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IBM T22 CMOS Battery Connector



 
 
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  #22  
Old March 25th 13, 04:09 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
Paul
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Posts: 13,364
Default IBM T22 CMOS Battery Connector

Patrick wrote:
wrote:
On Friday, March 22, 2013 3:24:33 AM UTC-4, Paul wrote:
Patrick wrote:

wrote:
On Thursday, March 21, 2013 9:37:46 AM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:
Patrick wrote:
wrote:
On Monday, March 18, 2013 10:13:47 PM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:
wrote:

Can EPROMS be de-soldered form the PCB? Or the data intentionally
overwritten? (Provided that is my problem). I'd of course have to
locate the chip.


I have found this;
http://sodoityourself.com/hacking-ib...bios-password/

Hardware-wise it requires a few Resistors and Diodes, another PC with a
SerialPort and a plug to go into said SerialPort.

Here is the address to get the required Software;
http://www.allservice.ro/store/utils/

Or download the two ZIP files from DropBox where I have copied them
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fqrhlue845...08_setup.zip?m
https://www.dropbox.com/s/rapgeymadu...bmpass21.zip?m


The Romanian site (or at least, some Romanian site) used to charge $50 :-)

And when I saw that solution advertised for $50, at the time there
were no details about electrical connections. It was just "give us
the $50 and we give you a solution".

As for the circuit, I had to think about that for a moment.

http://sodoityourself.com/wp-content...12/circuit.JPG

The Zener diodes, clip the bipolar signals on both sides. The
Zener limits positive going signals to +5V, and in the other direction,
clips to -0.7V. If I was building that circuit, I'd put a Schottky
in parallel with each Zener, as the Schottky can clip a bit lower
than the 0.7V value, and then the 24F08 is better protected against
any potential undershoot. (RS232 can span -25V to +25V, but normally
computer implementations are limited to -12V to +12V by the power supply
available.)

Also, you don't have to solder to the DIP. You could make the
connection with any of several different styles of logic
analyzer clips. You can also get circular leads that slide
over the ends of these clips.

http://www.eleshop.nl/images/product_ZP-icclip1.jpg

We used to have all sorts of these for the lab, even big
ones for the big DIPs they made years ago. This is a better
brand (smooth pins on the top).

http://www.pctestinstruments.com/images/dip_clip.jpg

There are various kinds of grabber clips, and you can
get some along the same lines as these, for clipping to
ICs with closer lead spacing. But these can be expensive.
So this is another way of clipping onto the 8 pin DIP.

http://www.sinequanon.co.uk/images/FD2K4.JPG

Here's another example of a grabber clip in action, so
you don't have to solder to the board.

http://img.auctiva.com/imgdata/1/1/3...04429593_o.jpg

That looks like a fun project.

Paul
  #23  
Old March 28th 13, 01:50 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
Patrick[_9_]
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Posts: 11
Default IBM T22 CMOS Battery Connector

Patrick wrote:
wrote:
On Friday, March 22, 2013 3:24:33 AM UTC-4, Paul wrote:
Patrick wrote:

wrote:

On Thursday, March 21, 2013 9:37:46 AM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:

Patrick wrote:



wrote:

On Monday, March 18, 2013 10:13:47 PM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:

wrote:


Can EPROMS be de-soldered form the PCB? Or the data intentionally
overwritten? (Provided that is my problem). I'd of course have to
locate the chip.


I have found this;
http://sodoityourself.com/hacking-ib...bios-password/

Hardware-wise it requires a few Resistors and Diodes, another PC with
a SerialPort and a plug to go into said SerialPort.

Here is the address to get the required Software;
http://www.allservice.ro/store/utils/

Or download the two ZIP files from DropBox where I have copied them
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fqrhlue845...08_setup.zip?m
https://www.dropbox.com/s/rapgeymadu...bmpass21.zip?m


Something else that I have found is that the significant/relevant chip
(ATMEL 24RF08) is underneath the Memory module bay on the my T22. It's a 7*2
(14) pin chip, (Google the chipname to see 2 versions, 14pin and 8pin).


  #25  
Old March 30th 13, 06:17 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
[email protected]
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Posts: 53
Default IBM T22 CMOS Battery Connector

