Konica Minolta Magicolor 4600 DN - toner chip / booby trapped tonermechanism

Hi all,

I read he http://www.howtofixcomputers.com/for...ge-189933.html
that toner cartridges as well as waste toner box is/could be booby-
trapped (chipped) in some manner...

I just ran out of my first black toner cartridge - according to the
software popup printer utility. The printer stopped working/printing,
although I could see that there was no problem on the print-outs... So
I actually hoped I could trick the Konica Minolta Magicolor 4600 into
continuing until I replaced the toner cartridge myself (based on low
output print quality). Because the printer stopped working, I had to
replace my black toner powder even though there is more toner in the
cartridge.

Question:

1) Is it right, that there's no easy way to fool the printer into
continuing to use my toner cartridges until I feel that the quality is
too low?

2) Is it waste of my money to enable "economy mode" if the next/
current toner cartridge stops working again, even though I can clearly
see there are no output quality problems?

3) Or does the Konica Minolta Magicolor 4600 use some optical sensor
to measure the amount of toner powder left?

4) Does anyone have any experience with this type of products?
http://www.printer-reset.com/MagiCol...Chip-non-OEM_1


Please note that I don't believe it's a good idea to save money on non-
OEM toner refill powder (I tried that with an Epson laser printer),
however, I would like to get the most out of my OEM paid Konica
Minolta toner powder and I believe this kind of chip booby trapping is
ridiculous... What's your opinion?


Thanks!

On 16 Jun., 14:31, "printer newbie!" wrote:
Hi all,

I read hehttp://www.howtofixcomputers.com/for...-minolta-dl230...
that toner cartridges as well as waste toner box is/could be booby-
trapped (chipped) in some manner...

I just ran out of my first black toner cartridge - according to the
software popup printer utility. The printer stopped working/printing,
although I could see that there was no problem on the print-outs... So
I actually hoped I could trick the Konica Minolta Magicolor 4600 into
continuing until I replaced the toner cartridge myself (based on low
output print quality). Because the printer stopped working, I had to
replace my black toner powder even though there is more toner in the
cartridge.

Question:

1) Is it right, that there's no easy way to fool the printer into
continuing to use my toner cartridges until I feel that the quality is
too low?

Nobody has anything to say about this?

2) Is it waste of my money to enable "economy mode" if the next/
current toner cartridge stops working again, even though I can clearly
see there are no output quality problems?

Nobody has anything to say about this?

3) Or does the Konica Minolta Magicolor 4600 use some optical sensor
to measure the amount of toner powder left?

Nobody has anything to say about this?

4) Does anyone have any experience with this type of products?http://www.printer-reset.com/MagiCol...g-Magenta-Rese...

Nobody has anything to say about this?

?

I have lots I could say, particularly about Ronica Minolta as a company
and their attitude toward waste, and the business model of trying to
force people to replace cartridges unnecessarily.

I used to be very impressed with the output of Ronica Minolta Magiccolor
printers, and while I am still impressed with the quality of the prints
their printers can produce, after owning one of their black and white
laser printers and seeing the booby trapping they incorporate in their
machines and subsequently having a conversation with the vice president
of marketing for their printer division about that left me with no
desire to own or recommend their products again.

Basically, all printer manufacturers have gone to similar business
models, which is to sell you the printer and some minimal toner or ink
quantity to be able to use the printer, for a bit above cost, and then
wait with baited breath for them to run out of ink or toner, and then
gouge you for the replacement cartridges.

However, Ronica Minolta printers have particularly nasty methods. On my
black and white laser printer, when the cartridge reached a certain
level of empty, I began getting pop up warnings that it was running low
on toner and I should buy a new "Ronica Minolta" cartridge. When it did
finally run out of toner, it burned out a chip which then informed the
printer that I had a used up cartridge. When I refilled it (with Ronica
brand toner, BTW" the printer continued to complain the cartridge was
not an original, 0or what past its usage limits and should be replaced.
It required I wait extra time and then click on a manual print
acceptance, which wasted time.

However, the worst was what the burned out chip also did. Normally, the
printer would do a brief cleaning cycles after printer to clean off any
excess toner powder on the drum. In spite of not degrading of the
image, after I refilled the cartridge, instead of doing a brief cleaning
after each page, the printer now required a lengthy cleaning cycle.
Ronica Minolta claims tis is because their toner is particularly finely
ground and pure while 3rd party product may not be. While I doubt much
of that, the cleaning cycle does do two things, one, it really slows
down multiple copy printing or printing a series of pages together. And
two, this process helps to wear down the printer's photosensitive drum
at least twice as quickly, so you may need to replace your drum
cartridge as well.

