Reliable consumer level colour duplex printers.

Tony Toews [MVP] wrote:
Folks

I'm probably going to junk my vritually new HP laser printer as
described in my previous posting. The black cartridge is at 10% and
the colour cartridges at 34% so to heck with spending the money to
repair it.

What suggestions would you foilks have amongst the following options
conveniently available to me at a Staples? The criteria are consumer
level, colour, duplex.

Brother HL-4040CDN Colour Laser Printer $410

While I like the output from these, that's a PCL-only version. They
used to go on sale at Officemax for $200-$250 from time to time (maybe
without a duplexer). Not sure about supplies cost, but the toner tanks
seem pretty small.

Lexmark C543dn Colour Laser Printer $410

Years ago, I decided never to buy or recommend a Lexmark because of
their predatory pricing practices. So far, I see no reason to change
that.

Okidata C5650dn Colour Laser Printer $730

This is a winprinter. I know of one higher-end version that's been in a
hot and dirty warehouse environment for years. It looks terrible but
just keeps on printing. Another aspect in favor of some Oki models is
that you can reset the usage counts and keep printing until the toner
really runs out, giving a very low cost per page. Can sometimes be
found on craigslist or other classifieds at a low price.

Samsung CLP-610ND Colour Laser Printer $440

No experience with those. From the specs, PCL only. Seems to be well
regarded on Newegg.

I will very grudgingly consider Hewlett Packard LaserJet CP2025dn
Colour Printer $560 but I'm real ticked at HP so that's highly
unlikely.

No experience with that one either, but it has PS emulation. Also
popular on Newegg.

--
Warren Block * Rapid City, South Dakota * USA

"Tony Toews [MVP]" wrote in message
...
"Ian D" wrote:

There's no post warranty time limit specified. As long as a product is on
the list, and has a post warranty plan available, it must be eligible.

Ah, interesting. I'll have to check that out.

Umm, stupid question - so how do I buy those? I'll keep poking about but
I don't see
a convenient button labelled "purchase now".

tony
--
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Tony's Main MS Access pages - http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm
Tony's Microsoft Access Blog - http://msmvps.com/blogs/access/
Granite Fleet Manager http://www.granitefleet.com/

If you're in the US, there is a Buy Now next to each warranty. If not,
note the product number for the warranty you want, then click "How
to buy". Select store or shopping, but not parts, and do a search
on your selected product number. If you want to be sure you are
eligible for the warranty, contact the HP store at the 1-800 number.
I noticed that for the US there are 3 PW choices for your 2605;
next day exchange (for a refurb unit), send your's in for repair (3 day
turnaround), or a one time only next day exchange for a brand new
replacement.

"Ian D" wrote:

If you're in the US, there is a Buy Now next to each warranty.

Which I'm not.

If not,
note the product number for the warranty you want, then click "How
to buy". Select store or shopping, but not parts, and do a search
on your selected product number. If you want to be sure you are
eligible for the warranty, contact the HP store at the 1-800 number.
I noticed that for the US there are 3 PW choices for your 2605;
next day exchange (for a refurb unit), send your's in for repair (3 day
turnaround), or a one time only next day exchange for a brand new
replacement.

Trouble is I don't have the box or foam inserts so shipping it out is not going to
work for me.

I can find the UE177PE number on the HP site but I can't find the Canadian version
UC733E sigh Why am I even bothering with this?

Psychologically I've rolled the printer down a hill watching the parts fly in all
directions with a great deal of glee.

Tony

--
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Tony's Main MS Access pages - http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm
Tony's Microsoft Access Blog - http://msmvps.com/blogs/access/
Granite Fleet Manager http://www.granitefleet.com/

"Tony Toews [MVP]" wrote:

Psychologically I've rolled the printer down a hill watching the parts fly in
all
directions with a great deal of glee.

Tony


I can relate to that!
Of the printers you mentioned I would opt for the OKI, I have a very high
regard for their printers especially the colour laser series. For most people
the fact that it is a winprinter is of little consequence.
You will know best whether that is an issue for you.
I have seen dozens of OKI colour lasers working hard with very few issues,
their drivers are good and install easily. Being a flat deck printer they can
handle card and envelopes better that most and earlier models could print
banners (up to 39" I think????).
Fusers and belts are user replaceable unlike all of the others you mention.
They have separate toner and drum units and a drum unit will last for several
toner cartridges. These printers are really well built, you will notice that
when you lift one. The earlier series were noisy but they have fixed that.
These just seem to go on and on with very little trouble. The OKI website
should give expevted life of consumables including fuser and belt so cost of
ownership is simple to calculate, not so with some other printers. In my
geography if a fuser or belt fails with more than 20% stated life left OKI will
replace them at a pro-rated price, pretty god ethics I think.
I don't like the brother colour printers, they are often clunky and the
cartridges are a pain in the b???
I detest Lexmark for the same reason as you and the HP printer you mention is a
little too close to the entry level for my liking.
Hope this helps.
Tony
MS MVP Printing Image

Tony wrote:

Psychologically I've rolled the printer down a hill watching the parts fly in
all directions with a great deal of glee.

