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#21
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Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
Rod Speed wrote:
" Most current drives dont idle at 10W.... ....Dont believe it, list the model number. " Select the drop-down menu. Choose each of the bottom four tests and sort. The second resulting table lists the numbers clearer. http://www.storagereview.com/comparison.html That should put the cat among the pigeons. |
#22
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Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
Cuzman wrote: Rod Speed wrote: " Most current drives dont idle at 10W.... ....Dont believe it, list the model number. " Select the drop-down menu. Choose each of the bottom four tests and sort. The second resulting table lists the numbers clearer. http://www.storagereview.com/comparison.html That should put the cat among the pigeons. Yes Dorothy was right all along. |
#23
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Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
Cuzman wrote
Rod Speed wrote John Jordan wrote Rod Speed wrote John Jordan wrote idle: 10W Thats nothing like typical for 7200 rpm drives. load: 24W And neither is that. It's an extremely common drive (at least in the UK), Most current drives dont idle at 10W. Select the drop-down menu. Choose each of the bottom four tests and sort. The second resulting table lists the numbers clearer. http://www.storagereview.com/comparison.html That should put the cat among the pigeons. Nope, even someone as stupid as you should be able to work out that the idle power with commonly used drives is nothing like 10W. In spades with Dorothy's stupid 20-25W max. |
#24
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Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
Johannes wrote
Cuzman wrote Rod Speed wrote Most current drives dont idle at 10W.... Select the drop-down menu. Choose each of the bottom four tests and sort. The second resulting table lists the numbers clearer. http://www.storagereview.com/comparison.html That should put the cat among the pigeons. Yes Dorothy was right all along. Only in your pathetic little drug crazed fantasyland. |
#25
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Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
For HD I stated...
o 7200rpm 3.5" -- 10W at idle, And that is overstating it. o Go to any of the HD maker websites o Download the manufacturers specification o Read it. Stick an ammeter on a current Barracuda & older Barracuda. Do not use the 2A fused range during startup obviously. Likewise a CD-ROM may draw only a few watts, but a high end DVD-R/RAM/CDR writer multi-drive can draw 18-25W at peak. Not very often tho. PCs have a range of wattage draw re idle/loaded... o Base end office Cel2.0, integrated graphics, 1 HD, 1 optical o idle -- 85W with 17" TFT, 95W with 19" TFT o load -- 120W for 17" TFT, 130W with 19" TFT o 10000rpm 3.5" -- assume 30W re cooling needs Bad assumption. You really are a troll. HD spec of 8-17W can not be applied to cooling needs... o 8-17W is not distributed evenly over the whole drive ---- a HD is Actuator, Spindle Assembly, PCB Components o 8-17W may be focused in specific components ---- with specific maximum operating temps ---- requiring specific linear feet per min of airflow o Providing cooling for 8-17W ignores local needs ---- thermal shadowing by other components ---- thermal shadowing by case design & HD positioning Stick 2x 10,000rpm HD against one another in a drive cage. Provide sufficient cooling for 2x 8-17W drives. I will provide the data recovery firm name to use... o Motor-IC overheats from lack of linear-feet-per-min airflow o Motor-IC dumps heat into surroundings, motor/spindle heat o Motor-spindle dumps heat into FDB accelerating aging o FDB aging causes higher current draw (startup & continuous) ---- S.M.A.R.T. data measures startup Ima &/or startup Tsecs o Higher current draw heats motor/spindle & Motor-IC ---- Reinforcing System Loop of increasing thermal dissipation Same thing happens more slowly with HDs anyway - hence the older a HD the higher the startup current & higher op current. Add another HD because the old one is too small, fit them too close & you can accelerate the demise of the old one by temps. I would assume 30W re cooling needs for 10k-rpm HDs. You can assume what you wish. Likewise a CD-ROM may draw only a few watts, but a high end DVD-R/RAM/CDR writer multi-drive can draw 18-25W at peak. Not very often tho. ??? Yes but you have to assume it at SOME point re 1) cooling 2) PSU. That last is a good example of the problem with your original and you didnt even mention the AMD cpus. ??? Ah now I see. Intel tend to be worst case from a thermal perspective. -- DB. |
#26
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Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
On Sat, 22 Jul 2006 19:46:27 +1000, Rod Speed wrote:
