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iP4300 - who decides which black to use?



 
 
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  #1  
Old December 8th 07, 11:06 PM posted to comp.periphs.printers
DougL
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Posts: 4
Default iP4300 - who decides which black to use?

I have a Canon iP4300 - works great. I refill the tanks regularly
myself.

I've always been curious about the two black tanks. Yes, I understand
that one is for dye-based black, and one is for pigment-based black,
and I can look up why one is better than the other for some things.
But what I don't understand is how the printer knows which one to use.

I do mostly "gray scale" text printing, and the large (pigment-based)
black tank is the one that more often needs refilling. (Now, some say
that dye-based inks are better for text, which seems to suggest that
the printer is using the wrong one.)

I would have to assume that the driver settings dictate how the
printer decides which ink to use. I think I saw one post in which the
author said that the "media type" specified by the user in the print
driver determined this, in that the dye based ink was used for "photo
paper" and that the pigmented ink was used for "plain paper". But I
*never* choose "photo paper" in the driver on my printer, and I do
seem to use some dye-based black. And there are many more media
options than "plain paper" and "photo paper".

So there must be a "rule" that the printer uses to chose which black
to use. What is it?

Doug
  #2  
Old December 9th 07, 12:08 AM posted to comp.periphs.printers
Paul Heslop
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Posts: 355
Default iP4300 - who decides which black to use?

DougL wrote:

I have a Canon iP4300 - works great. I refill the tanks regularly
myself.


So there must be a "rule" that the printer uses to chose which black
to use. What is it?

Doug


I may be totally wrong but is not to do with quality? If you set to
lower quality, hi speed printing it uses the big black tank, but on
low speed high quality it is more likely to use the other. I can't
swear on this but that's how I understand it to work

--
Paul (We won't die of devotion)
-------------------------------------------------------
Stop and Look
http://www.geocities.com/dreamst8me/
  #3  
Old December 9th 07, 12:43 AM posted to comp.periphs.printers
DanG
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Posts: 201
Default iP4300 - who decides which black to use?


"DougL" wrote in message
...
I have a Canon iP4300 - works great. I refill the tanks regularly
myself.

I've always been curious about the two black tanks. Yes, I understand
that one is for dye-based black, and one is for pigment-based black,
and I can look up why one is better than the other for some things.
But what I don't understand is how the printer knows which one to use.

I do mostly "gray scale" text printing, and the large (pigment-based)
black tank is the one that more often needs refilling. (Now, some say
that dye-based inks are better for text, which seems to suggest that
the printer is using the wrong one.)

I would have to assume that the driver settings dictate how the
printer decides which ink to use. I think I saw one post in which the
author said that the "media type" specified by the user in the print
driver determined this, in that the dye based ink was used for "photo
paper" and that the pigmented ink was used for "plain paper". But I
*never* choose "photo paper" in the driver on my printer, and I do
seem to use some dye-based black. And there are many more media
options than "plain paper" and "photo paper".

So there must be a "rule" that the printer uses to chose which black
to use. What is it?

Doug


Plain paper = pigment

Duplex and other paper types = dye.

If you use other settings besides "normal quality", results may vary. The
printer will use some of all inks every time it runs a cleaning cycle.


  #4  
Old December 9th 07, 01:48 AM posted to comp.periphs.printers
measekite
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Posts: 3,433
Default iP4300 - who decides which black to use?



DougL wrote:
I have a Canon iP4300 - works great. I refill the tanks regularly
myself.

Why do you want to risk a real good printer, get more fadable prints and
not get all of the quality that you paid for when you bought the printer
I've always been curious about the two black tanks. Yes, I understand
that one is for dye-based black, and one is for pigment-based black,
and I can look up why one is better than the other for some things.
But what I don't understand is how the printer knows which one to use.


It get fooled if you do not use Canon ink. I think that Canon has some
kind of information particles in there ink for the printer to figure out.
I do mostly "gray scale" text printing, and the large (pigment-based)
black tank is the one that more often needs refilling. (Now, some say
that dye-based inks are better for text, which seems to suggest that
the printer is using the wrong one.)

I would have to assume that the driver settings dictate how the
printer decides which ink to use. I think I saw one post in which the
author said that the "media type" specified by the user in the print
driver determined this, in that the dye based ink was used for "photo
paper" and that the pigmented ink was used for "plain paper". But I
*never* choose "photo paper" in the driver on my printer, and I do
seem to use some dye-based black. And there are many more media
options than "plain paper" and "photo paper".

So there must be a "rule" that the printer uses to chose which black
to use. What is it?

Doug

  #5  
Old December 9th 07, 04:26 AM posted to comp.periphs.printers
DougL
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4
Default iP4300 - who decides which black to use?


Plain paper = pigment

Duplex and other paper types = dye.



Hmmm. Well, I do use duplex occasionally, but I never use other paper
types, as it turns out.

So, um, why does duplex need dye?
  #6  
Old December 9th 07, 04:51 AM posted to comp.periphs.printers
Taliesyn
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 306
Default iP4300 - who decides which black to use?

DougL wrote:

Plain paper = pigment

Duplex and other paper types = dye.