On Saturday, March 23, 2013 1:37:01 PM UTC-4, Paul wrote:
wrote: On Friday, March 22, 2013 3:24:33 AM UTC-4, Paul wrote: Patrick wrote: wrote: On Thursday, March 21, 2013 9:37:46 AM UTC-4, Patrick wrote: Patrick wrote: wrote: On Monday, March 18, 2013 10:13:47 PM UTC-4, Patrick wrote: wrote: I was given an IBM T22 laptop about 4-1/2 years ago and it has been gathering dust ever since. I took it out and powered on, but there is a password set and so I Do you mean that the BIOS has a password or that the OperatingSystem has a password ? I'm guessing the BIOS. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. So what error report do you get when you turn it on, do you perhaps get a blank screen or a screen with a single '-' cursor flashing in the top-left, or; Do you get this screen; Sorry, I gave a wrong link, heres the right one ! https://www.dropbox.com/s/1tp845a98m...DCP00610.JPG?m I have just been messing with mine and the CPU-fan is now working, I am running on AC (Mains). I have disconnected the CMOS-battery to see if it still boots and it does and I get the above Screen. If I press F1 to go into the BIOS, it complains but goes into the BIOS. Yes. I get that screen. I decided to pull some more and this time the connector came out with the red wire. I put the main battery back in and powered up. But for some reason I still need a password regardless of whether I wait, press F1 or F12. http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps9303f75f.jpg http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...psd628a163.jpg http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...psd152c60c.jpg Looks bad, apparently if it's a 'Supervisor Password' the only option is the right PW or a new Mobo. Heres a link to a 'Lenova' T2X forum anyway; http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewforum.php?f=28 http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...psdeb9a7f6.jpg Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. There are two kinds of hardware implementations. 1) Trivial kind. Both passwords are stored in CMOS RAM. Pull the battery, and "poof!", no more password. Low security computers use this method. I like this implementation, because the user is not lulled into a false sense of security. 2) Business people expect high security ( :-) ) computers. For this purpose, some of the business laptops, use a separate 2K EEPROM to hold the password. You can pull the CMOS battery all you want, and you aren't going to erase that one. For the wily hacker, this is no problem at all. For the end user, it's a disaster. So that's the challenge you could be facing, depending on the situation. The password can be hiding in an EEPROM. And when hacking computers like that, remember that some of them are wired to self-destruct. For example, some computer hard drives, the contents are encrypted, and are *relying* on TPM information to work properly. If, in your ultimate cleverness, you decide to reset the TPM, you could forever lose access to the encrypted information. So some of the implementations in modern computers, if you "reset them", it could lead to data loss. (The owner of the computer, was probably too stupid to make the "key disk" to recover the data in an emergency. Usually situations like that, the manufacturer provides a second method so there won't be data loss. You have to prepare the recovery floppy or USB key in advance.) There are even a few computers, where you can't add hard drives to the computer, without the drive being "branded". So something is written to the disk, to make it "acceptable" to the computer. If the end-user goes to Walmart and buys a hard drive, they discover it just won't work. While for the most part, modern computers are "open" systems, you will occasionally run into surprises. And the "I can't erase the password" problem, is one of the more common surprises. And a business-class laptop, is more likely to use the EEPROM method. All my computers I have here, are the low security kind - pulling the battery, is the only procedure I need. Paul Can EPROMS be de-soldered form the PCB? Or the data intentionally overwritten? (Provided that is my problem). I'd of course have to locate the chip. And while we're on the subject of Lenovo PCs, I'll check out that forum Patrick mentioned. BTW. I have some disks. Does anyone know what PC uses these?: http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps1c781109.jpg http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...psdcfac635.jpg http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps2d00385b.jpg Thanks. Darren Harris Staten Island, New York. Discs like that, could be used on more than one model of computer. The software is activated by the presence of "SLIC" info in the Lenovo BIOS. The idea is, if I try to install that disc on my Asus motherboard, then the OS shouldn't activate. Whereas, if a Lenovo BIOS is present on the motherboard, the OS should be activated immediately. Whether that disc works on everything, may depend on drivers. If the BIOS, IDE interfaces are set to Compatible or Enhanced, then the default disk drivers may work immediately. And perhaps you'd need to add video drivers, to make the installation complete (if the computer is different than the one it was intended for). If you were using a newer computer, with the interface jammed into AHCI mode, then maybe it wouldn't boot after installation. I've even heard of a few discs, older ones, where they work with any motherboard (when really, they shouldn't). Undoubtedly, someone out there knows all the ins and outs of those things, where they'll work and won't work. If they're Lenovo branded, then try them on a Lenovo computer. See the "SLIC" section here for more details. SLIC is for "branded OEM" discs. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BIOS#SLIC Paul


Thanks.

I'll have to look into what I may get that would make these discs useful. I'd hate to have to throw them out.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
  #26  
Old March 30th 13, 06:19 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
[email protected]
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Posts: 53
Default IBM T22 CMOS Battery Connector

On Sunday, March 24, 2013 9:02:11 PM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:
wrote: On Friday, March 22, 2013 3:24:33 AM UTC-4, Paul wrote: Patrick wrote: wrote: On Thursday, March 21, 2013 9:37:46 AM UTC-4, Patrick wrote: Patrick wrote: wrote: On Monday, March 18, 2013 10:13:47 PM UTC-4, Patrick wrote: wrote: Can EPROMS be de-soldered form the PCB? Or the data intentionally overwritten? (Provided that is my problem). I'd of course have to locate the chip. I have found this; http://sodoityourself.com/hacking-ib...bios-password/ Hardware-wise it requires a few Resistors and Diodes, another PC with a SerialPort and a plug to go into said SerialPort. Here is the address to get the required Software; http://www.allservice.ro/store/utils/ Or download the two ZIP files from DropBox where I have copied them https://www.dropbox.com/s/fqrhlue845...08_setup.zip?m https://www.dropbox.com/s/rapgeymadu...bmpass21.zip?m


Thanks.

