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Tachi X570 has only 1 gigabit ethernetport kinda disappointing (notfuture-proof, no 10 GBe)



 
 
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  #41  
Old July 16th 19, 07:28 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
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Default Tachi X570 has only 1 gigabit ethernetport kinda disappointing(not future-proof, no 10 GBe)

On Sunday, July 14, 2019 at 5:12:13 PM UTC+2, Char Jackson wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jul 2019 08:08:03 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Saturday, July 13, 2019 at 4:32:16 PM UTC+2, Char Jackson wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jul 2019 06:45:26 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

On Saturday, July 13, 2019 at 7:46:37 AM UTC+2, Char Jackson wrote:
On Fri, 12 Jul 2019 20:09:03 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

On Tuesday, July 9, 2019 at 3:51:30 PM UTC+2, Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 9 Jul 2019 04:58:35 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

This year I will probably buy a new computer, I will probably wait for the 16 core ryzen, I've wait 13 years to buy a new computer and somebody I know thinks I should wait 2 more months to get the 16 core part lol.

There's always something newer and better just around the corner. Sooner
or later, if you're going to buy, you just have to jump.

For now I will investigate motherboards somewhat better to see which motherboard can actually power such a 16 core beast.

I am kinda a fan of ASRock though I never used their motherboards for a long period, but what I like about their boards is "overheat" protection which some claim every motherboard has but I am not so sure about that.

Anyway their Tachi X570 motherboard and especially the RGB looks very good/amazing !

But there is one thing that truely disappoints me a lot and that's two things actually:

1. First of all it only has 1 ethernet port ?! WTF where they thinking ?! How the **** do I connect my old computer and new computer AND INTERNET ?! without having to use some ****ing complex router crap ?! Big problem there.

Use an Ethernet switch to connect the two computers together. Unmanaged
8-port gigabit switches start at less than $15.

What part of 1 gigabit doesn't cut it don't you understand LOL.

Sorry, I thought you were asking a serious question. My mistake.

It was a bit harsh but that's to point out to you your oversight of mentioning a 1 gigabit router that doesn't cut it ?!

In what way doesn't it cut it? You had two concerns and I addressed both
of them. The two things that you were concerned about aren't a problem
at all.

1. You don't need more than 1 Ethernet port to be able to connect to a
second PC and to the Internet.
2. You don't need to transfer 50TB of data over Ethernet when you can
simply bring the entire drive over to the new PC.


HOLY****.

HOW DEEP DOES YOUR STUPIDITY GO ?! LOL.

So you want me to risk 50 TERRABYTES OF DATA... by moving the harddisks ?! LOL.



Never mind. I keep forgetting that you're not serious.


Don't know why you would think that...

I think it's just you... that can't comprehend it :P

Bye,
Skybuck =D
  #42  
Old July 16th 19, 08:52 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
Paul[_28_]
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Default Tachi X570 has only 1 gigabit ethernetport kinda disappointing(not future-proof, no 10 GBe)

wrote:
On Sunday, July 14, 2019 at 5:12:13 PM UTC+2, Char Jackson wrote:

Never mind. I keep forgetting that you're not serious.


Don't know why you would think that...

I think it's just you... that can't comprehend it :P

Bye,
Skybuck =D


There won't be any large flash drives, at a price
you can afford.

Just looking at the price of a 1TB flash drive and
extrapolating that price, tells you what the price is.

There is one 40TB flash drive today, in a 3.5" form
factor. It has a SATA interface. You can write to it
continuously, without exhausting the TBW rating (before
the warranty expires). But it costs as much as a small
car, so nobody will own one any time soon.

Large hard drives are around $500. For around $2K, I
could get you a large storage array, using four
of the large drives. You could RAID them if you
wanted speed, but again, that would be a silly design,
requiring another $2K worth of backup drives to protect it.

10GbE cards are available for around $100 and use a PCIe x4
slot. Without any exotic storage solutions, for a reasonable
price you can add real 10GbE to a machine. Instead of the
RealTek 2.5GbE that threatens to be the "addin of choice"
on motherboards.

The problems are solvable:

1) With bags of cash
2) Using add-in network cards.

