Warning about Canon PIXMA iP3000/iP4000 series printers

Burt wrote:

Why Taliesyn, I didn't realize that, in addition to being one of the most
pragmatic people on this NG with regard to printers, inks, and papers being
only a means to an end, your writing ebbs and flows as a great river that
brings life and beauty to all creation. Your alliterative phrases recall
Hemmingway's descriptions of his surroundings as he participated in a hunt
or a fishing trip. So glad that Measekite, through his flowery description
of Canon paper and OEM inks, inspired this gifted response. I have
actually found the Kirkland Glossy photo paper to be 2.549


Will you please stop talking about your IQ?

(rounded to three
decimal places) percent better than Canon Photo Paper Pro, and the MIS inks
to be within the same color spectrum at a 97.554991 accuracy level on my
$29,000 digital spectrometer. These results, mind you, are obtained at
1/7th the cost for the paper (per Measekite's extremely accurate
calculation) and 1/12th the cost for inks as compared to retail, or 1/9th
the cost if compared to Costco (per measekite's previous posts).


"Taliesyn" wrote in message
...


measekite wrote:



I do think that Canon Photo Paper Pro is about the very best and also
very expensive. I now use Costco/Kirkland Glossy Photo Paper and I find
that with OEM ink I get about 98% as good results at 1/7th the cost. The
basic difference is in the finish. Canon is like a pond frozen without
wind, a still sheet of glass. Costco is like a pond frozen with a 3mph
wind.



Hmmm, very poetic illustrations - and the figure of 98% quoted, obvious-
ly, was done with scientific measuring instruments ;-). Okay...

I find that with my non OEM ink I get about 98% as good results at 1/7th
the cost (Where have I heard that before?). And The basic difference is
in the finish. Canon inks are like Don McLean's "Vincent" - "Flaming
flowers that brightly blaze swirling clouds in violet haze". And my
non-OEM inks are more Donovanesque: "Color in sky prussian blue, scarlet
fleece changes hue, crimson ball sinks from view." Though some have
argued that they're more like in the Mamas & Papas song "All the leaves
are brown and the sky is grey".

And you cannot buy Canon Photo Paper Pro paper for a song, even though
its quality (my opinion) is nothing to whistle at. Left unprotected in
light, Photo Paper Pro prints will quickly turn "A Whiter Shade Of Pale".
All around, it's no better than any of a dozen or so papers I've tried,
sometimes worse. And OEM or non OEM ink makes little difference.

-Taliesyn

measekite wrote:


Kirkland Glossy photo paper to be 2.549


Will you please stop talking about your IQ?


hehehe...at least he has one to measure. :-)
Frank

Burt wrote:
Why Taliesyn, I didn't realize that, in addition to being one of the most
pragmatic people on this NG with regard to printers, inks, and papers being
only a means to an end, your writing ebbs and flows as a great river that
brings life and beauty to all creation.

Then I must thank Measekite, for he truly inspires us all to write
"creatively".... inspired, perhaps, by his very creative use of logic,
fact, and misinformation. And besides, who wouldn't be happy with
printer inks and papers that are "98%" as good as OEM; or in your case,
a little less at 97.554991 . . . :-)

-Taliesyn

"Taliesyn" wrote in message
...
Burt wrote:
Why Taliesyn, I didn't realize that, in addition to being one of the most
pragmatic people on this NG with regard to printers, inks, and papers
being only a means to an end, your writing ebbs and flows as a great
river that brings life and beauty to all creation.

Then I must thank Measekite, for he truly inspires us all to write
"creatively".... inspired, perhaps, by his very creative use of logic,
fact, and misinformation. And besides, who wouldn't be happy with
printer inks and papers that are "98%" as good as OEM; or in your case,
a little less at 97.554991 . . . :-)

-Taliesyn

And that was rounded to six decimal places. Sorry for the gross inaccuracy
induced by rounding.

Cousin Stanley wrote:

| We were considering buying a Canon PIXMA iP3000 ....
| ....
| In other words, Canon is boycotting the open source community
| and trying to make you run only on proprietory commercial platforms
| in order to use their printers.

Vincent ....

I've been using a Canon Pixma iP3000 inkjet printer
under Debian GNU/Linux Sarge for about 6 months ....

It was configured through the KDE Control Center
to use the Canon BJ-7004 driver with CUPS ....

In the vernacular of linuxprinting.org
it seems to "mostly work" ....

There are some font-size issues when printing
from KDE applications that I haven't resolved
as yet but feel may be easily correctable
with proper font settings ....

This seems to be less problematic when printing
documents from gtklp instead of directly
through KDE ....

We bought this printer to use on an old Win98_SE machine
and I consider it a very nice bonus that it also
"mostly works" under Linux ....

Thanks for the information. Can you tell us what maximum resolution
you are getting and what doesn't work when using the Canon BJ-7004
driver?

