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#1
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AMD64 heat ... caution
Thought I'd pass this on. Got in a new mobo bundle
today ( mobo, ram, cpu .. assembled and tested by the vendor ). Built up the system, and got ready to install the OS. The pc would run about 5 minutes, and then just shut off. Happened about 3 times, and I had checked connections, etc, so I looked at the BIOS settings. I know there are several that if wrong, will cause the AMD64 not to boot. Noticed that the cpu idle temp was 55 degrees C , and the alarm was set to 60 C. No way that will work. I pulled the heat sink off, and noticed that the thermal compound was flaky and cooked. Then I remembered. AMD warns to always remove the thermal compound from the heat sink and replace it with fresh, because it tends to dry out, and the AMD64 will just cook it to a dry mess at 55 C. New thermal compound will drop the AMD64 to about 38 C idle, and that will slowly creep up to mid to high 40s, but will hold well below the 60 C BIOS alarm. You guys building the game boxes take note of that. johns |
#2
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"johns" wrote:
Thought I'd pass this on. Got in a new mobo bundle today ( mobo, ram, cpu .. assembled and tested by the vendor ). Built up the system, and got ready to install the OS. The pc would run about 5 minutes, and then just shut off. Happened about 3 times, and I had checked connections, etc, so I looked at the BIOS settings. I know there are several that if wrong, will cause the AMD64 not to boot. Noticed that the cpu idle temp was 55 degrees C , and the alarm was set to 60 C. No way that will work. I pulled the heat sink off, and noticed that the thermal compound was flaky and cooked. Then I remembered. AMD warns to always remove the thermal compound from the heat sink and replace it with fresh, Do you have a citation for that johns? because it tends to dry out, and the AMD64 will just cook it to a dry mess at 55 C. I don't think so. New thermal compound will drop the AMD64 to about 38 C idle, and that will slowly creep up to mid to high 40s, but will hold well below the 60 C BIOS alarm. You guys building the game boxes take note of that. Speaking of CPU temperatures. Thanks to mistakes, my Athlon XP 2400+ has been up to maybe 120°C before it shut down the system, twice so far. This last time I was looking at the temperature in the BIOS thinking that can't be right. The Fahrenheit rating was so high it said 1° off and on. Then the system shutdown... oops. The first time was because I didn't make sure the CPU fan was plugged in and running. The second time was because the heat sink clip was put on the wrong way and apparently caused the heat sink to sit on the CPU at an angle. Systems running OK now, as far as I can tell. I guess Microstar International (MSI) forgot to include a CPU maximum temperature in the BIOS of their new mainboards. I used it on my last mainboards, figuring it might be a good idea. |
#3
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120 C?
bULL****... "John Doe" wrote in message ... "johns" wrote: Thought I'd pass this on. Got in a new mobo bundle today ( mobo, ram, cpu .. assembled and tested by the vendor ). Built up the system, and got ready to install the OS. The pc would run about 5 minutes, and then just shut off. Happened about 3 times, and I had checked connections, etc, so I looked at the BIOS settings. I know there are several that if wrong, will cause the AMD64 not to boot. Noticed that the cpu idle temp was 55 degrees C , and the alarm was set to 60 C. No way that will work. I pulled the heat sink off, and noticed that the thermal compound was flaky and cooked. Then I remembered. AMD warns to always remove the thermal compound from the heat sink and replace it with fresh, Do you have a citation for that johns? because it tends to dry out, and the AMD64 will just cook it to a dry mess at 55 C. I don't think so. New thermal compound will drop the AMD64 to about 38 C idle, and that will slowly creep up to mid to high 40s, but will hold well below the 60 C BIOS alarm. You guys building the game boxes take note of that. Speaking of CPU temperatures. Thanks to mistakes, my Athlon XP 2400+ has been up to maybe 120°C before it shut down the system, twice so far. This last time I was looking at the temperature in the BIOS thinking that can't be right. The Fahrenheit rating was so high it said 1° off and on. Then the system shutdown... oops. The first time was because I didn't make sure the CPU fan was plugged in and running. The second time was because the heat sink clip was put on the wrong way and apparently caused the heat sink to sit on the CPU at an angle. Systems running OK now, as far as I can tell. I guess Microstar International (MSI) forgot to include a CPU maximum temperature in the BIOS of their new mainboards. I used it on my last mainboards, figuring it might be a good idea. |
#4
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johns wrote:
Thought I'd pass this on. Got in a new mobo bundle today ( mobo, ram, cpu .. assembled and tested by the vendor ). Built up the system, and got ready to install the OS. The pc would run about 5 minutes, and then just shut off. Happened about 3 times, and I had checked connections, etc, so I looked at the BIOS settings. I know there are several that if wrong, will cause the AMD64 not to boot. Noticed that the cpu idle temp was 55 degrees C , and the alarm was set to 60 C. No way that will work. I pulled the heat sink off, and noticed that the thermal compound was flaky and cooked. Then I remembered. AMD warns to always remove the thermal compound from the heat sink and replace it with fresh, because it tends to dry out, and the AMD64 will just cook it to a dry mess at 55 C. So what you're saying is this: 1) Your BIOS is set for too low a temperature. 2) You are using sub-par heatsink compound. -- -WD |
#5
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NOTICE: PLEASE DON HIP WADERS NOW. John Doe: Thanks to mistakes, my Athlon XP 2400+ has been up to maybe 120øC before it shut down the system, twice so far. Oh man, at least put a warning at the top -- Mac Cool |
#6