Paul
  #43  
Old July 16th 19, 09:11 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
T. Ment
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Default Tachi X570 has only 1 gigabit ethernetport kinda disappointing (not future-proof, no 10 GBe)

On Tue, 16 Jul 2019 15:52:10 -0400, Paul wrote:

There is one 40TB flash drive today, in a 3.5" form
factor. It has a SATA interface. You can write to it
continuously, without exhausting the TBW rating (before
the warranty expires). But it costs as much as a small
car


The problems are solvable:


1) With bags of cash


To most people, a shiny new toy bragfest is probably more interesting
than my old computer parts posts. That's OK, nobody can stop me, and I
don't care.


  #44  
Old July 16th 19, 10:10 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
Charlie Hoffpauir
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Posts: 347
Default Tachi X570 has only 1 gigabit ethernetport kinda disappointing (not future-proof, no 10 GBe)

The following comments are probably worthless, but nevertheless....

On Tue, 16 Jul 2019 11:27:47 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

On Saturday, July 13, 2019 at 9:04:32 PM UTC+2, Charlie Hoffpauir wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jul 2019 08:08:03 -0700 (PDT),

wrote:

HOLY****.

HOW DEEP DOES YOUR STUPIDITY GO ?! LOL.

So you want me to risk 50 TERRABYTES OF DATA... by moving the harddisks ?! LOL.

FAT CHANCE ! LOL.


I've been reading this with interest, and I generally have reasonable
comprehension, but I'm still confused. Please simplify and correct my
errors...
You have 50 TB on data on an old computer.


IN THE FUTURE my soon-to-be-new-computer will be my OLD computer

THIS IS FUTURE THINKING LOL.

Currently I have 4 TERABYTES TO TRANSFER TO NEW COMPUTER which I may soon BUY.

The new computer should have 40 to 50 TERABYTES of storage space to:

1. Store my old 4 TB of DATA ON.

2. Have 36 TB to 46 TB of free space for new data. 40 TB harddisk space 10 TB super fast solid state drives, that's the plan.

In the far future, maybe 5 or 10 years from now that 50 TB has to be transferred to a SECOND NEW COMPUTER.

And I want to make sure my by then old computer, which is to be my new computer soon, is capable of transferring that FUTURE DATA =D at reasonable speeds ! =D

Thus this futuristic idea will decide which computer I WILL BUY two months from now !

And it will probably not be a ASROCK/TACHI motherboard because it cannot do what I want to do in the future

GET IT YET ?

IF NOT WATCH SOME MORE BACK TO THE FUTURE ! LOLOLOLOLOL.

All of this is just based on my experience with computers which is at about 30 years by now.

You want to transfer that to a new computer, without opening the
box(es).
You don't want to take days to effect the transfer via 1 Gb transfer
rate.
If I have understood that correctly (perhaps a bad assumption, but
I'll await our corrections)I have a question.

Is the data important to you, ie would you really mind if it were all
lost?


It would be very annoying... most of it will be music... some of it will be applications, some of it will be games.

Most important data can probably fit in less then a terrabyte... however that consumption is also growing little bit by little bit.

Losing CODE, E-MAILS, DOCUMENTS would be must unacceptable.

account information/passwords would also be an inconvenience.

Now assuming it IS important, how do you back it up now? I have only a
couple of TB of data that I can't afford to lose, and I back it up


I have two internal harddisks... I backup my data to the other harddisk.

I also have an external usb-harddisk which I bought cheaply from local electronics store... I don't quite trust it cause it's slow and makes a weird clicking sound... but it's better than nothing.

Used to use CD/DVDs for it too... even have some tucked away in a fault... which will probably have to go away from that place in coming years... but this is the worst backup medium because of "retention time" losses data because of temperature fluctuations/gravity bending back the pits that were carved into the metal... at least a temperature vault could protect against that a little bit... don't know if these dvd's/cd's in the fault are still working... since my cd/dvd drive is kaputt.... not much worth it anymore... though old computer could still read it... hence... glad I don't listen to my mom and "throw away" old computers lol.

with triple redundancy... to a removable hard drive every 5 days, and
to an always on-line NAS unit daily. I really can't imagine how I'd
back up 50 TB of data. But however you do it, why not simply connect
your backup system to the new computer and transfer the after backing
it up from the old computer?


Connecting big devices is always a risk because of voltage-differences...

Can you imagine 10 gigabit ethernet ? I can though...

