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What wears out in an HDD?



 
 
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  #41  
Old January 17th 16, 10:05 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware,general,alt.windows7.general,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
Rod Speed
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Posts: 8,559
Default What wears out in an HDD?

Ant wrote

Users learned how to bend things back
into place after too many head bangings.


Even sillier than you usually manage.


Oh, for the good old days !


You're free to use them again any time you like.


IIRC, you had to park the drives with software like on
3.5" floppy disk(ette)s if the drives were being moved.


Nope, you've mangled that utterly. There was
no need to do that with 3.5" floppy drives.

I know I did this on my IBM PS/2
model 30 286 10 Mhz desktop PC!


You got the story completely scrambled.

It was possible to park the heads with the early
hard drives that didn’t do anything special
when powered down and saw the heads land
on the platters when they stopped rotating.

  #42  
Old January 17th 16, 10:26 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware,general,alt.windows7.general,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
Ant[_3_]
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Posts: 756
Default What wears out in an HDD?

On 1/17/2016 1:05 AM, Rod Speed wrote:

Users learned how to bend things back
into place after too many head bangings.


Even sillier than you usually manage.


Oh, for the good old days !


You're free to use them again any time you like.


IIRC, you had to park the drives with software like on
3.5" floppy disk(ette)s if the drives were being moved.


Nope, you've mangled that utterly. There was
no need to do that with 3.5" floppy drives.


No, I meant parking HDDs with 3.5" bootable floppy disks with their park
software.


I know I did this on my IBM PS/2
model 30 286 10 Mhz desktop PC!


You got the story completely scrambled.

It was possible to park the heads with the early
hard drives that didn’t do anything special
when powered down and saw the heads land
on the platters when they stopped rotating.


Then, why did IBM say to manually park when moving my IBM PS/2 model 30
286 desktop machine?
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  #43  
Old January 17th 16, 12:48 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware,alt.windows7.general,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
Paul
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Posts: 13,364
Default What wears out in an HDD?

Ant wrote:


Then, why did IBM say to manually park when moving my IBM PS/2 model 30
286 desktop machine?


At one time, heads landed on the platter, with no special
provisions. But stiction resulted in the heads sticking to
the platter, and suddenly a user would discover the
motor could not spin at startup. I think one of my first
drives, possibly a Quantum, was supposed to suffer
from that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stiction (see hard drive section)

They put a textured landing zone on the platter, with
the idea being that the textured area would prevent
the heads from sticking. This would work fine, as long
as the OS knows it is supposed to position the heads
over that area, before the power goes off. I don't
even know if there was a special IDE command for that,
an out-of-bounds address, or some other trick to get
it there.

Later, we got loading ramps. And on looking at this, I jumped
to the wrong conclusion.

https://www.hgst.com/sites/default/f...aper_FINAL.pdf

The "thing" on the very end of the arm, the "pointy part",
is the lift tab. The slider is actually underneath the
end of the body of the arm, somewhat back from the lift
tab. You can see the wires leading up to the slider, to
give some idea where it is.

https://patents.google.com/patent/US6288876B1/en

That particular patent, is about some sort of annealing
technique, to make the bottom of the lift tab really
smooth, so it doesn't kick up as much crap on every
ramp landing. The hard drive specification allows it
to go up that ramp 300,000 times.

Paul
  #44  
Old January 17th 16, 01:06 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware,general,alt.windows7.general,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
J. P. Gilliver (John)
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Posts: 115
Default What wears out in an HDD?

In message , Ant
writes:
On 1/17/2016 1:05 AM, Rod Speed wrote:

[]
Nope, you've mangled that utterly. There was
no need to do that with 3.5" floppy drives.


No, I meant parking HDDs with 3.5" bootable floppy disks with their
park software.

I don't remember ever coming across _bootable_ park commands; I remember
ones that could be copied to the HD itself, and called from DOS.
[]
It was possible to park the heads with the early
hard drives that didn’t do anything special
when powered down and saw the heads land
on the platters when they stopped rotating.


Then, why did IBM say to manually park when moving my IBM PS/2 model 30
286 desktop machine?


To move the head into a normally not used part of the disc, so any
damage [to the disc] caused by "landing" didn't matter (which according
to posts in this thread may have also been textured to reduce stiction).
--
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although in the end, decent people being eaten alive by heartless monsters
running amok proved no distraction. - Eddie Mair, RT 2015/7/4-10
  #45  
Old January 17th 16, 07:07 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware,general,alt.windows7.general,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
Mark Lloyd[_6_]
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Posts: 37
Default What wears out in an HDD?

On 01/17/2016 06:06 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

[snip]

To move the head into a normally not used part of the disc, so any
damage [to the disc] caused by "landing" didn't matter (which according
to posts in this thread may have also been textured to reduce stiction).


IIRC, I had a program called "autopark", which would move the heads to
"number of cylinders" after a certain amount of non-use. Since cylinder
numbers went from 0 to "number of cylinders"-1, "number of cylinders"
itself would be an unused area.

--
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http://notstupid.us/

"And then, one Thursday nearly two thousand years after one man had been
nailed to a tree for saying how great it would be to be nice to people
for a change..."
  #46  
Old January 17th 16, 07:44 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware,general,alt.windows7.general,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
Rod Speed
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8,559
Default What wears out in an HDD?

Ant wrote
Rod Speed wrote


Users learned how to bend things back
into place after too many head bangings.


Even sillier than you usually manage.


Oh, for the good old days !


You're free to use them again any time you like.


IIRC, you had to park the drives with software like on
3.5" floppy disk(ette)s if the drives were being moved.


Nope, you've mangled that utterly. There was
no need to do that with 3.5" floppy drives.


No, I meant parking HDDs with 3.5" bootable floppy disks with their park
software.


OK, but there was no need to run that from
a bootable floppy, you could run it from the
hard drive, park the heads, turn the system off.

I know I did this on my IBM PS/2
model 30 286 10 Mhz desktop PC!


You got the story completely scrambled.


It was possible to park the heads with the early
hard drives that didn’t do anything special
when powered down and saw the heads land
on the platters when they stopped rotating.


Then, why did IBM say to manually park when moving my IBM PS/2 model 30
286 desktop machine?


Because those drives just left the heads where they
happened to be when the drive was powered down.

  #47  
Old January 18th 16, 07:02 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware,general,alt.windows7.general,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
masonc
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8
Default What wears out in an HDD?

On Fri, 15 Jan 2016 19:50:41 +1100, "Rod Speed"
wrote:

masonc wrote
Rod Speed wrote


So what clicks when the drive breaks?


That's mostly the drive moving the heads to a known
spot to recalibrate the position of the head arm.


You kids


I'm older than you thanks, child.


I couldn't believe that I was seeing "Rod Speed"
Now I believe. Takes me back to Netcom days.

RoDbot

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