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#1
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Is it safe to remove power from a SATA hard drive leaving data connectedto disable it?
The problem I'm trying to solve is that windows 10 upgrade to one hard drive messes up the boot sector of the other bootable drive. I've been opening the case and pulling the data cable. I need a way to EASILY switch off a hard drive so that it is completely inaccessible. I've been considering disconnecting +5V and +12V with a front panel switch leaving the data cable connected. I don't intend switching it hot. I'd rather not open the case and pull the cables or have to reconfigure the BIOS every time. Does the BIOS really disable the drive in hardware? Or just "make a recommendation" to the driver? Can removing power damage the SATA data interface of the motherboard or the hard drive? Or are both ends of the data interface protected against such? The same question applies to an eSATA drive dock that's not powered on. |
#2
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Is it safe to remove power from a SATA hard drive leaving dataconnected to disable it?
mike wrote:
The problem I'm trying to solve is that windows 10 upgrade to one hard drive messes up the boot sector of the other bootable drive. I've been opening the case and pulling the data cable. I need a way to EASILY switch off a hard drive so that it is completely inaccessible. I've been considering disconnecting +5V and +12V with a front panel switch leaving the data cable connected. I don't intend switching it hot. I'd rather not open the case and pull the cables or have to reconfigure the BIOS every time. Does the BIOS really disable the drive in hardware? Or just "make a recommendation" to the driver? Can removing power damage the SATA data interface of the motherboard or the hard drive? Or are both ends of the data interface protected against such? The same question applies to an eSATA drive dock that's not powered on. https://electronics.stackexchange.co...ial-interfaces Mobo Disk - loss of power RX+ --+--------------------------||--- TX+ | 10nF GND \ 100ohm TX+ \ | 10nF TX- \ RX- --+--------------------------||--- TX- GND \__ SATA RX+ / 7pin TX+ ---||--------------------------+-- RX+ RX- / 10nF | GND / 100ohm 10nF | TX- ---||--------------------------+-- RX- On a loss of power on the Disk end, the AC coupling provides DC isolation, removing the failsafe requirement for the pad design. The termination at the receiver, prevents reflections back to the transmitter, and should match the characteristic impedance of the red cable. https://datasheets.maximintegrated.c...s/MAX4951C.pdf "Input/Output Terminations Inputs and outputs are internally 50ohm terminated and must be AC-coupled to the SATA controller IC and SATA device for proper operation." "Ccl=10nF" ******* The power connector is the one that has "optional" functions. For example, you could tie a LED for activity blinks, to pin 11. But, nobody did. Pin 3 is "PWDIS", a function perfect for your application, but could only be relied upon, if the drive was compliant with SATA version 3.3 spec. And how would you figure that out ? Spec sheets with that level of detail, are hard to come by. Manufacturers won't give us a platter count, or admit publicly when a drive is shingled. What hope would we have of finding "PWDIS: Yes". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_ATA HTH, Paul |
#3
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Is it safe to remove power from a SATA hard drive leaving data connected to disable it?
