Happy Birthday America

In article ,
says...
No No No......

America was conned, America swallowed everything
their leaders dished out because on this planet, America
is filled with racist sheep that will believe that they are
the master race.
Winston



Oh Christ, here we go again....


Duh, yep, them Yuripeons is smart. Amerikuns is dum.

As though ignorance and stupidity are exclusively American shortcomings.

Oh Christ, here we go again....


Duh, yep, them Yuripeons is smart. Amerikuns is dum.

As though ignorance and stupidity are exclusively American shortcomings.

Heh..
It's not that EUers are smart and USAers are dumb..
It's that americans (as a whole) are really really blind to the rest of the
world.. I know this, I am an american who lives in the EU...
When I go back to the states every year I hear all sorts of stuff about how
the US is being attack'd by terrorist and how horrible it is...
But lets take a look at the rest of the world and compare..
lets just take a look at the number of instances and compare..
That's a HUGE problem.. the "WORLD" trade center was attack'd and at the end
of the day that building wasnt full of American Democratic buisnessmen.. It
was full of people from all around the world with the majority of them being
american.. I watch 20/20 two to 3 times a month and wow how the bull****
flys!..
It's not that americans are dumb.. It's just that you have a different view
of the world, one that's closed and one that's strongly bias'd to what you
are told by the goverment and media..

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ClawJammer wrote:
As though ignorance and stupidity are exclusively American shortcomings.

Not at tall. They've just been proclaiming it much more frequently and
louder than others lately.


- --
Frode

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ClawJammer wrote:
There is plenty of criticism on the so called "war on terror". But I
have yet to hear any constructive ideas here on how to resolve the
problem.

Gathering intelligence *before* attacking nations either verbally or with
military might, would be a grand step forward in the eyes of most countries
in the world. America is currently like a herd of rhinos stampeding through
a village, then looking around in wonder when realizing the villagers
aren't cheering them on. Nothing will undo the WTC terrorist act. Knee jerk
reactions like dropping bombs into the middle of one of the most volatile
and religious fanatic regions of the planet, then looking for (and failing
for moths to produce) evidence to justify it after the fact, just isn't the
way to gain international support nor prevent future terrorist acts. It's
like attacking a beehive without any real idea of how to kill the critters
when they come swarming out to retaliate. All free countries were horrified
at the WTC disaster. There was little global doubt when it came to rooting
out the Taliban in Afghanistan. Iraq though....? It clearly could have been
handled better.

I was on vacation in the US for a bit over a month early this year (I'm
usually there a month or so every year) and after watching the news and
presidential speeches broadcast I can see how the average american got
suckered. It's the exact same thing Hitler did. Feed the people's fear,
then tell them who to fear, then tell them the only way to sort it out is
to start a war. Too many americans are completely blinded by it. The US
domestic propaganda machine was very very good. Now the world is hoping the
nation will rein itself in before it has plunged the world into WW3, with
it as the agressor.


- --
Frode

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"ClawJammer" wrote in message
news:MPG.19a594ede6d2b2e498968e@news...
In article ,
says...
That's a HUGE problem.. the "WORLD" trade center was attack'd and at the
end
of the day that building wasnt full of American Democratic buisnessmen..
It
was full of people from all around the world

Precisely! Which I would guess is the reason why Americans are
flabbergasted that the world community seems content to go about
business as usual and pretend like nothing ever happened.


Yea but the rest of the world didnt clinch up, tell all of it's residents to
stay within the country.. and then come up with really weird restrictions.
You gotta remember that for years and years and years the UK has been going
through this.. over 30 years of bombings (much of that funded from american
irish who support those gropus) Not that many of them but much of the money
does come from the USA..
Span gets a few bombings a year.. every year.. end on end.. And it does
happen all over the world. The thing was that the general american public
had no idea that it happens and for a large part they still dont realise
that it happens..

They clinch'd on the war in iraq, that was NOT a war on terrorism.. that was
a war that received american (public) approval BECAUSE they thought it was a
war on terrorism..


It's not that americans are dumb.. It's just that you have a different
view
of the world, one that's closed and one that's strongly bias'd to what
you
are told by the goverment and media..

I would hope that my fellow Americans are smarter than that. I do tend
to view the government and media with a jaundiced eye, but what are you
basing your current views on? Foreign media? Do you have some source
of information that the rest of the world is not privy to?


I get several forms of "foreign" media..
When I see a news topic I like to look at it from all angles, British,
American, German, Indian, Aussies too.. The more "overall" news you see from
the world is the more you can see the facts. (They all report the facts
with their own extras mixed in)


There is plenty of criticism on the so called "war on terror". But I
have yet to hear any constructive ideas here on how to resolve the
problem.


There is no real way to solve the problem..
All in all.. those ****ers are nuts.. (nuf said)
BUT.. Attacking middle east country's, feeding weapons to other middleeast
country's, and trying to bankrupt other middleeast country's is probably not
the "best" way to start a system to get those nutters to stop shooting..

In article ,
says...
I get several forms of "foreign" media..
When I see a news topic I like to look at it from all angles, British,
American, German, Indian, Aussies too.. The more "overall" news you see from
the world is the more you can see the facts. (They all report the facts
with their own extras mixed in)


I do the same.

Frode wrote:
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ClawJammer wrote:

There is plenty of criticism on the so called "war on terror". But I
have yet to hear any constructive ideas here on how to resolve the
problem.