I can relate to that!

I figured folks would smile at that.

Of the printers you mentioned I would opt for the OKI, I have a very high
regard for their printers especially the colour laser series. For most people
the fact that it is a winprinter is of little consequence.

I only run Windows so that's not an issue to me. It does have a network port which
is important to me.

"Operating Systems: Windows Vista®, XP, 2003 Server, 2000 (all 32- and 64-bit); Mac®
OS X 10.2.8 and higher; UNIX®; Linux "

http://www.okidata.com/mkt/html/nf/c5650dnspec.html

(And I'm thinking to myself that a wireless network adapter is what, $10 or $15 at
the manufacturer price level? And bluetooth about $1. Why not add those in.
Hopefully the next generation of printers will have those. Along with WPA security
of course. Sure, initial setup has to be with a wired connection but after that
....)

You will know best whether that is an issue for you.
I have seen dozens of OKI colour lasers working hard with very few issues,
their drivers are good and install easily. Being a flat deck printer they can
handle card and envelopes better that most and earlier models could print
banners (up to 39" I think????).

"Single Pass Color™ Digital technology for printing up to 110 lb. index stock (203
gsm) and banners up to 4 feet long "

Hmm, I'm not familiar with what 110 lb stock means. I have some business card stock
I buy a few sheets at a time but it sure feels like relatively light weight card
stock compared to most business cards.

I don't like the brother colour printers, they are often clunky and the
cartridges are a pain in the b???
I detest Lexmark for the same reason as you and the HP printer you mention is a
little too close to the entry level for my liking.

Any comments on the Samsung?

The biggest problem with the Okidata is the $300 higher initial price. That said if
the quality is anything like the Okidata dot matrix printers then I would expect the
Okidata to last my lifetime. smile

A client once had to replace a print head on the Okidata dot matrix printers after
about 3 or 4 years. Mind you they printed thousands of pages a month. Other than
that I don't ever recall a problem with them.

Tony
--
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Tony's Main MS Access pages - http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm
Tony's Microsoft Access Blog - http://msmvps.com/blogs/access/
Granite Fleet Manager http://www.granitefleet.com/

"Tony Toews [MVP]" wrote:
Tony wrote:



Any comments on the Samsung?


Sorry, I have no personal experience with Samsung printers but have not heard
anything negative about them.

The biggest problem with the Okidata is the $300 higher initial price. That
said if
the quality is anything like the Okidata dot matrix printers then I would
expect the
Okidata to last my lifetime. smile

A client once had to replace a print head on the Okidata dot matrix printers
after
about 3 or 4 years. Mind you they printed thousands of pages a month. Other
than
that I don't ever recall a problem with them.


Yes printheads on those did fail but as you point out usually after prolonged
and heavy use which is probably fair eneough

It seems to me that although the OKI is more expensive, the real calculation is
cost of ownership/cost per page.
That would take some calculating but you may wish to do that.
The expected life of drums, toner, belts and fuser are the main ingredients
along with the cost of those items. For OKI they are all consumables, for other
printers they will involve some labour cost unless you are happy to remove th
covers and replace fusers yourself.
I am very confident in the quality of Okidata's engineering. Their printers
remind me of the early lasers in terms of strength and manufacturing detail.
Tony
MS MVP Printing Image

Tony wrote:

It seems to me that although the OKI is more expensive, the real calculation is
cost of ownership/cost per page.
That would take some calculating but you may wish to do that.
The expected life of drums, toner, belts and fuser are the main ingredients
along with the cost of those items. For OKI they are all consumables, for other
printers they will involve some labour cost unless you are happy to remove th
covers and replace fusers yourself.

But the reality for me is that given my low printing volumes plastic parts may start
disintegrating of old age rather than mechanical failures.

I am very confident in the quality of Okidata's engineering. Their printers
remind me of the early lasers in terms of strength and manufacturing detail.

Ahh, now that's a very interesting concept. One MVPs husband hasn't purchased a
replacement for his beloved HP II (IIRC) because none of the printers he has looked
at pass his "not flimsy" testing. smile

How long have you been dealing with laser printers and such? What is your day job
that gets you so much experience?