On Sun, 06 May 2018 04:59:34 -0700, mike wrote:
The problem I'm trying to solve is that windows 10 upgrade to one hard drive messes up the boot sector of the other bootable drive. I've been opening the case and pulling the data cable. I need a way to EASILY switch off a hard drive so that it is completely inaccessible. I've been considering disconnecting +5V and +12V with a front panel switch leaving the data cable connected. I don't intend switching it hot. I'd rather not open the case and pull the cables or have to reconfigure the BIOS every time. Does the BIOS really disable the drive in hardware? Or just "make a recommendation" to the driver? Can removing power damage the SATA data interface of the motherboard or the hard drive? Or are both ends of the data interface protected against such? The same question applies to an eSATA drive dock that's not powered on. You may try a multi-OS boot arbitrator... http://btmgr.sourceforge.net/about.html You can boot, enter the arbitrator configuration, to hide drives;- FWIW, if judging from MS/W10 and a free handjob, perhaps not much. Easy .and. Good. There's probably a saying about that. The reason I'd rather not, rather never, ever have to open a case ever again, is simply because I don't and won't: I quit putting on the sides of cases ages ago;- sometimes I also take metal shears to drive bay case cages: works wonders for getting out drives, as I'm not especially prone to shredding my hands from resulting jagged edges. Hm, can't recall a conditional array for "grayed-out" drives, Windows displays, either for a BIOS or SmartBoot Manager "hidden-drive" configuration. I personally wouldn't count on a disabled safeguard condition, not to a hardened hacker, at least until I know, if ever, better. I would expect, some likelihood at least, an E-SATA dock is going to provide more protection: a failsafe condition would be nice, yes indeed, were plugs haphazardly yanked. It's not, though, that you're then replicating exactly a brown/black-out condition, which drives of course, with more or less risk of data corruption, otherwise have reasonably well to convey and withstand. Grab and Yank . . . me, no way. Not to underestimate my impatience factor, nor an aspect I haven't as well considered. Then again I'm not explicitly on regular Windows 10 update schedules, however that works;- it's also part of the Windows install regime since Windows 7: that MSFT will actively seek out to annihilate a boot methodology other than their own. I think you'll find whatever you want to find here... https://superuser.com/questions/9258...g-sata-hotplug |
#4
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solved Is it safe to remove power from a SATA hard drive leavingdata connected to disable it?
On 5/6/2018 9:00 AM, Paul wrote:
mike wrote: The problem I'm trying to solve is that windows 10 upgrade to one hard drive messes up the boot sector of the other bootable drive. I've been opening the case and pulling the data cable. I need a way to EASILY switch off a hard drive so that it is completely inaccessible. I've been considering disconnecting +5V and +12V with a front panel switch leaving the data cable connected. I don't intend switching it hot. I'd rather not open the case and pull the cables or have to reconfigure the BIOS every time. Does the BIOS really disable the drive in hardware? Or just "make a recommendation" to the driver? Can removing power damage the SATA data interface of the motherboard or the hard drive? Or are both ends of the data interface protected against such? The same question applies to an eSATA drive dock that's not powered on. https://electronics.stackexchange.co...ial-interfaces Mobo Disk - loss of power RX+ --+--------------------------||--- TX+ | 10nF GND \ 100ohm TX+ \ | 10nF TX- \ RX- --+--------------------------||--- TX- GND \__ SATA RX+ / 7pin TX+ ---||--------------------------+-- RX+ RX- / 10nF | GND / 100ohm 10nF | TX- ---||--------------------------+-- RX- On a loss of power on the Disk end, the AC coupling provides DC isolation, removing the failsafe requirement for the pad design. The termination at the receiver, prevents reflections back to the transmitter, and should match the characteristic impedance of the red cable. https://datasheets.maximintegrated.c...s/MAX4951C.pdf "Input/Output Terminations Inputs and outputs are internally 50ohm terminated and must be AC-coupled to the SATA controller IC and SATA device for proper operation." "Ccl=10nF" ******* The power connector is the one that has "optional" functions. For example, you could tie a LED for activity blinks, to pin 11. But, nobody did. Pin 3 is "PWDIS", a function perfect for your application, but could only be relied upon, if the drive was compliant with SATA version 3.3 spec. And how would you figure that out ? Spec sheets with that level of detail, are hard to come by. Manufacturers won't give us a platter count, or admit publicly when a drive is shingled. What hope would we have of finding "PWDIS: Yes". The WD drives have a jumper for power on in standby, but that doesn't keep the drive from booting. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_ATA HTH, Paul Thanks for the inputs. Most of the links were vague, but I did find what appeared to be an authoritative confirmation. Silly me, I should just have looked at the drive. The series caps are right there at the connector. Confirmed by a DVM, there doesn't seem to be anything there that could hurt the motherboard. I'm good to go. I'm curious. You seem to be everywhere providing detailed, trustworthy, information to many people on a wide range of topics. How do you find the time? |
#5
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solved Is it safe to remove power from a SATA hard driveleaving data connected to disable it?