The last straw for me was when I tried to explain to the V.P. at Ronica
Minolta about the environmental damage this business model causes due to
the waste it creates relative to refilling or other methods.

He told me he was an engineer and didn't believe global climate change
was real, or correct and that we could grow ourselves out of it.

So now I warn people about their business practices and their staff's
attitudes.

In my opinion, no matter what the quality of the output might have been,
owners of printer should have the right to refill, or otherwise
regenerate the printer as they wish, particularly once it is out of
warranty, and companies that believe they can force your consumer
patterns with chips and the like, IMHO should be ignored in this
marketplace.


Art Entlich


If you are interested in issues surrounding e-waste,
I invite you to enter the discussion at my blog:

http://e-trashtalk.spaces.live.com/

printer newbie! wrote:
On 16 Jun., 14:31, "printer newbie!" wrote:
Hi all,

I read hehttp://www.howtofixcomputers.com/for...-minolta-dl230...
that toner cartridges as well as waste toner box is/could be booby-
trapped (chipped) in some manner...

I just ran out of my first black toner cartridge - according to the
software popup printer utility. The printer stopped working/printing,
although I could see that there was no problem on the print-outs... So
I actually hoped I could trick the Konica Minolta Magicolor 4600 into
continuing until I replaced the toner cartridge myself (based on low
output print quality). Because the printer stopped working, I had to
replace my black toner powder even though there is more toner in the
cartridge.

Question:

1) Is it right, that there's no easy way to fool the printer into
continuing to use my toner cartridges until I feel that the quality is
too low?

Nobody has anything to say about this?

2) Is it waste of my money to enable "economy mode" if the next/
current toner cartridge stops working again, even though I can clearly
see there are no output quality problems?

Nobody has anything to say about this?

3) Or does the Konica Minolta Magicolor 4600 use some optical sensor
to measure the amount of toner powder left?

Nobody has anything to say about this?

4) Does anyone have any experience with this type of products?http://www.printer-reset.com/MagiCol...g-Magenta-Rese...

Nobody has anything to say about this?

?

On Jun 23, 11:56*am, Arthur Entlich wrote:
I have lots I could say, particularly about Ronica Minolta as a company
and their attitude toward waste, and the business model of trying to
force people to replace cartridges unnecessarily.

Ok, thank you for your comments. Seems like I just have to live with
it and there's nothing to do about it.

First off, it appears my spell checker got the best of me and changed
each use of Konica to Ronica... that was not intended.

You should speak to or research on line cartridge refillers. You may be
able to get them refilled, and some may offer or install the chip for
you (I think they sell for about $10 each).

Also, on some of the HP color lasers there is a setting you can change
so the cartridge will continue to function until it runs out (and
beyond). The factory default is to have the printer warn and shut down
when any of the toner cartridges goes low. It can then be set to
actually reorder from HP the needed cartridges.

This is supposed to be for networked printers where it is important that
the users are notified of a near empty cartridge before they might
remotely try to print hundreds of a document and then find out it is
out of cyan, or whatever.

I don't have easy access to the Konica Minolta user manuals, but you
might wish to call Minolta if you can''t find otherwise and ask if they
have a setting to shut off the early warning system on low cartridge
toner levels.

Art




If you are interested in issues surrounding e-waste,
I invite you to enter the discussion at my blog:

http://e-trashtalk.spaces.live.com/

printer newbie! wrote:
On Jun 23, 11:56 am, Arthur Entlich wrote:
I have lots I could say, particularly about Ronica Minolta as a company
and their attitude toward waste, and the business model of trying to
force people to replace cartridges unnecessarily.

Ok, thank you for your comments. Seems like I just have to live with
it and there's nothing to do about it.

On Jun 23, 3:38*pm, Arthur Entlich wrote:
First off, it appears my spell checker got the best of me and changed
each use of Konica to Ronica... that was not intended.

You should speak to or research on line cartridge refillers. *You may be
able to get them refilled, and some may offer or install the chip for
you (I think they sell for about $10 each).

It would be better if I could install the chip myself, but I'll google
around and perhaps ask some vendors...