It looks like that might be my only option.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
  #27  
Old March 30th 13, 06:24 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
[email protected]
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Posts: 53
Default IBM T22 CMOS Battery Connector

On Thursday, March 28, 2013 8:49:10 PM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:
wrote: On Friday, March 22, 2013 3:24:33 AM UTC-4, Paul wrote: Patrick wrote: wrote: On Thursday, March 21, 2013 9:37:46 AM UTC-4, Patrick wrote: Patrick wrote: wrote: On Monday, March 18, 2013 10:13:47 PM UTC-4, Patrick wrote: wrote: Can EPROMS be de-soldered form the PCB? Or the data intentionally overwritten? (Provided that is my problem). I'd of course have to locate the chip. On my T22, I found the chip (ATMEL 24RF08CT) to be under the MemoryBay cover, please see these pictures, one with a memory card and the other with the MemCard removed. https://www.dropbox.com/sh/bamxk31w7...VkQb2norJo?m#/


So I can only assume that it is in the same location on mine.

I was curious. On this page I saw some apps that are basically password finders. (Some links don't work and you have to plug the info into Google to find latest versions).

http://www.bioscentral.com/misc/downloads.htm

Is it plausible I maight find an option like that to use?

Thanks.

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
  #28  
Old May 29th 13, 10:57 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
[email protected]
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Posts: 53
Default IBM T22 CMOS Battery Connector

On Thursday, March 28, 2013 8:49:10 PM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:
wrote:

On Friday, March 22, 2013 3:24:33 AM UTC-4, Paul wrote:


Patrick wrote:




wrote:



On Thursday, March 21, 2013 9:37:46 AM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:




Patrick wrote:








wrote:



On Monday, March 18, 2013 10:13:47 PM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:




wrote:





Can EPROMS be de-soldered form the PCB? Or the data intentionally


overwritten? (Provided that is my problem). I'd of course have to


locate the chip.




On my T22, I found the chip (ATMEL 24RF08CT) to be under the MemoryBay

cover, please see these pictures, one with a memory card and the other with

the MemCard removed.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/bamxk31w7...VkQb2norJo?m#/


I found mine in the same location.

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps554bb7be.jpg

The problem now is that it is the 14 pin chip. I'm not sure what size wire I should be using, but I have tons of 18 and 20 gauge, which are obviously too large. Not to mention my lately unsteady hands.

(If small wire is not sold at Radio Shack I have a problem).

Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.
  #29  
Old May 29th 13, 11:56 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
Patrick[_8_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 33
Default IBM T22 CMOS Battery Connector

wrote:
On Thursday, March 28, 2013 8:49:10 PM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:
wrote:

On Friday, March 22, 2013 3:24:33 AM UTC-4, Paul wrote:


Patrick wrote:




wrote:



On Thursday, March 21, 2013 9:37:46 AM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:




Patrick wrote:








wrote:



On Monday, March 18, 2013 10:13:47 PM UTC-4, Patrick wrote:




wrote:





Can EPROMS be de-soldered form the PCB? Or the data intentionally


overwritten? (Provided that is my problem). I'd of course have to


locate the chip.




On my T22, I found the chip (ATMEL 24RF08CT) to be under the
MemoryBay

cover, please see these pictures, one with a memory card and the
other with

the MemCard removed.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/bamxk31w7...VkQb2norJo?m#/


I found mine in the same location.

http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps554bb7be.jpg


Good picture that!

Heres a few pictures that might be usefull and that you may not have seen!
(Like the one where the 'mask' is used to protect rest of the PCB (like
doing medical-surgery ))
..

The problem now is that it is the 14 pin chip. I'm not sure what size
wire I should be using, but I have tons of 18 and 20 gauge, which are
obviously too large. Not to mention my lately unsteady hands.

(If small wire is not sold at Radio Shack I have a problem).


On the forum where it is discussed, the best idea seemed to be to connect
the Gnd wire to the VGA screw, and then to solder needles to the other two
wires from the interface and use them as probes to the IC until the program
has finished. (assistant needed to press 'Enter' etc.,)



Darren Harris
Staten Island, New York.



  #30  
Old May 30th 13, 12:09 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
Patrick[_8_]
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Posts: 33
Default IBM T22 CMOS Battery Connector

Heres a few pictures that might be usefull and that you may not have
seen! (Like the one where the 'mask' is used to protect rest of the
PCB (like doing medical-surgery ))


Sorry! heres the link I forgot in above post!
https://www.dropbox.com/home/atmel#!/home/atmel

..


 




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