Tony
--
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Tony's Main MS Access pages - http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm
Tony's Microsoft Access Blog - http://msmvps.com/blogs/access/
Granite Fleet Manager http://www.granitefleet.com/

"Tony Toews [MVP]" wrote:


Ahh, now that's a very interesting concept. One MVPs husband hasn't
purchased a
replacement for his beloved HP II (IIRC) because none of the printers he has
looked
at pass his "not flimsy" testing. smile

How long have you been dealing with laser printers and such? What is your day
job
that gets you so much experience?

35 years in the computer industry, many of those with printers.
Do you remember the ones that IBM made that were about the size of a Centurion
tank and involved small pieces of steel with raised numbers and letters on them
being pushed around an oiled track at about a million miles an hour?
Well that and Golf Ball typewriters were some of the earliest I worked with.
Golf Ball printers required enormous skill to repair and adjust.
Everything just sort of evolved until digital printers arrived so that you
could print any shape the driver and software permitted rather than whatever
was on the print head or print chain. The first of these were dot matrix and
then the Laser and Inkjet units arrived.
My day job is nothing whatsoever to do with printers, you could liken it to
your Veterans clubs which I am sure you have in Canada, (British Legion in the
UK etc.), I manage one of those.
Good luck in your search. E-mail me if you wish. The address above is valid.
Tony
MS MVP Printing Image

Tony wrote:

How long have you been dealing with laser printers and such? What is your day
job
that gets you so much experience?

35 years in the computer industry, many of those with printers.
Do you remember the ones that IBM made that were about the size of a Centurion
tank and involved small pieces of steel with raised numbers and letters on them
being pushed around an oiled track at about a million miles an hour?

Oh yes, the band printers. Yes, I worked with those on the IBM S/34s and up.

Amusing story. The client would print about 50 to 100 letters a day using the band
printer so the system operator had to change the band to print lower case. Well,
the little extrusions that the plastic print band cover rotated on broke after a few
years. The computer tech guy took a number of hours to remove all the parts off the
cast aluminum base and put them back on the new one. It was all covered on IBM mtce
plan of course.

Well, he comes back a month or two later looking for a page count on an internal
counter on the printer. When asked why he said mtce HQ wanted it so they could
figure out why the cast aluminum base needed replacing. We explained and he laughed
and that made a lot of sense.

Well that and Golf Ball typewriters were some of the earliest I worked with.
Golf Ball printers required enormous skill to repair and adjust.

I built an invoicing system in Access for a client. Besides the fact that it cut
down a weeks time sorting paperwork at the end of the month it saved them from having
to purchase new golf ball heads because they would use the ..... between the invoice
line text and the number of hours. They went through a lot of periods.

My day job is nothing whatsoever to do with printers, you could liken it to
your Veterans clubs which I am sure you have in Canada, (British Legion in the
UK etc.), I manage one of those.

Oh yes, the Legion. I'm quite familiar with those up here.

Tony
--
Tony Toews, Microsoft Access MVP
Tony's Main MS Access pages - http://www.granite.ab.ca/accsmstr.htm
Tony's Microsoft Access Blog - http://msmvps.com/blogs/access/
Granite Fleet Manager http://www.granitefleet.com/

I like Oki's laserless laser engine principle. Once they got the bugs
out of their first disastrous "environmentally friendly" products, the
machines have been satisfactory (in my experience): solid, sturdy.

Their support, to me, wound up being quite excellent. They replaced one
of those bad machines seven years later with a refurb. The refurb's
great, except for the registration.

One thing to be concerned with is the cost of consumables. For my two
machines, toner cost was more-or-less OK. The price of drums, however,
makes one think of just replacing the entire printer. The drums have a
long life, but when one is needed, it's really time to consider whether
an entire machine is a better choice. Considering that those drums are
third-world items, I'd rather that Oki passed the savings along.

So, my recommendation is to look at the Okis, but think about those
consumable costs.

Unlike with HP, one saves almost nothing by buying recycled third party
OKI toner cartridges. I must say, though, that I've come across Oki
black printers just like my own that have been in long service in nearby
banks and libraries. I suspect that they've outlasted HPs a few times over.

I've made a transition to inkjet printers more recently. I enjoy them
even though printouts have water problems. I can refill the HP ink
cartridges with some success and at much lower cost than feeding the Oki
LED cartridges. Yet, even though I don't use it, I have not been able to
part with the Oki. It's taken me a lot of thought to realize that an
inkjet printer is actually more complicated than a laser machine. It's
gotta deal with esoteric things related to liquid ink characteristics,
whereas toner is just toner. Pretty sobering.

Richard