ground coffee, the tiny microscopic
granules will coat everything in the vicinity for months
to come ..including the refiller's hands, face and best
dress/suit (tuxedo??) .. )

(Come to think of it, could it be another use for the
ubiquitously icky Starbuck's Carbonised Coffee Roast)?! )

Bill ZFC

Bill ZFC

--
Adoption InterLink UK with -=- http://www.billsimpson.com/
Domain Host Orpheus Internet -=- http://www.orpheusinternet.co.uk/

No, in fact due to bad publicity and several law suits and class
actions, most inkjet printers today come with full size cartridges which
are filled.

In some cases, the printer will come with an "economy" cartridge which
is indeed smaller that the "standard" or "jumbo" versions, but that
cartridge will sometime be available to purchases as a lower cost
alternative to the larger cartridge. In general those smaller
cartridges are a poor investment.

With laser printers, and particularly color ones, the installed
cartridges often are 50% or less of the normally sold replacement
product. In some cases, you can just refill them, other kinds which
require a new or replacement microchip, may not work at all even if
refilled, or may run at a much lower speed to punish you for refilling.

Art

If you are interested in issues surrounding e-waste,
I invite you to enter the discussion at my blog:

http://e-trashtalk.spaces.live.com/

007 wrote:
Is it a true that all new printers come with half filled cartridges?

On Aug 26, 3:56 am, "Bill (Adopt)" wrote:

After market refillers - at least here in the UK seem
to rely upon this. Remanufactured cartridges may be
a different matter ..as parts are often replaced with
heavier components, designed for a much longer life.

Then again, the cost of replacement toner - as parts
and new printers - seems to be around four to eight
times the cost of the identical machines and other
consummablesin North America. (Why such a price
difference, I've no idea)...

I'm running into somewhat large fonts on the wall (come to think of
it, my eyes aren't up to 8pt. either these days). What's evident is a
wide discrepancy for quality, especially among lower and competitive
OEM suppliers. Optic drums and wiper blades may receive a cursory
inspection for immediate defects, unless conspicuously present, which
are then reassembled into used-parts (re-manufactured) after only
summary blowing out cartridges and, possibly, an initial test run.
When buying cartridges I'd want to know something of the vendor's
reputation and exposure, along with a good warranty, and assurances of
quality control over replacement of new if not as-new parts. All
things considered, perhaps for a few vendors that can stand good to
providing savings without undue compromise.

I found the same thing, that higher discrepency for pricing, when
looking toner bottles. I'd find out the seller's backing, advertising
from Amazon or Ebay, and go to their webshops, where the same
discounted items often had a substantial mark-up.

They do
have a fuse intended to blow at a specified "count" -- I haven't
figured how that works (apart the workaround, which is simply to
replace).

Although I'm not party to the full rulings etc, HP have
recently appeared in Court (?EU/UK?) regarding their self
imposed 'limits' on the use and replacement of cartridges.

For those printers that need it, they now appear to have
a counter-bypass system designed to kick in if the User
requests it through the firmware..

Yes - there's a broader inclusion in U.S. law effecting something
along the same, that a manufacturer can not prohibit the use of after-
market consumables through the use of "coded" cartridges to the
exclusion of all others. I remember coming here years ago -- running
into a factory representative type and problems with an HP540 model. I
was arguing the cost of ink, and he basically told me -- you don't
like it, that's tough: "It's the cost that the market will bear that
determine our direction." Fine. I've never bought an ink jet since
(back then an HP540 started at $500US, and dropped to $200, which I
paid).

Of course b&w text books aren't really bothersome -- and in pinch I
will revert back to my 24-pin dotmatrix "bangers". Damn straight, I
will.


A laser site in U.K. even provides instructions/materials
for burning a hole (apparently -some- cartridges are self-contained
and show no intent of being refilled).

I think, although I have no personal experience, that most
cartridges may possibly be re-filled by drilling a hole into
the body exactly as you realistically suggest, Flasherly! )

It's just that should any toner 'escape' then, like an
Espresso or Turkish ground coffee, the tiny microscopic
granules will coat everything in the vicinity for months
to come ..including the refiller's hands, face and best
dress/suit (tuxedo??) .. )

(Come to think of it, could it be another use for the
ubiquitously icky Starbuck's Carbonised Coffee Roast)?! )

The holes can not be drilled, but have to be melted carefully through
with no residual whatsoever. The tiniest pieces of plastic each would
render a line down every subsequent page printed off the optical
drum. Past a violent fiasco with a devious vendor that substituted an
Ascaso I2's plastic, charging me for the brass I1's innards -- which
on principle I unequivocally disputed and refused to pay (wasn't as
straightforward an affair as expected, no, not even nearly when a
vendor proceeds to drag his feet) -- though all in all it does
appear, thankfully, up to "snuff", promising many more espresso years
of use.