that the idle power with commonly used drives is nothing like 10W. In spades with Dorothy's stupid 20-25W max. If you check the specs from the manufacturers websites, you''l find that most current drives do in fact have idle power dissipation around 10W. Mainstream drives. 150MB/s sata drives; Power Dissipation Read/Write 9.00 Watts Idle 8.75 Watts Standby 1.20 Watts Sleep 1.20 Watts 300MB/s sata drives; Power Dissipation Read/Write 9.50 Watts Idle 8.75 Watts Standby 1.60 Watts Sleep 1.50 Watts 100MB/s eide drives. Power Dissipation Read/Write 8.60 Watts Idle 8.10 Watts Standby 1.10 Watts Sleep 1.00 Watts http://www.wdc.com/en/products/produ...41&language=en And from Seagate. Typical Current (12VDC +/- 5%) 0.433 amps Startup Current (12VDC +/- 5%) 2.8 amps Typical Current (5VDC +/- 5%) 0.401 amps Startup Current (5VDC +/- 5%) 0.841 amps Power Seek Power (typ) 12.4 watts Read/Write Power (typ) 12.8 watts Idle Power (typ) 7.2 watts It seems their startup power would be about 38W (2.8*12)+(.8*5). This is the standard Baracuda drive family. So it seems like Dot may be a little low with only 20-25W. http://www.seagate.com/cda/products/...84,701,00.html -- Want the ultimate in free OTA SD/HDTV Recorder? http://mythtv.org http://mysettopbox.tv/knoppmyth.html Usenet alt.video.ptv.mythtv My server http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php HD Tivo S3 compared http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/mythtivo.htm |
#27
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Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
Rod Speed wrote:
" Nope, even someone as stupid as you should be able to work out that the idle power with commonly used drives is nothing like 10W. In spades with Dorothy's stupid 20-25W max. " I never agreed or disagreed with either of you. I just pointed out that it would be interesting to throw those benchmark results into the argument. They are done by a team of people likely to have more expertise on the matter than anyone in this argument. Here are some more benchmark results out there which you can use: http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/.../hddpower.html |
#28
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Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
Wes Newell wrote
Rod Speed wrote Cuzman wrote Rod Speed wrote John Jordan wrote Rod Speed wrote John Jordan wrote idle: 10W Thats nothing like typical for 7200 rpm drives. load: 24W And neither is that. It's an extremely common drive (at least in the UK), Most current drives dont idle at 10W. Select the drop-down menu. Choose each of the bottom four tests and sort. The second resulting table lists the numbers clearer. http://www.storagereview.com/comparison.html That should put the cat among the pigeons. that the idle power with commonly used drives is nothing like 10W. In spades with Dorothy's stupid 20-25W max. If you check the specs from the manufacturers websites, you''l find that most current drives do in fact have idle power dissipation around 10W. Says he ignoring the storagereview data. The reason for that is that the datasheet numbers are worst case numbers. Mainstream drives. 150MB/s sata drives; Power Dissipation Read/Write 9.00 Watts Idle 8.75 Watts Standby 1.20 Watts Sleep 1.20 Watts 300MB/s sata drives; Power Dissipation Read/Write 9.50 Watts Idle 8.75 Watts Standby 1.60 Watts Sleep 1.50 Watts 100MB/s eide drives. Power Dissipation Read/Write 8.60 Watts Idle 8.10 Watts Standby 1.10 Watts Sleep 1.00 Watts http://www.wdc.com/en/products/produ...41&language=en And from Seagate. Typical Current (12VDC +/- 5%) 0.433 amps Startup Current (12VDC +/- 5%) 2.8 amps Typical Current (5VDC +/- 5%) 0.401 amps Startup Current (5VDC +/- 5%) 0.841 amps Power Seek Power (typ) 12.4 watts Read/Write Power (typ) 12.8 watts Idle Power (typ) 7.2 watts None of those are 10W or the 20-25W max in spades. It seems their startup power would be about 38W (2.8*12)+(.8*5). This is the standard Baracuda drive family. So it seems like Dot may be a little low with only 20-25W. http://www.seagate.com/cda/products/...84,701,00.html http://www.storagereview.com/comparison.html |
#29
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Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
Cuzman wrote
Rod Speed wrote Nope, even someone as stupid as you should be able to work out that the idle power with commonly used drives is nothing like 10W. In spades with Dorothy's stupid 20-25W max. I never agreed or disagreed with either of you. You did make that silly claim about the cat and pigeons. I just pointed out that it would be interesting to throw those benchmark results into the argument. They are done by a team of people likely to have more expertise on the matter than anyone in this argument. It aint about expertise, just bothering to measure it. Here are some more benchmark results out there which you can use: http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/.../hddpower.html Which dumps on Dorothy's numbers too, like I said. And suffers from the problem that datasheets always have, the datasheet numbers are worst case numbers. |
#30
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Typical mains power for mid-range PC?