I can even imagine 100 gigabit or something new technology...

But 10 gigabit sounds delicious for now. 6 hours to transfer 50 TB seems reasonable.

However.... I see a problem though.... The harddisks probably cannot feed 1 gigabyte/sec data transfer rate.

It will probably be more like 180 megabyte/sec or so....

So roughly 5 times slower... it's still 2 times faster then 1 gigabit ethernet.

So even based on these rough estimates... 10 gigabit ethernet is still a better choice for todays hardware.

At least transferring 10 terrabytes of solid state drives should go much faster.

Maybe other options exist like usb 2 usb cables... however... usb also has a power cables... and might fry computers... not sure about that... all these weird holes... plug it in the wrong one and POOF bye bye computer(s)...

Bye for now,
Skybuck.


It's a given that transfer and storage media will be faster in the
future. There's even a possibility that DNA based storage will be in
place. But it's a pretty sure bet that whatever storage and transfer
means there are, transfer within a computer, ie from one storage
device to another within the "box" will probably be faster than
transfer to a device "outside" the box. So, my recommendation is that
you get over your fear of opening the box, and simply connect the
devices (whatever you use, perhaps 10 TB HDDs now) directly to the
computer. Even novices do this routinely with no problems, so with
your 30 years of experience, it should be a breeze. There's even the
possibility of using something like an Icy Dock* if you're dead set
against opening the box. Slip your 10 TB drive into the Icy Dock and
set your RoboCopy script to start copying at midnight and sleep
comfortably. Proably take more than one night, but also probably the
fastest way currently, as well as in the future.
*The Icy Dock goes in a slot that normally holds an optical drive, and
the SATA drive simply slides in and out even while the computer is
"on".
  #46  
Old July 17th 19, 12:13 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
Paul[_28_]
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Posts: 1,467
Default Tachi X570 has only 1 gigabit ethernetport kinda disappointing(not future-proof, no 10 GBe)

Flasherly wrote:
On Tue, 16 Jul 2019 11:27:47 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

40 TB harddisk space 10 TB super fast solid state drives, that's the plan.


Venture capital. Not everybody gets to be king, just some will try.
Depends on how the WEB is being angled. Not everyone needs 40T to
make a killing dealing off the WEB, only that it's possible and some
will and have. Old, new computer - what's the difference. If it
computes what's needed to get you there, thus and then it's still a
computer.


It's not venture capital, right now it's technology.

Disks are now big enough, the ratio between size and
sustained speed is no longer working.

This is the reason nobody will buy the 40TB drive that
writes at around 300MB/sec. It takes too many hours
to back up (violates the backup window).

This is one reason Seagate is working on a dual-armed
hard disk, with two separate sets of heads. It's a means
of doubling the speed of the read channel, without
modifying the way the heads read/write the disk platter.
This will allow a HDD to match the sustained speed of
a SATA SSD.

https://images.anandtech.com/doci/13...tion_575px.jpg

For an SSD hard drive, once the capacity becomes huge,
then the I/O needs multiple channels or enhanced speed.

I have the same problem with large drives here - it
takes too long to do anything with them. Hours and hours.
It means your planning has to be flawless when using
them, because of the hours wasted if you make just
one mistake.

Paul
  #47  
Old July 17th 19, 01:49 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
Flasherly[_2_]
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Default Tachi X570 has only 1 gigabit ethernetport kinda disappointing (not future-proof, no 10 GBe)

On Tue, 16 Jul 2019 19:13:07 -0400, Paul
wrote:

It's not venture capital, right now it's technology.

Disks are now big enough, the ratio between size and
sustained speed is no longer working.

This is the reason nobody will buy the 40TB drive that
writes at around 300MB/sec. It takes too many hours
to back up (violates the backup window).

This is one reason Seagate is working on a dual-armed
hard disk, with two separate sets of heads. It's a means
of doubling the speed of the read channel, without
modifying the way the heads read/write the disk platter.
This will allow a HDD to match the sustained speed of
a SATA SSD.

https://images.anandtech.com/doci/13...tion_575px.jpg

For an SSD hard drive, once the capacity becomes huge,
then the I/O needs multiple channels or enhanced speed.

I have the same problem with large drives here - it
takes too long to do anything with them. Hours and hours.
It means your planning has to be flawless when using
them, because of the hours wasted if you make just
one mistake.