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"Vincent" wrote in message
news:lcrpe.25872$DC2.6751@okepread01...
We were considering buying a Canon PIXMA iP3000 because these are the
first printers we have ever seen that finally quit ripping people off
quite so much on ink. The whole printer ink jet market, until now,
has been a scam, making you spend an average of $40-$60 buy new print
heads and cartridges for all three colors because one color runs out.
That is like having to replace your gas tank, fuel pump, radiator,
water pump, windshield washer tank and wiper motors, because you ran
out of gas or got too low on radiator fluid. Oh, and by the way,
there are no gauges, or transparent tanks, and no way to check the
fluid levels. Just one idiot light that says you are low on one of
your fluids. Time to replace all of the above to make sure you get
the right one.

The PIXMA printers are the first ones we have seen that have separate
transparent cartridges for each color that you can see the ink level
in and are easy to refill or replace without buying a new print head.


Wow! Where have you been ???
Canon printers have offered these individual tanks for many years including
almost all S and I series and many BJC's.


However, Canon is trying to make sure you pay royalties to Apple or
pay Microsoft to run on an insecure system full of spyware in order to
use their printers. There is no printer control language (PCL)
documentation or PPD files available. I called Canon's tech support
at 1-800-828-4040 and they refused to provide any technical
documentation to run their printers. Charlie, the supervisor I spoke
with, said that they did not have that information, and that to have it
would be of no use to them. I said, "Having the PCL documentation to
provide to people in the open source community so that they can write
drivers and open the market of millions of potential customers for
your printers from the NetBSD, FreeBSD, OpenBSD, and Linux communities
is of no use to you?"

Well considering 'PCL' is HP's proprietary control code language, and Canon
BubbleJets use a BJ print Engine (not HP).
Charlie was right. Serious software developers also rarely ring up the
technical support center in search of firmware/software code and would
instead contact corporate R&D



For the most part, he kept evading questions
about his statement. He also said they write their own drivers even
though he kept claiming that they did not have the specifications to
write drivers. He said the printers are made in Japan and they are
the only ones who have the driver documentation. Yet he also claimed
to have no email address or phone number to contact the branch in
Japan.


He said the Tech Support Center does not have the information available (and
why would they). I hardly see that as 'evading questions'
www.canon.com .... click on the map for Japan.

In other words, Canon is boycotting the open source community and
trying to make you run only on proprietory commercial platforms in
order to use their printers.


No, it is called quality control and protection of intellectual property
rights.
Give Bill over at Microsoft a call and say "Hey Bill, Joe Blow here...how
bout getting that source code for your OS so I can write a couple pieces of
software". Manufactures (including Canon) have Developer programs. If you
want what is needed contact corporate, and request information on what it
takes to get on board.

"ray" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 07 Jun 2005 19:44:15 -0500, Vincent wrote:

We were considering buying a Canon PIXMA iP3000 because these are the
first printers we have ever seen that finally quit ripping people off
quite so much on ink. The whole printer ink jet market, until now,
has been a scam, making you spend an average of $40-$60 buy new print
heads and cartridges for all three colors because one color runs out.
That is like having to replace your gas tank, fuel pump, radiator,
water pump, windshield washer tank and wiper motors, because you ran
out of gas or got too low on radiator fluid. Oh, and by the way,
there are no gauges, or transparent tanks, and no way to check the
fluid levels. Just one idiot light that says you are low on one of
your fluids. Time to replace all of the above to make sure you get
the right one.

The PIXMA printers are the first ones we have seen that have separate
transparent cartridges for each color that you can see the ink level
in and are easy to refill or replace without buying a new print head.

I recently bought an Epson Photo R320 - it has six individual ink tanks,
and there is a utility 'mtink' which shows ink levels on the computer.
Canon is well known in the Linux community for making boat anchors.

That's odd, I know several folks with Canon printers on their Linux boxes.

Taliesyn wrote:

Burt wrote:

Why Taliesyn, I didn't realize that, in addition to being one of the
most pragmatic people on this NG with regard to printers, inks, and
papers being only a means to an end, your writing ebbs and flows as a
great river that brings life and beauty to all creation.


Then I must thank Measekite, for he truly inspires us all to write
"creatively".... inspired, perhaps, by his very creative use of logic,
fact, and misinformation. And besides, who wouldn't be happy with
printer inks and papers that are "98%" as good as OEM; or in your case,
a little less at 97.554991 . . . :-)

-Taliesyn


You need a haircut.

On Wed, 08 Jun 2005 14:52:56 +1200, Frederick
wrote:

Vincent wrote:
We were considering buying a Canon PIXMA iP3000 because these are the
first printers we have ever seen that finally quit ripping people off
quite so much on ink.

But if you want your prints to last, you should use Canon premium paper.
Have you checked the price of Canon premium papers? There is no free
lunch.

If you want prints to last you shouldn't be using a dye based and, in
particular, a Canon, printer in the first place.

--

Hecate - The Real One

Fashion: Buying things you don't need, with money
you don't have, to impress people you don't like...