mike wrote:
On 5/6/2018 9:00 AM, Paul wrote: mike wrote: The problem I'm trying to solve is that windows 10 upgrade to one hard drive messes up the boot sector of the other bootable drive. I've been opening the case and pulling the data cable. I need a way to EASILY switch off a hard drive so that it is completely inaccessible. I've been considering disconnecting +5V and +12V with a front panel switch leaving the data cable connected. I don't intend switching it hot. I'd rather not open the case and pull the cables or have to reconfigure the BIOS every time. Does the BIOS really disable the drive in hardware? Or just "make a recommendation" to the driver? Can removing power damage the SATA data interface of the motherboard or the hard drive? Or are both ends of the data interface protected against such? The same question applies to an eSATA drive dock that's not powered on. https://electronics.stackexchange.co...ial-interfaces Mobo Disk - loss of power RX+ --+--------------------------||--- TX+ | 10nF GND \ 100ohm TX+ \ | 10nF TX- \ RX- --+--------------------------||--- TX- GND \__ SATA RX+ / 7pin TX+ ---||--------------------------+-- RX+ RX- / 10nF | GND / 100ohm 10nF | TX- ---||--------------------------+-- RX- On a loss of power on the Disk end, the AC coupling provides DC isolation, removing the failsafe requirement for the pad design. The termination at the receiver, prevents reflections back to the transmitter, and should match the characteristic impedance of the red cable. https://datasheets.maximintegrated.c...s/MAX4951C.pdf "Input/Output Terminations Inputs and outputs are internally 50ohm terminated and must be AC-coupled to the SATA controller IC and SATA device for proper operation." "Ccl=10nF" ******* The power connector is the one that has "optional" functions. For example, you could tie a LED for activity blinks, to pin 11. But, nobody did. Pin 3 is "PWDIS", a function perfect for your application, but could only be relied upon, if the drive was compliant with SATA version 3.3 spec. And how would you figure that out ? Spec sheets with that level of detail, are hard to come by. Manufacturers won't give us a platter count, or admit publicly when a drive is shingled. What hope would we have of finding "PWDIS: Yes". The WD drives have a jumper for power on in standby, but that doesn't keep the drive from booting. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_ATA HTH, Paul Thanks for the inputs. Most of the links were vague, but I did find what appeared to be an authoritative confirmation. Silly me, I should just have looked at the drive. The series caps are right there at the connector. Confirmed by a DVM, there doesn't seem to be anything there that could hurt the motherboard. I'm good to go. I'm curious. You seem to be everywhere providing detailed, trustworthy, information to many people on a wide range of topics. How do you find the time? When you're retired, anything is possible. Paul |
#6
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Is it safe to remove power from a SATA hard drive leaving dataconnected to disable it?
On Sunday, May 6, 2018 at 5:00:51 AM UTC-7, mike wrote:
The problem I'm trying to solve is that windows 10 upgrade to one hard drive messes up the boot sector of the other bootable drive. I've been opening the case and pulling the data cable. I need a way to EASILY switch off a hard drive so that it is completely inaccessible. I've been considering disconnecting +5V and +12V with a front panel switch leaving the data cable connected. I don't intend switching it hot. I'd rather not open the case and pull the cables or have to reconfigure the BIOS every time. Does the BIOS really disable the drive in hardware? Or just "make a recommendation" to the driver? Can removing power damage the SATA data interface of the motherboard or the hard drive? Or are both ends of the data interface protected against such? The same question applies to an eSATA drive dock that's not powered on. Another problem of Windows 10. This problem arises from Windows 10 combining multi hard drive storage into one storage called "Onedrive cloud". I don't know what good is that sync file activity from hard drive and online file with one drive. Trying to setup Onedrive Cloud is what screwed up your hard drive. |
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