Gathering intelligence *before* attacking nations either verbally or with
military might, would be a grand step forward in the eyes of most countries
in the world. America is currently like a herd of rhinos stampeding through
a village, then looking around in wonder when realizing the villagers
aren't cheering them on. Nothing will undo the WTC terrorist act. Knee jerk
reactions like dropping bombs into the middle of one of the most volatile
and religious fanatic regions of the planet, then looking for (and failing
for moths to produce) evidence to justify it after the fact, just isn't the
way to gain international support nor prevent future terrorist acts. It's
like attacking a beehive without any real idea of how to kill the critters
when they come swarming out to retaliate. All free countries were horrified
at the WTC disaster. There was little global doubt when it came to rooting
out the Taliban in Afghanistan. Iraq though....? It clearly could have been
handled better.

We saw what 12 years of "handling it better" accomplished: A brutal dictator
playing perpetual WMD hide and seek with an impotent U.N..

I was on vacation in the US for a bit over a month early this year (I'm
usually there a month or so every year) and after watching the news and
presidential speeches broadcast I can see how the average american got
suckered. It's the exact same thing Hitler did. Feed the people's fear,
then tell them who to fear, then tell them the only way to sort it out is
to start a war. Too many americans are completely blinded by it. The US
domestic propaganda machine was very very good. Now the world is hoping the
nation will rein itself in before it has plunged the world into WW3, with
it as the agressor.

Did Neville Chamberlain write that for you?

rstlne wrote:
Point taken...though I doubt anyone will miss Cutesy and Poopsey
Hussein.


Hah
yea..
I think that it will be "Great" for the future of Iraq..
But I just dont approve of how the US went about it..



Uh, huh. But while you're trying to figure out the Tiny Tim
tip-toe-through-the-tulips way of doing it people are dying.

What do you suggest?
Sanctions? Tried that, for 12 years.
Inspections? Tried that, for 12 years. Well, except for when they were banned
from entering the country.
Keep forces there so he's 'contained'? Guess what was #1 on Bin Laden's
complaint list when he murdered over 3000 people and destroyed the WTC.
Maybe some 'incentive' bombing? Tried that in 1998.

The terms of the cease fire required him to fully disclose all WMD, programs,
and related documentation within 90 days but 12 years later he had still not
complied. That's patience pal. Time's up.

"David Maynard" wrote in message
...
Frode wrote:
out the Taliban in Afghanistan. Iraq though....? It clearly could have
been
handled better.

We saw what 12 years of "handling it better" accomplished: A brutal
dictator playing perpetual WMD hide and seek with an impotent U.N..

Impotent? During that period, the U.N. and individual states managed to
have hostilities between Iraq and Iran cease and arrange for prisoner
exchanges, stop the Iraqi ABC weapons program, launch the "food for oil"
program (which the U.S. several times obstructed, causing suffering to the
Iraqi people -- not their dictator), and keep Iraqi tempers down.
Note how free those 12 years were of Iraqi agressions.

See, brute force isn't always the only solution, and abstaining from using
brute force doesn't always mean impotence. If anything, I would think it's
the biggest impotents are those who feel a need for dick waving contests
using weapons as a symbol of their perceived potency.

Yes, Saddam Hussein and his sons were evil dictators.
NO, the US had no right to attack Iraq. While the government of Iraq was
evil, it was THEIR government, and not subject to US judgment.

--
*Art

"David Maynard" wrote in message
...
What do you suggest?
Sanctions? Tried that, for 12 years.

And they worked.

Inspections? Tried that, for 12 years.

And they worked.

Well, except for when they were banned from entering the country.

After it was discovered that many of the US "inspectors" were spies who
reported strike coordinates back to the US -- this is even something the
"weapons inspectors" admit to, so there's little point in denying it.

Keep forces there so he's 'contained'? Guess what was #1 on Bin Laden's
complaint list when he murdered over 3000 people and destroyed the WTC.

1: Iraq is not Saudi Arabia any more than the U.S. is Canada. Learn some
geography.

2: Osama Bin Laden had nothing to do with Iraq -- if anything, he despised
Iraq, and Iraqi leaders despised him. Not only do they belong to two very
separate muslim factions (bin Laden is Shiite, which were repressed by Iraqi
government), but Bin Laden also didn't have a *country* to run, which makes
the situation very different indeed. There's no links from Iraq to
terrorism -- the only weak link is the monetary compensation that Iraq has
given FAMILIES of Palestine suicide attackers who had their houses razed by
Israeli military, despite the FAMILIES being completely innocent.

Maybe some 'incentive' bombing? Tried that in 1998.

Right. Bombs were clearly not the solution.

The terms of the cease fire required him to fully disclose all WMD,
programs,
and related documentation within 90 days but 12 years later he had still
not
complied.

Show me the evidence he hadn't complied. And please, do better than a
handful of conventional missiles that could reach 10% further than allowed
(still far from enough to threaten Israel). From all accounts, the weapons
programs *were* stopped, and the weapons *were* destroyed or buried. That
the Iraqi doesn't use the same form of bureaucracy as the US, and thus could
not provide the exact legal papers that the US expected isn't their fault --
it's the US expectations and understanding of different cultures that need
to be altered. Not all countries form $500 million committees and hire a
corps of lawyers and bureaucrats when they need to do something -- they give
the order, and it's DONE. Papers doesn't prove anything anyhow, as Blair's
and Bush's "paper evidence" against Iraq clearly showed.
(And even if they had produced the exact paperwork the US "wanted", would it
have been *believed*?)

Another country in the region has now had 36 years to comply with
resolutions, and still doesn't. Should that country be attacked too?

--
*Art