PC Medic wrote:

"Vincent" wrote in message
news:lcrpe.25872$DC2.6751@okepread01...
We were considering buying a Canon PIXMA iP3000 because these are the
first printers we have ever seen that finally quit ripping people off
quite so much on ink. The whole printer ink jet market, until now,
has been a scam, making you spend an average of $40-$60 buy new print
heads and cartridges for all three colors because one color runs out.
That is like having to replace your gas tank, fuel pump, radiator,
water pump, windshield washer tank and wiper motors, because you ran
out of gas or got too low on radiator fluid. Oh, and by the way,
there are no gauges, or transparent tanks, and no way to check the
fluid levels. Just one idiot light that says you are low on one of
your fluids. Time to replace all of the above to make sure you get
the right one.

The PIXMA printers are the first ones we have seen that have separate
transparent cartridges for each color that you can see the ink level
in and are easy to refill or replace without buying a new print head.


Wow! Where have you been ???
Canon printers have offered these individual tanks for many years
including almost all S and I series and many BJC's.

Are they transparent, so you can see the ink level, and separated from
the print heads, with no electronics in the cartridge to make it
expensive, with the cartridges and refills available at a reasonable
price? If you can name other models that have been around for a while
that do, then I stand corrected. Until now, the PIXMA's are the first
ones I have seen.


However, Canon is trying to make sure you pay royalties to Apple or
pay Microsoft to run on an insecure system full of spyware in order to
use their printers. There is no printer control language (PCL)
documentation or PPD files available. I called Canon's tech support
at 1-800-828-4040 and they refused to provide any technical
documentation to run their printers. Charlie, the supervisor I spoke
with, said that they did not have that information, and that to have it
would be of no use to them. I said, "Having the PCL documentation to
provide to people in the open source community so that they can write
drivers and open the market of millions of potential customers for
your printers from the NetBSD, FreeBSD, OpenBSD, and Linux communities
is of no use to you?"

Well considering 'PCL' is HP's proprietary control code language, and
Canon BubbleJets use a BJ print Engine (not HP).

Yes, I know every manufacturer has their own term for it. I referred
to it as a PCL in a generic sense because, even though HP uses it, it
was the best term I could think of without writing a sentence to
explain I was talking about a language to control a printer every time
I mentioned it.


Charlie was right. Serious software developers also rarely ring up the
technical support center in search of firmware/software code and would
instead contact corporate R&D

Yes, and why is that? Because we are too passive about just accepting
that it is ok for technical support to not have any technical
information to give you. If they had said, sure you can have the PCL
docs and PPD file, what's your email address? The time they spent on
the phone with me would have been about 1 minute rather than 15 or 20
minutes and I would have gone right out and bought one of their
printers. Better yet, if the information was on their web site, they
would not have had a support call from me at all. Which method of
operation sounds more profitable?


For the most part, he kept evading questions
about his statement. He also said they write their own drivers even
though he kept claiming that they did not have the specifications to
write drivers. He said the printers are made in Japan and they are
the only ones who have the driver documentation. Yet he also claimed
to have no email address or phone number to contact the branch in
Japan.


He said the Tech Support Center does not have the information available
(and why would they). I hardly see that as 'evading questions'
www.canon.com .... click on the map for Japan.

That is the attitude I am trying to get people to change. The
question should be, "why wouldn't they?". All it means to them is
more sales. As long as people do not expect to get such information,
these companies are never going to change.

I tried to get corporate R&D contact information from the rep as well,
but he claimed not to have that either. Without spending half the day
looking (so I maybe I over looked it) I could not find any email
addresses on the main canon site and the only contact info I found
from the Japan link was here

http://www.canon.com/about/group/list.html

This was from their "Canon Group Directory" link. It is all over seas
numbers and no email. So who do you call,

Headquarters, Yako Development Center, Tamagawa Plant, ... ?

I could probably rule out the Optics R&D Center.

I guess I could spend a bunch of time and money calling over seas,
starting with the number for Headquarters, and get referred from
department to department until I get the right people. However, I am
not willing to do that because, after spending the time and money, I
would would most likely be unsuccessful. If they are willing to
provide the information it should be available from the American web
site and/or the America tech support line.


In other words, Canon is boycotting the open source community and
trying to make you run only on proprietory commercial platforms in
order to use their printers.


No, it is called quality control and protection of intellectual property
rights.
Give Bill over at Microsoft a call and say "Hey Bill, Joe Blow here...how
bout getting that source code for your OS so I can write a couple pieces
of software". Manufactures (including Canon) have Developer programs. If
you want what is needed contact corporate, and request information on what
it takes to get on board.

That example has nothing to do with the situation. I am not asking
Canon to release the source to their microcode or the equations to
their gate arrays. Without the technical information to communicate
with their printer, it is useless. It is like buying a Hayes modem
and not having any information on the Hayes command set. If their
support department gets enough calls requesting such information,
saying they are not going to buy their product without it, then
eventually it might get it through their thick heads.


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Avoid the VeriSign/Network Solutions domain registration trap!
Read how Network Solutions (NSI) was involved in stealing our domain name.
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