Hmmm. Well, I do use duplex occasionally, but I never use other paper
types, as it turns out.

So, um, why does duplex need dye?



Canon had to program it that way because of ink drying problems using
duplex. In Duplex printing the printer feeds the paper in and out
several times. You can't have wet ink going back into the printer -
prints and rollers will smudge. Even with faster drying dye ink the
process is slower than molasses in winter. Far easier and up to 3 times
faster if you print one side of the documents, flip them over and then
print the other side (or odd pages and then even numbered pages). Duplex
printing, in case you didn't know, actually uses all the colors to make
that "black", which isn't quite black, it's more like a dark grey.
Compare the two (pigment and composite dye black) and the difference is
quite big, and I find not acceptable. I won't use duplex if my life
depended on it. I tried it once. Never again. Wear and tear on the
machine and a useless waste of good color ink.

-Taliesyn
  #7  
Old December 9th 07, 05:15 AM posted to comp.periphs.printers
DougL
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4
Default iP4300 - who decides which black to use?



So, um, why does duplex need dye?


Canon had to program it that way because of ink drying problems using
duplex. In Duplex printing the printer feeds the paper in and out
several times. You can't have wet ink going back into the printer -
prints and rollers will smudge. Even with faster drying dye ink the
process is slower than molasses in winter. Far easier and up to 3 times
faster if you print one side of the documents, flip them over and then
print the other side (or odd pages and then even numbered pages). Duplex
printing, in case you didn't know, actually uses all the colors to make
that "black", which isn't quite black, it's more like a dark grey.
Compare the two (pigment and composite dye black) and the difference is
quite big, and I find not acceptable. I won't use duplex if my life
depended on it. I tried it once. Never again. Wear and tear on the
machine and a useless waste of good color ink.

-Taliesyn


That would explain why the printer would use dye inks for duplex. But
why would the iP4300 use color dye inks to make black? It has a black
dye tank right there. Are you saying that printers without black dye
ink make duplex black from colors?
  #8  
Old December 9th 07, 05:15 AM posted to comp.periphs.printers
DougL
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4
Default iP4300 - who decides which black to use?



So, um, why does duplex need dye?


Canon had to program it that way because of ink drying problems using
duplex. In Duplex printing the printer feeds the paper in and out
several times. You can't have wet ink going back into the printer -
prints and rollers will smudge. Even with faster drying dye ink the
process is slower than molasses in winter. Far easier and up to 3 times
faster if you print one side of the documents, flip them over and then
print the other side (or odd pages and then even numbered pages). Duplex
printing, in case you didn't know, actually uses all the colors to make
that "black", which isn't quite black, it's more like a dark grey.
Compare the two (pigment and composite dye black) and the difference is
quite big, and I find not acceptable. I won't use duplex if my life
depended on it. I tried it once. Never again. Wear and tear on the
machine and a useless waste of good color ink.

-Taliesyn


That would explain why the printer would use dye inks for duplex. But
why would the iP4300 use color dye inks to make black? It has a black
dye tank right there. Are you saying that printers without black dye
ink make duplex black from colors?
  #9  
Old December 9th 07, 05:16 AM posted to comp.periphs.printers
measekite
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,433
Default iP4300 - who decides which black to use?



DougL wrote:

Plain paper = pigment Duplex and other paper types = dye.



Hmmm. Well, I do use duplex occasionally, but I never use other paper types, as it turns out. So, um, why does duplex need dye?


So you do not reaD the print from the other side.
  #10  
Old December 9th 07, 05:21 AM posted to comp.periphs.printers
measekite
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,433
Default iP4300 - who decides which black to use?



Taliesyn wrote:
DougL wrote:

Plain paper = pigment

Duplex and other paper types = dye.




Hmmm. Well, I do use duplex occasionally, but I never use other paper
types, as it turns out.

So, um, why does duplex need dye?



Canon had to program it that way because of ink drying problems using
duplex. In Duplex printing the printer feeds the paper in and out
several times. You can't have wet ink going back into the printer -
prints and rollers will smudge. Even with faster drying dye ink the
process is slower than molasses in winter. Far easier


You cannot listen to high school kids. Let say you want to print a long
webpage that may consist of 5 to 7 printed pages. The duplex printing
will do it for you automatically. Press the button and then grab a
coffee or do something else on your computer and shortly it is done.
You do not have to measure or calculate anything. The kid does not know
what he is talking about. That is why he does not even have a diploma.
and up to 3 times
faster if you print one side of the documents, flip them over and then
print the other side (or odd pages and then even numbered pages).

Try it with a website.
Duplex
printing, in case you didn't know, actually uses all the colors to make
that "black", which isn't quite black, it's more like a dark grey.
Compare the two (pigment and composite dye black) and the difference is
quite big, and I find not acceptable.


Most intelligent business people find it very acceptable.
I won't use duplex if my life
depended on it.

Who cares.
I tried it once. Never again. Wear and tear on the
machine and a useless waste of good color ink.

No more wear and tear. Canon deisgned the machine to do it and there
are no problem. I also have it on my HP and have been printing duplex
for many many years. No Problemo.

-Taliesyn

 




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