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#21
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"Conor" wrote in message ... In article , says... Remember, the idea is NOT to form a layer between the two surfaces. The purpose of the paste is to fill the valleys in the contact surfaces with something which is more efficient at transferring heat away from the CPU core than the air which would otherwise fill the gaps How I apply mine.. How I apply mine. Barely visible bit of goop on the mirror-lapped sink. Spread with a finger until the goop is invisible. Apply what's left on finger to die. Result : metal-metal contact maximised. If the goop is visible, you have the troughs filled AND the peaks covered - bad. Small pea sized lump on the heatsink. Spread thinly then scrape off with a razorblade. Very small dot on the CPU core. Spread extremely thinly so it is hardly visible. -- Conor If you're not on somebody's **** list, you're not doing anything worthwhile. |
#22
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"QBall" wrote in message
... "Conor" wrote in message ... In article , says... Remember, the idea is NOT to form a layer between the two surfaces. The purpose of the paste is to fill the valleys in the contact surfaces with something which is more efficient at transferring heat away from the CPU core than the air which would otherwise fill the gaps How I apply mine.. How I apply mine. Barely visible bit of goop on the mirror-lapped sink. Spread with a finger until the goop is invisible. Apply what's left on finger to die. Result : metal-metal contact maximised. If the goop is visible, you have the troughs filled AND the peaks covered - bad. Hmmm greasy finger goop, damn boy if you worked in my place and used your bare hands you'd be getting a **** round the back of your head... Small pea sized lump on the heatsink. Spread thinly then scrape off with a razorblade. Very small dot on the CPU core. Spread extremely thinly so it is hardly visible. -- Conor If you're not on somebody's **** list, you're not doing anything worthwhile. |
#23
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"Rob Morley" wrote in message
t... In article , "Max" says... Rob Morley wrote: Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal compound is to fill the very small scratches on the faces. Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive. Eh? You thought he meant thermally, we realised he meant electrically. I realised he could have meant either, so asked for elaboration. Actually some thermal compund is electrically conductive too, Which one? Any of the stuff that's filled with metallic particles is potentially electrically conductive. Especially since silver is one of the best electrical conductors there is.. |
#25
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"Paul Hopwood" wrote in message ... | CrackerJack wrote: | | What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the | core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area? | | Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this? | | You'll always get a little but if you are squeezing a lot out it | indicates you've applied far too much, meaning the layer of paste | between the processor die/heatspreader and heatsink is too thick. No matter how much you put on, the excess will get squeezed out buy the pressure from the HS hold down clip, your layer will always end up the same thickness. I have removed several and the "layer" looks the same on both the carefully applied with no squizz-out and the sloppy with heavy squizz. | |
#26
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Conor wrote:
In article , says... CrackerJack wrote: What exactly is the problem if too much cpu compound is put on the core and it gets squashed out onto the surrounding area? Apart from looking messy, is there any real problem with this? I propose this answer: 1) If the compound is not too viscous, and the heatsink is clamped on with some force, and you apply enough compound, the thickness of the layer of compound does not depend on the amount applied, which is to say that the excess gets squeezed out. 2) Thermal compounds are not electrically conductive. 3) Some thermal compounds (notably those containing silver compounds) have capacitative properties that can be problemmatic if compound gets between the chip's leads. 4) If you use a compound that doesn't have the problemmatic capacitative properties and is not too viscous, in general it won't hurt to use too much. 1) WRONG 2) WRONG 3) If 3 is true then 2) is wrong. You've just proved that yourself. 4) WRONG. Your reply is practically content-free. Please start with this: In what way does 3 contradict 2? |
#27
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1) If the compound is not too viscous, and the heatsink is clamped on
with some force, and you apply enough compound, the thickness of the layer of compound does not depend on the amount applied, which is to say that the excess gets squeezed out. 2) Thermal compounds are not electrically conductive. 3) Some thermal compounds (notably those containing silver compounds) have capacitative properties that can be problemmatic if compound gets between the chip's leads. 4) If you use a compound that doesn't have the problemmatic capacitative properties and is not too viscous, in general it won't hurt to use too much. 1) WRONG 2) WRONG 3) If 3 is true then 2) is wrong. You've just proved that yourself. 4) WRONG. Please start with this: In what way does 3 contradict 2? How can you have capacitive properties if a compound is not conductive? 1) Wrong becausewhen you use too much compound, pressure will not squeeze out to the same amount as if you had used the correct amount of compound to start with. 2) EVERYTHING is electrically conductive to some degree. Even glass and rubber are conductive in the right conditions. 3) True, but I've never had issues do to goo-ed up CPU's. 4) Too much compound is like wrapping your core in a blanket... It slows the transfer of heat from the core to the sink/air. |