Of course. I didn't intend to mean, 40T at that expediency is,
according to where it's aimed at, less than venturesome in its own
right. Markets are all about cutting-edge speeds: trading instruments
within milliseconds. They're at advantage over the timer technician,
without near to a supercomputer to run from major exchanges, directly
through a major brokerage house and their facilities/equipment
(special trader privileges and special qualifications to challenge for
an day-trader operative seat). That so-called timer may do well to
better now consider tempering a hedged trade with more stops and puts
now, than from where computers have since taken trading.

Computers have always been, at least for me, about hours and hours of
patience, certainly made from enough mistakes prior, that won't work
any other way than to think them through thoroughly prior and plan for
unexpected contingencies. Murphy's Law on one's level of proficiency
or somesuch humility seems about right to me.

A 4T SSD is the biggest I've offhand seen for hugeness.
  #48  
Old July 17th 19, 02:18 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
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Default Tachi X570 has only 1 gigabit ethernetport kinda disappointing(not future-proof, no 10 GBe)

In this video the guy is talking about how to get 10 GbE on the cheap:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuyuS04lD4o

And then funny and weird thing the guy says is that the

X470 Tachi Ultimate motherboard (so the previous generation) does have 10 GbE.

HOLY****, HOLY****.

So now the new one X570 Tachi "normal" edition doesn't ! HAHAHA I laugh at ASRock right now... such a scam as far as I am concerned.

Next generation number should always be better than previous generation number and not worse.

IS THAT WEIRD OR WHAT ?!

Let me know your thoughts on this new X-FILES EPISODE ! =D

Bye,
Skybuck.
  #49  
Old July 17th 19, 03:46 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
Paul[_28_]
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Posts: 1,467
Default Tachi X570 has only 1 gigabit ethernetport kinda disappointing(not future-proof, no 10 GBe)

wrote:
In this video the guy is talking about how to get 10 GbE on the cheap:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuyuS04lD4o

And then funny and weird thing the guy says is that the

X470 Tachi Ultimate motherboard (so the previous generation) does have 10 GbE.

HOLY****, HOLY****.

So now the new one X570 Tachi "normal" edition doesn't ! HAHAHA I laugh at ASRock right now... such a scam as far as I am concerned.

Next generation number should always be better than previous generation number and not worse.

IS THAT WEIRD OR WHAT ?!

Let me know your thoughts on this new X-FILES EPISODE ! =D

Bye,
Skybuck.


In the business, these are known as "novelty items".

When the cheap 10GbE came out, they knew adding one
to a motherboard, would raise the price by $50 or more.

They can only add such a thing to a premium motherboard
for one generation.

Otherwise, the Killer NIC is the result. The Killer NIC
is an example of a novelty which has "overstayed its welcome".
Many buyers *hate* the Killer NIC. Seeing that branding,
drives them away from buying the motherboard.

It's better to add novelty items for only one generation,
so that the novelty does not wear off.

This is why you can't have 10GbE, until it becomes
a "commodity" and Realtek makes a 10GbE. Their 2.5GbE
is nice, but it's just not the right item.

Stopping at 2.5GbE is what I'd call "gradualism".
You are dribbling out change, in insignificant steps.
People can hate you for that, too.

Imagine the visceral reaction you'd have, if the
motherboard you wanted, happened to have a 100BT NIC
on it. You'd be *outraged*. Well, the same thing will
eventually happen to the owners of the 2.5GbE stuff.
They're going to feel cheated.

Paul
  #50  
Old July 17th 19, 11:36 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
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Default Tachi X570 has only 1 gigabit ethernetport kinda disappointing(not future-proof, no 10 GBe)

On Wednesday, July 17, 2019 at 10:46:38 AM UTC+8, Paul wrote:

This is why you can't have 10GbE, until it becomes
a "commodity" and Realtek makes a 10GbE. Their 2.5GbE
is nice, but it's just not the right item.

Stopping at 2.5GbE is what I'd call "gradualism".
You are dribbling out change, in insignificant steps.
People can hate you for that, too.


I saw a similar argument in another forum - people yelling that that
it should jump 10x
But what happens above 10Gbe? You get 25, 40, 50, 100, 200....
And everything else (CPU, GPU, RAM, disk) has gradual improvements.
 




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