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ATA Reliability: Seagate, WD, Maxtor



 
 
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  #121  
Old May 11th 05, 10:30 PM
Anton Rang
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flux writes:
Hopefully, mostly in RAID boxes attached to those servers. Certainly
drives are the most common component to fail in systems. That's true


Actually, it's the LEAST likely.
No, wait, I take it back. Power supplies and fans are the LEAST likely
to fail.


See http://www.bluemax.net/docs/Motherboards/General_Info/mtbf.html --

The components that experience the highest failure rates are [...]
keyboards, mice, disk and tape drives, monitors and power supplies.

But I suppose a PC manufacturer wouldn't know. ;-)

SCSI product life is longer, allowing longterm field reliability


I think the point is that they aren't.


Technically, this is "product life", e.g. how long a particular model
is manufactured. I think you haven't said anything about that.

So maybe SATA drives can take heat better than SCSI drives?


*laugh*

It seems make sense that more drives you have, the more chance for
failure. With each extra drive, that's a whole other set of electronics,
actuators and spindle motor that can fail.


Half right. There's more chance of an individual drive failing, but
less chance of data loss, in a RAID constructed of smaller disks
(given a fixed size of the RAID and fixed parity grouping).


Your math is backward.


Which part? ;-)

For RAID 5, the mean time to data loss is

MTTF(disk)^2
----------------------
N * (G-1) * MTTR(disk)


Spare us.


:-)

-- Anton
  #122  
Old May 12th 05, 07:33 AM
flux
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In article , Anton Rang
wrote:

Actually, it's the LEAST likely.
No, wait, I take it back. Power supplies and fans are the LEAST likely
to fail.


See http://www.bluemax.net/docs/Motherboards/General_Info/mtbf.html --

The components that experience the highest failure rates are [...]
keyboards, mice, disk and tape drives, monitors and power supplies.

But I suppose a PC manufacturer wouldn't know. ;-)


At least not one apparently makes junk.

SCSI product life is longer, allowing longterm field reliability


I think the point is that they aren't.


Technically, this is "product life", e.g. how long a particular model
is manufactured. I think you haven't said anything about that.


I don't get it. longterm field reliability = product life?


So maybe SATA drives can take heat better than SCSI drives?


*laugh*


You can't have it both ways. They either stand the heat better or are not as hot.


Your math is backward.


Which part? ;-)


That was it.
  #123  
Old May 12th 05, 07:47 AM
flux
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In article , Anton Rang
wrote:

Mark Hahn writes:
They tested 300 drives of two types, SATA and FibreChannel, under 1000
continuous hours of three workloads. (The workloads were derived from


hmm. MTBF of current drives is around 1M hours, and they tested .3M hours
of operation. I don't really see why this is a meaningful sample,
especially considering the standard "bathtub" curve for expected failures.


I think the interesting bit is the comparison between failure rates under
different load, more so than the absolute values.


That's if you believe their results. And at best it just tells us that
Seagate has problems with *their* SATA drives.

In any case, we don't know what criteria are for the different loads, at
least according to these slides.

For example, does "High Duty Cycle" imply "High End Server"? The other
two refer specifically to a type of computer usage, but "High Duty
Cycle" doesn't say where that usage occurs. For that matter, it's not
really clear why random access is considered to a be "Low End Server".
Seems they both could either low or high end depending on the actual
usage. Seems to me that "High Duty Cycle" would be something a Tivo. But
even ATA drives in Tivos seem to work great. I guess they must not be
using Seagate drives.
  #124  
Old May 16th 05, 04:52 PM
Peter da Silva
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In article ,
flux wrote:
usage. Seems to me that "High Duty Cycle" would be something a Tivo. But
even ATA drives in Tivos seem to work great. I guess they must not be
using Seagate drives.


I suspect that a drive in a Tivo would have a pretty atypical access
pattern, assuming they take advantage of the fact that they're almost
always streaming data into or out of the disk. Which I would bloody well
hope they would do. This should mean massively less seeking than just
about any server workload.

--
I've seen things you people can't imagine. Chimneysweeps on fire over the roofs
of London. I've watched kite-strings glitter in the sun at Hyde Park Gate. All
these things will be lost in time, like chalk-paintings in the rain. `-_-'
Time for your nap. | Peter da Silva | Har du kramat din varg, idag? 'U`
 




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