#28
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Noozer wrote:
1) If the compound is not too viscous, and the heatsink is clamped on with some force, and you apply enough compound, the thickness of the layer of compound does not depend on the amount applied, which is to say that the excess gets squeezed out. 2) Thermal compounds are not electrically conductive. 3) Some thermal compounds (notably those containing silver compounds) have capacitative properties that can be problemmatic if compound gets between the chip's leads. 4) If you use a compound that doesn't have the problemmatic capacitative properties and is not too viscous, in general it won't hurt to use too much. 1) WRONG 2) WRONG 3) If 3 is true then 2) is wrong. You've just proved that yourself. 4) WRONG. Please start with this: In what way does 3 contradict 2? How can you have capacitive properties if a compound is not conductive? 1) Wrong becausewhen you use too much compound, pressure will not squeeze out to the same amount as if you had used the correct amount of compound to start with. I'me no AMD expert but i think basic physics will tell you that even with a high friction coeficient between compound and material, a high preassure like that will spread the relativley non-viscous compound to its optimal value, PROVIDED that there are no air bubles or other colloidal elements. 2) EVERYTHING is electrically conductive to some degree. Even glass and rubber are conductive in the right conditions. Thats a pretty simplified view. I think your mixing up conductivity with dielectric. Electrons can stream between anode and cathode with resistance but "conductivity" comes from fermi-dirac effects within the metal (not to be confused with the fermi level). Basically the easy ionization of metals is what causes its high conductivity (because there are electrons so close to the fermi level). You might get quantum tunelling effects but thats another story. In fact if you put a high enough charge through a molecule like, for example a protein, you will destroy the protein's bindings before you end up getting any real conductivity. It works like this. For an electron do steam through a material, thats dielectric. For an electron to conduct through a metal by going through orbits, thats conductivity. And i think your ignoring that the minute, minute, minute conductivity of the thermal compound might not be even tnough to short out anything because remember the components do have a threshold value. I wouldn't worry about conductivity. If it was soo easily conductive, wouldn't the huge EM field coming from the processor affect it also? 3) True, but I've never had issues do to goo-ed up CPU's. When you make the material, assuming the silver is uniform, you can easily see if a charge has a big enough dialectric to conduct. I'me sure the good poeple at GooCorp thought of that . If not i'me sure it will be smaller than the threshold value assuming that the dielectric is high enough. If your really worried, take some goo, punch in a multimeter and see. 4) Too much compound is like wrapping your core in a blanket... It slows the transfer of heat from the core to the sink/air. I'de be more worried about the presence of air bubbles when you goop it on from a little tube nozzle, that can affect the heat transfer. Also a nother thing though, if you don't put a lot of goop (not that i'me advocating that too much goop is good) you might get dust between the chip and the fan, and that my friends is bad since dust is elctrostatically charged and does not act as a very good heat conductor. |
#29
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"ntl: Victim" wrote in message news:Jllec.273$3I2.157@newsfe1-win... "Rob Morley" wrote in message t... In article , "Max" says... Rob Morley wrote: Yes as it acts as an insulator. The idea of thermal compound is to fill the very small scratches on the faces. Actually the thermal paste is non-conductive. Eh? You thought he meant thermally, we realised he meant electrically. I realised he could have meant either, so asked for elaboration. Actually some thermal compund is electrically conductive too, Which one? Any of the stuff that's filled with metallic particles is potentially electrically conductive. Especially since silver is one of the best electrical conductors there is.. It matters not a jot if the matrix is an insulator. |
#30
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"ntl: Victim" wrote in message news:Velec.272$3I2.166@newsfe1-win... "QBall" wrote in message ... "Conor" wrote in message ... In article , says... Remember, the idea is NOT to form a layer between the two surfaces. The purpose of the paste is to fill the valleys in the contact surfaces with something which is more efficient at transferring heat away from the CPU core than the air which would otherwise fill the gaps How I apply mine.. How I apply mine. Barely visible bit of goop on the mirror-lapped sink. Spread with a finger until the goop is invisible. Apply what's left on finger to die. Result : metal-metal contact maximised. If the goop is visible, you have the troughs filled AND the peaks covered - bad. Hmmm greasy finger goop, I have fine, non-greasy skin. I notice other people's mice and keyboards are always covered in a sort of greasy/grainy mix ..... disgusting. You could always wash your finger first, you know. Using an implement allows the introduction of coarse particulate matter (which will screw the interface) - which a finger can easily detect. Anyway, the addition of a microscopic quantity of skin oil makes no difference whatsoever. damn boy if you worked in my place and used your bare hands you'd be getting a **** round the back of your head... Small pea sized lump on the heatsink. Spread thinly then scrape off with a razorblade. Very small dot on the CPU core. Spread extremely thinly so it is hardly visible. -- Conor If you're not on somebody's **** list, you're not doing anything worthwhile. |
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