Also, on some of the HP color lasers there is a setting you can change
so the cartridge will continue to function until it runs out (and
beyond). *The factory default is to have the printer warn and shut down
when any of the toner cartridges goes low. It can then be set to
actually reorder from HP the needed cartridges.

This is supposed to be for networked printers where it is important that
the users are notified of a near empty cartridge before they might
remotely try to print *hundreds of a document and then find out it is
out of cyan, or whatever.

I don't have easy access to the Konica Minolta user manuals, but you
might wish to call Minolta if you can''t find otherwise and ask if they
have a setting to shut off the early warning system on low cartridge
toner levels.

Thanks a lot. I just called Minolta and the support guy said that it
was "impossible" to continue printing after the chip said stop. Then
he said that he believe there was some extended warranty if I returned
my used toner cartridge to konica minolta http://cleanplanet.konicaminolta.eu.
Be he was not sure about this extended warranty. I just filled out
their questionaary, requesting a return postage paid stamp and filled
out a lot personal information, address, phone number, town, etc. I
think they log this info if I later come with a RMA-issue.

Art

If you are interested in issues surrounding e-waste,
* *I invite you to enter the discussion at my blog:

* * * *http://e-trashtalk.spaces.live.com/

Thanks, interesting link...

If you are interested in issues surrounding e-waste,
I invite you to enter the discussion at my blog:

http://e-trashtalk.spaces.live.com/

printer newbie! wrote:
On Jun 23, 3:38 pm, Arthur Entlich wrote:
First off, it appears my spell checker got the best of me and changed
each use of Konica to Ronica... that was not intended.

You should speak to or research on line cartridge refillers. You may be
able to get them refilled, and some may offer or install the chip for
you (I think they sell for about $10 each).

It would be better if I could install the chip myself, but I'll google
around and perhaps ask some vendors...


I just did a quick look... I can only find the K-M Magicolor 4650 DN, so
I don't know if that is the same as the 4600.

Here is one example of both kits and chips available. I am not
endorsing this company.

https://123refills.net/cic/eg/tonerp...color+ 4650DN

They seem to charge an extra $5 if you buy it with the toner refill, or
$10 separately. You need a different one for each color.


Also, on some of the HP color lasers there is a setting you can change
so the cartridge will continue to function until it runs out (and
beyond). The factory default is to have the printer warn and shut down
when any of the toner cartridges goes low. It can then be set to
actually reorder from HP the needed cartridges.

This is supposed to be for networked printers where it is important that
the users are notified of a near empty cartridge before they might
remotely try to print hundreds of a document and then find out it is
out of cyan, or whatever.

I don't have easy access to the Konica Minolta user manuals, but you
might wish to call Minolta if you can''t find otherwise and ask if they
have a setting to shut off the early warning system on low cartridge
toner levels.

Thanks a lot. I just called Minolta and the support guy said that it
was "impossible" to continue printing after the chip said stop. Then
he said that he believe there was some extended warranty if I returned
my used toner cartridge to konica minolta http://cleanplanet.konicaminolta.eu.
Be he was not sure about this extended warranty. I just filled out
their questionaary, requesting a return postage paid stamp and filled
out a lot personal information, address, phone number, town, etc. I
think they log this info if I later come with a RMA-issue.

I would not take the word of the K-M tech support person. Speak to an
independent cartridge refiller or a service depot that handles K-M
products. They often will reveal more than the manufacturer.

These chips usually are burned out by a circuit in the printer.
Usually, the printer does not actually know the exact amount of toner
used per print, so they often use either a print count or a crude
measurement of toner use per print. Very few read the toner cartridge
optically, although some do. Also, the manufacturer intentionally
over-estimates toner usage because they don;t want you running out
before the warnings show up, both because some client would be angry if
they ran out without a warning, and also the toner is pretty cheap and
they make a lot of money on selling you new cartridges. Also, some
toner cartridges recycle the excess toner left on the drum after the
transfer process to paper after each print and that would be difficult
to know and measure accurately.

Regarding refilling: Not all toners are created equally. Some are
finer and more pure or brighter than others. Some kits may include more
or less yield. The toner cartridges included with most new printers are
starter cartridges and not full, so you can usually refill with more
than they started with.