The U.K. site (nice sort of personable chap with informative opinions)
said his clients would refill cartridges only partly, half or less a
toner charge. Less toner in expectation of being within two or three
refills (though not exclusively) before print quality indicates a new
change of cartridge, for less unused toner tossed in that event. This
Samsung apprently uses something of an extra-fine granularity, apart
from toner which certainly does mist into the air readily enough.
Taking one down bare, blowing it out completely clean of residual
"spoilt" toner with compressed air, refilling and getting everything
rightly settled (the toner acts as lubricant to the wiper blade and
will ruin the optical if not correctly settled), to say the least,
could be daunting. I do have a 60gal. air compressor, but would as
soon not be peer through a sooted face. Perhaps illustrating the point
he made of his clients partly refilling and tossing when wear/spoilage
accumulates (inexpensive lasers, such as mine, don't have a spoilage
collection area -- the wiper simply wipes any spent drum toner back
into the bulk toner area of the cartridge).

On Aug 25, 9:35*am, "007" wrote:
Is it a true that all new printers come with half filled cartridges?

No, my printer came with half empty cartridges.

On Aug 25, 9:35*am, "007" wrote:
Is it a true that all new printers come with half filled cartridges?

Nope, my printer came with half empty print cartridges. Just like my
parents......Mommy measekite and Father Frank both have half empty
heads.

On Wed, 27 Aug 2008 23:20:59 -0700 (PDT), wrote
in
:

On Aug 25, 9:35*am, "007" wrote:
Is it a true that all new printers come with half filled cartridges?

Nope, my printer came with half empty print cartridges. Just like my
parents......Mommy measekite and Father Frank both have half empty
heads.

But one day Mummy got a refill from Daddy and you squirted out of the
nozzles and congealed on the platen. That was the neighbourhood buggered.

--
- Nic.

wrote:
On Aug 25, 9:35 am, "007" wrote:

Is it a true that all new printers come with half filled cartridges?


No, my printer came with half empty cartridges.


I bet the same is true of DanS.

I have been doing some research in this area, and the results vary.
Most inkjet printer cartridges tend to be full, although some companies
do offer an economy cartridge that they also offer at retail, but is
never a good value to buy.

Laser is a mixed bag. I have been researching color laser printers, and
often the low end smaller models use starter cartridges. Often a better
value purchase is to buy a model that does have the full cartridges.
Also, look carefully for yield numbers, even a full cartridge isn't much
help if the yield is very low on the cartridge when full.


As an example, HP offers a number of color laser printers. One line up
(being discontinued while we speak) is the 1600, 2600 and 3600 printers.


The 1600 model come with half full starter cartridge, which are for 1000
prints at 5% per color.

The 2600n has almost double the duty cycle, has networking and has
double the toner in each cartridge, and offers enough toner for about
4000 copies at 5%)

Finally, there is the 3600n, also networking, has 4 times as much
memory, extra paper try, is about double the speed, and comes with full
toner cartridges, which yield 4000 5% per color prints. That's 4x what
is offered with the low end 1600. Although prices on these are somewhat
"all over the map", the toner itself is worth about $400 plus per set of
four colors.

The prices on sale seems to have about $50-100 difference between each
of the three levels, but in each case, the toner amount doubled the
previous two levels.

It isn't that the toner is worth that much, that 3rd party aren't much
cheaper and often nearly as good, but most toner cartridges today also
require some type of chip for each cartridge to install it. That still
places the refill at nearly $200, so it is often worth looking at the
next up and research the toner cartridge yield.


Something to think about...

Art


If you are interested in issues surrounding e-waste,
I invite you to enter the discussion at my blog:

http://e-trashtalk.spaces.live.com/

wrote:
On Aug 25, 9:35 am, "007" wrote:
Is it a true that all new printers come with half filled cartridges?

No, my printer came with half empty cartridges.