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was flaky and cooked. Then I remembered. AMD
warns to always remove the thermal compound from Do they? I can understand that you should replace the compound if you ever remove the heatsink from the CPU but in a "box" CPU, then one would assume the compound is intact for one installation. Rob. |
#7
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Do you have a citation for that johns? Yes. It is in the AMD64 manual that is generally included with the Gigabyte mobos that I receive. I also belive it is mentioned in the FAQs on the AMD64 site. Always replace that old goop in a new assembly. They don't stress the heat problem. What they stress is that the cooked goop will stick the cpu to the heat sink, and you won't be able to remove the cpu from the mobo because you can't get to the release clip which is hidden under the stuck heat sink. I noticed exactly that when I tried to pull the heat sink off this new mobo. It was stuck and took a lot of careful wiggling side to side before it came loose. When I got it out finally, cleaned, and replaced the stuff, the idle temp immediatley dropped to 38 C, and I could install the OS with no problem. The reason I had the vendor ( Mwave.com ) assemble this bundle was 1) Mwave .. and others .. will not warantee the cpu or the ram if bought and assembled by an outside tech. I've been getting grief from them over that lately. Also, 2) I noticed that Kingston ddr400 ram does not fit well in the newer Gigabyte mobos. I wanted them to assemble it so that I did not wind up with that problem again. I don't know what causes that fit problem, but if they can assemble it. Fine. I did call Mwave and let them know that their techs need to clean that heat sink goop ( as per AMD64 instructions ). They agreed. That should have been done. I'm pretty sure almost nobody is doing that, and they are going to be plenty sorry they did not. I don't think so. Based on your experience as a computer tech? I have nearly 40 years in this industry, and I know that this is a problem because I checked things like this out with both AMD and Gigabyte. I also noticed that a "google" brings this heat problem up all over. I just happen to know the solution. You have to renew that glop. at an angle. Systems running OK now, as far as I can tell. You probably had it alright for the most part. Google says for that AMD processor .. mostly the early ones, that high reading is a BIOS and temp circuit goofup. Most of those cpus say they are running in the high 50s, or even up to 65 C. That would destroy them if it were true. Without the fan running your mobo should have been raising hell, or it should have been shutting down quickly. At any rate, I do this every day, so I tend not to make those mistakes ( anymore ). I guess Microstar International (MSI) forgot to include a CPU maximum temperature in the BIOS of their new mainboards. I used it on my last mainboards, figuring it might be a good idea. I haven't seen anybody be truthful about it. They will put cutoff warning temps, but if you call the vendors, or the manufacturers they will bs you all over the place. I think it is best to low-end it as much as you are able with the BIOS settings and good heat sink assembly, and if it runs .. it must be right ??? In my case, I can't afford to have these things coming back in here because I screwed up. johns |
#8
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120 C? bULL****... It happens. It is a balled up temp circuit that some of the mobo manufacturers say they are going to fix someday. That is the real BS. I think they fixed it on the newer mobos, but not for that cpu. johns |
#9
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So what you're saying is this: 1) Your BIOS is set for too low a temperature. 2) You are using sub-par heatsink compound. No. If you will read what I wrote, the vendor did an assemble and test of the mobo bundle BEFORE they sent it to me. When I got it, it ran, but would shut down after 5 min. The cause of that ( which is warned against by AMD64 support ) is not cleaning the old thermal compound off those heatsinks, and replacing it with new thermal compound. The heatsinks have been sitting on the shelf since manufacturing .. and the goop tends to dry out a bit. On earlier CPUs, that was not such a big deal because they simply do not put out that much heat. The AMD64 does, and will cook that old stuff to a glue, and you will not be able to remove the stuck heatsink. I'm using that silver based stuff. It works fine, and will drop the idle temp of the AMD64 to 38 C, and the working temp to about 45 C. Also, if for some reason, you need to remove the heat sink ( failed fan ), it will come up easily because the AMD64 never gets to 55 C where it will turn the stuff to glue. Note: older processors have a very small contact surface, so this is not such a problem. The AMD64 has a huge contact surface, and that will glue the heat sink to the cpu at higher temps. You will break the socket trying to remove it. johns |
#10
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Mac Cool wrote:
NOTICE: PLEASE DON HIP WADERS NOW. John Doe: Thanks to mistakes, my Athlon XP 2400+ has been up to maybe 120›C before it shut down the system, twice so far. Oh man, at least put a warning at the top According to the data sheet, the maximum die temperature is 85 or 90°C. I wrote what I saw, not what I know as fact. Seems possible to me, although I was in disbelief until the system shut down. -- Mac Cool Path: newsdbm05.news.prodigy.com!newsdst02.news.prodigy. com!newsmst01a.news.prodigy.com!prodigy.com!newsco n06.news.prodigy.com!prodigy.net!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail From: Mac Cool From: Mac Cool Mac @2cool.com Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt Subject: AMD64 heat ... caution Date: 29 Jan 2005 20:40:33 GMT Lines: 11 Message-ID: Message-ID: Xns95ED9F7D4697DMacCool @130.133.1.4 References: X-Trace: individual.net E1DXcz5VR2owQqWXgo+seQA4cU6KL0uo84VuTAuKCDAYhxE7pp User-Agent: Xnews/??.01.14 Xref: newsmst01a.news.prodigy.com alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt:428197 |
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