Lastly, the average toner use from which they determine yield is based
upon 5% coverage per color. That's quite low if you are doing anything
other than small fonts and text over about 60% of the page. A color
photo or graphic can use as much as 60-70% coverage per color, since
some colors are created by mixing of the 4 primaries, so yield can
rapidly go down by up to 10 times or even more of what they claim. In
other words a cartridge rated at 2000 copies may only give you 200 if
you are printing images or graphics that cover most of a page.

Still, refilling is the way to go to save massive costs. However, do
realize that the drums are not designed to last forever, and if they are
integrated as part of the toner cartridge, as most are in color
printers, you may need to replace the whole cartridge (with a new, 3rd
party or refurbished one) after 3-5 refills.

Art





If you are interested in issues surrounding e-waste,
I invite you to enter the discussion at my blog:

http://e-trashtalk.spaces.live.com/

Thanks, interesting link...

Just a quick PS:

I'm not sure exactly about the warranty K-M was speaking about.
Typically, what they offer is to take back your cartridges when they
read empty. Sometimes they will pay shipping, sometimes they will even
give you a coupon good for a small discount on your next cartridge
purchase (if you buy a OEM one). Personally, I would NEVER do this if
that is what they are offering you. The "real reason" behind this is
not because they are environmentally sensitive and trying to do the
right thing.

It is to keep the cartridges out of circulation by either yourself (to
refill) or to be sold to 3rd party refurbishers or refillers who then
fix them up and fill them and resell them back to you for a lot of
money. Most of the cartridge which people return to stores and the like
for which they get a pat on the back or a free package of paper, go on
to be resold to refurbishers. In some cases, the big box stores even
own the refurbishers.

When you send you cartridges back to the manufacturers, they either
destroy them (grind and melt them down, etc, to be made into something
else or new cartridges) or they refurbish them themselves and sell them
back to you as OEM cartridges at even more money than the 3rd party guys.

If you look at many toner cartridge boxes sold by the OEMs (Original
Equipment Manufacturers) you will see a statement which says: "Parts of
this cartridge may be reused or refurbished". They usually will warrant
them against defects like a "new" cartridge, but then again, so will
most 3rd party refurbishers. Oh, and by the way, you know that extra
toner still in the cartridge after it reads empty and won't print
anymore; that is usually screened and purified and put into other
cartridges and resold, so you end up buying back some of your own unused
toner!

In my opinion, the best thing is to learn how to refill your cartridges
(most are easy to do, or there are instructions offered by 3rd party
toner suppliers (some even sell kits with the necessary tools) and buy
the chips if yours has the type that burn out and prevent use afterward.

You *MAY* even find some 3rd party companies that sell resettable chips
which you can reuse over and over again, although they usually cost more.

Art

If you are interested in issues surrounding e-waste,
I invite you to enter the discussion at my blog:

http://e-trashtalk.spaces.live.com/

printer newbie! wrote:
On Jun 23, 3:38 pm, Arthur Entlich wrote:
First off, it appears my spell checker got the best of me and changed
each use of Konica to Ronica... that was not intended.

You should speak to or research on line cartridge refillers. You may be
able to get them refilled, and some may offer or install the chip for
you (I think they sell for about $10 each).

It would be better if I could install the chip myself, but I'll google
around and perhaps ask some vendors...

Also, on some of the HP color lasers there is a setting you can change
so the cartridge will continue to function until it runs out (and
beyond). The factory default is to have the printer warn and shut down
when any of the toner cartridges goes low. It can then be set to
actually reorder from HP the needed cartridges.

This is supposed to be for networked printers where it is important that
the users are notified of a near empty cartridge before they might
remotely try to print hundreds of a document and then find out it is
out of cyan, or whatever.

I don't have easy access to the Konica Minolta user manuals, but you
might wish to call Minolta if you can''t find otherwise and ask if they
have a setting to shut off the early warning system on low cartridge
toner levels.

Thanks a lot. I just called Minolta and the support guy said that it
was "impossible" to continue printing after the chip said stop. Then
he said that he believe there was some extended warranty if I returned
my used toner cartridge to konica minolta http://cleanplanet.konicaminolta.eu.
Be he was not sure about this extended warranty. I just filled out
their questionaary, requesting a return postage paid stamp and filled
out a lot personal information, address, phone number, town, etc. I
think they log this info if I later come with a RMA-issue.

Art

If you are interested in issues surrounding e-waste,
I invite you to enter the discussion at my blog:

http://e-trashtalk.spaces.live.com/

Thanks, interesting link...