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#11
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More or less safe to turn off power supply rocker switch?
On Mon, 12 Apr 2010 01:42:36 +0000, Nicholas Dreyer wrote:
Yes, I would never want to go through with all that Dave suggests - and doubt anyone else would, unless they have some extraordinarily valuable motherboard and hard drive setup - and didn't care about the racket, expense and environmental consequences of constantly running fans, but to get back to my unanswered question: Assuming CPU shutdown is to happen after more or less daily use of a few hours at most, does daily 5v "soft power" re-energizing of motherboard via power supply rocker switch prior to reboot add significant, or even measurable wear and tear on its circuitry? OK, ~misfit~ just answered this while I was posting the question, so I will leave the switch on permanently to avoid the strain of on/off switching on the power supply itself . . . unless of course someone has a more compelling argument favoring the alternative approach. Thanks, Nick |
#12
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More or less safe to turn off power supply rocker switch?
Some have come to the conclusion that it is better to switch everything off if the macine is going to be unused for more than 4 or 5 hours. There is a tradeoff involved, thermal shock vs continual erosion of traces, extra cost of machine repair from surge at power-up vs power load at idle. This question can generally be counted on to start a flame war. People have strong opinions and there has been little investigation to prove the results either way. |
#13
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More or less safe to turn off power supply rocker switch?
On Fri, 09 Apr 2010 19:08:51 -0400, Strobe
wrote: On 09 Apr 2010 03:26:08 GMT, Nicholas Dreyer wrote: I keep my PC on for at most a few hours a day. After it has powered down, is it safer to shut off all power to the motherboard using the toggle switch on the power supply, or is it better to leave it on, or does it not matter at all? Thanks for any advice, or pointers to some useful studies on the matter. For ultimate power economy, use the switch - modern PSUs continue to provide 5v when the PC is 'off'.. But the question remains, what is the criteria for an oversimplified question of "best"? It always annoys me when someone asks what is best when they don't list their subjective needs, because there is no such thing as best without that. To *really* economise, switch off with a cheap external power strip - it's cheaper to replace that than a PSU when the switch eventually wears out! If you aren't buying really bad low end junk, the power switch will not wear out in any number of years worth mentioning. If you live in an area prone to lightning storms, it's safer to actually unplug the PC when not in use - a nearby lightning strike on the power line can easily jump over a power switch and *might* fry your PC. Yes, but how many cords does one unplug? Power is not enough, a surge can come in through periperals, or especially ( what I see often when it occurs, with otherwise disconnected equipment) through the lan cable. Of course, at most you'll save a few dollars a year... And many other devices (TVs, microwaves, cable boxes) also suck power when they're nominally 'off'. Agreed, there is too much focus on sleep power these days, if someone is really concerned they would simply turn their PC off instead of asking. Personally I never disconnect any box from AC, including when there is a power storm, but on modern PCs that can hibernate, AND don't need to stay on 24/7, I have them (if windows OS based) hibernate after a short period of inactivity. So far, I can't recall any damage of a system while it was off as-in hibernating. Certainly it is possible damage could still occur, but as with all things there is no guarantee, only the risk versus convenience and value of time and hassle to unplug or switch things versus not having to. |
#14
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More or less safe to turn off power supply rocker switch?
On Tue, 13 Apr 2010 02:41:26 -0500, edfair
wrote: Some have come to the conclusion that it is better to switch everything off if the macine is going to be unused for more than 4 or 5 hours. There is a tradeoff involved, thermal shock vs continual erosion of traces, extra cost of machine repair from surge at power-up vs power load at idle. This question can generally be counted on to start a flame war. People have strong opinions and there has been little investigation to prove the results either way. .... but there is supporting evidence. It depends on the particular weakness of the entire *system* and by system I also mean the power grid. Basically the evidence comes from tracing fault modes, looking at dead equipment rather than formal testing long term which serves little use - by the time meaningful data was a accumulated nobody wants to build a new system with old parts and it would have to be based on the contemporary tech of the time as merely deciding a "disk drive" is a "disk drive" is not enough, the designs change too much over the years to combat failure modes as much as the design budget will allow. Will it be subject to significant power spikes? IF so then certainly turning it off at a power strip will reduce # of events seen on average. Leaving it running tends to be most problematic if it uses poor capacitors or fans so their lifespan elapses before the viable lifespan of the system is up. Turning it off tends to wear out the battery faster. Thermal shock is not much of a consideration though, if we concede it will not damage equipment signficantl within its viable lifespan which seems to be the case with all but the rare instances of manufacturing solder pad defects or in-chip solder bump defects as seen with certain chipsets in recent history. |
#15
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More or less safe to turn off power supply rocker switch?