Dorothy Bradbury wrote:
For HD I stated... o 7200rpm 3.5" -- 10W at idle, And that is overstating it. o Go to any of the HD maker websites o Download the manufacturers specification o Read it. Datasheet numbers are worst case numbers and STILL most arent 10W with current desktop drives. What makes a lot more sense is http://www.storagereview.com/comparison.html which shows nothing like what you claimed. In spades with the max number. Stick an ammeter on a current Barracuda & older Barracuda. There might just be a few more drives around than those. Do not use the 2A fused range during startup obviously. Likewise a CD-ROM may draw only a few watts, but a high end DVD-R/RAM/CDR writer multi-drive can draw 18-25W at peak. Not very often tho. PCs have a range of wattage draw re idle/loaded... o Base end office Cel2.0, integrated graphics, 1 HD, 1 optical o idle -- 85W with 17" TFT, 95W with 19" TFT o load -- 120W for 17" TFT, 130W with 19" TFT Irrelevant to that bit about DVD-R/RAM/CDR writers. o 10000rpm 3.5" -- assume 30W re cooling needs Bad assumption. You really are a troll. You really are a pathetic excuse for a bull**** artist. HD spec of 8-17W can not be applied to cooling needs... Depends entirely on the case design. o 8-17W is not distributed evenly over the whole drive ---- a HD is Actuator, Spindle Assembly, PCB Components Irrelevant to your silly claim about 30W o 8-17W may be focused in specific components ---- with specific maximum operating temps ---- requiring specific linear feet per min of airflow Irrelevant to your silly claim about 30W o Providing cooling for 8-17W ignores local needs ---- thermal shadowing by other components ---- thermal shadowing by case design & HD positioning Irrelevant to your silly claim about 30W Stick 2x 10,000rpm HD against one another in a drive cage. Only the stupid do something as stupid. Provide sufficient cooling for 2x 8-17W drives. Or dont have them adjacent, stupid. I will provide the data recovery firm name to use... I'm not stupid enough to need them. o Motor-IC overheats from lack of linear-feet-per-min airflow o Motor-IC dumps heat into surroundings, motor/spindle heat o Motor-spindle dumps heat into FDB accelerating aging o FDB aging causes higher current draw (startup & continuous) ---- S.M.A.R.T. data measures startup Ima &/or startup Tsecs o Higher current draw heats motor/spindle & Motor-IC ---- Reinforcing System Loop of increasing thermal dissipation Only in that terminally stupid config. Same thing happens more slowly with HDs anyway - hence the older a HD the higher the startup current & higher op current. Add another HD because the old one is too small, fit them too close & you can accelerate the demise of the old one by temps. Only the stupid do things that stupidly. I would assume 30W re cooling needs for 10k-rpm HDs. You can assume anything you like. Anyone with a clue doesnt use such a stupid config. You can assume what you wish. I dont assume, I measure, thanks. Likewise a CD-ROM may draw only a few watts, but a high end DVD-R/RAM/CDR writer multi-drive can draw 18-25W at peak. Not very often tho. ??? Its a very simple sentence, even you should be able to manage it. Yes but you have to assume it at SOME point re 1) cooling 2) PSU. Nope. That last is a good example of the problem with your original and you didnt even mention the AMD cpus. ??? Ah now I see. Intel tend to be worst case from a thermal perspective. Wrong, as always. |
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