On Thu, 15 Apr 2010 17:13:35 -0400, kony wrote:
... but there is supporting evidence. It depends on the particular weakness of the entire *system* and by system I also mean the power grid. Basically the evidence comes from tracing fault modes, looking at dead equipment rather than formal testing long term which serves little use - by the time meaningful data was a accumulated nobody wants to build a new system with old parts and it would have to be based on the contemporary tech of the time as merely deciding a "disk drive" is a "disk drive" is not enough, the designs change too much over the years to combat failure modes as much as the design budget will allow. Will it be subject to significant power spikes? IF so then certainly turning it off at a power strip will reduce # of events seen on average. Leaving it running tends to be most problematic if it uses poor capacitors or fans so their lifespan elapses before the viable lifespan of the system is up. Turning it off tends to wear out the battery faster. Thermal shock is not much of a consideration though, if we concede it will not damage equipment signficantl within its viable lifespan which seems to be the case with all but the rare instances of manufacturing solder pad defects or in-chip solder bump defects as seen with certain chipsets in recent history. Thanks for the great insights. Now I'm leaning towards turning off power supply completely again! |
#16
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More or less safe to turn off power supply rocker switch?
On 16 Apr 2010 02:19:41 GMT, Nicholas Dreyer
wrote: On Thu, 15 Apr 2010 17:13:35 -0400, kony wrote: ... but there is supporting evidence. It depends on the particular weakness of the entire *system* and by system I also mean the power grid. Basically the evidence comes from tracing fault modes, looking at dead equipment rather than formal testing long term which serves little use - by the time meaningful data was a accumulated nobody wants to build a new system with old parts and it would have to be based on the contemporary tech of the time as merely deciding a "disk drive" is a "disk drive" is not enough, the designs change too much over the years to combat failure modes as much as the design budget will allow. Will it be subject to significant power spikes? IF so then certainly turning it off at a power strip will reduce # of events seen on average. Leaving it running tends to be most problematic if it uses poor capacitors or fans so their lifespan elapses before the viable lifespan of the system is up. Turning it off tends to wear out the battery faster. Thermal shock is not much of a consideration though, if we concede it will not damage equipment signficantl within its viable lifespan which seems to be the case with all but the rare instances of manufacturing solder pad defects or in-chip solder bump defects as seen with certain chipsets in recent history. Thanks for the great insights. Now I'm leaning towards turning off power supply completely again! Up to you, but personally I never turn equipment off at the wall and don't have any problem with doing so. It uses a single-digit # of watts per system but the last power surge fault I saw was with a printer I leave on because it's a networked printer that is inconvenient to go turn off when it would be accessed by any random system on-site. Before that it was a network switch which also never gets turned off for similar reasons, a surge when through it and fried a port on it and a network adapter in a client system. Also in past years I'd found that some systems require a power reset if they come back on from power off, rather than leaving mains on all the time, so to me the chance of failure is lower than I deem the risk of leaving power connected. |
#17
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More or less safe to turn off power supply rocker switch?
On Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:20:31 -0400, kony wrote:
Up to you, but personally I never turn equipment off at the wall and don't have any problem with doing so. It uses a single-digit # of watts per system but the last power surge fault I saw was with a printer I leave on because it's a networked printer that is inconvenient to go turn off when it would be accessed by any random system on-site. Before that it was a network switch which also never gets turned off for similar reasons, a surge when through it and fried a port on it and a network adapter in a client system. Also in past years I'd found that some systems require a power reset if they come back on from power off, rather than leaving mains on all the time, so to me the chance of failure is lower than I deem the risk of leaving power connected. Well, this makes sense too. It sure is more convenient not to have to reach around and fiddle with switches every time you boot up and down. And I too have: (1) A flat screen monitor whose instructions specifically say not to use the toggle switch too frequently, (2) An HP laserjet that doesn't even have a switch, (3) a DSL modem and (4) a router, all of which are on all the time. I guess the switch will stay on for now! |
#18
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If you live in an area prone to lightning storms,
it's safer to actually unplug the PC when not in use - a nearby lightning strike on the power line can easily jump over a power switch and *might* fry your PC. it that okay now |
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