CPU Boxed, noise?

Athlon64 is frequently sold "boxed", I assume that includes cooling. Any
idea about noise levels? If it's high, it might be better to buy OEM and a
fan...?

"Jan" wrote in message
...
Athlon64 is frequently sold "boxed", I assume that includes cooling. Any
idea about noise levels? If it's high, it might be better to buy OEM and a
fan...?


Just installed a 939 pin Athlon 64 3200+ (90 nm) w/retail HSF. Asus A8V
Deluxe w/ 1 MB PC 3200, 2 HD's, DVD+-RW, DVD ROM, Zip Drive, etc. I almost
replaced the fan before installing. Boy, am I glad I didn't! the fan (70mm,
I believe) runs at ~3000 rpm and is incredibly quiet compared the the TMD
fan HSF's I've been using in Athlon XP systems. The fan is inaudible over my
case fans (3 Vantec 80mm Stealth).
Temperatures, you ask?
Is I type this, my CPU temp is 30 C with a case temp of 22 C in a 21 C room!
This with an (admittedly very mild) 10% overclock. No, Cool 'n' Quiet is
*not* operational.
When I ran CPU stress test software, I couldn't get the CPU over 37 C!
This is the coolest and quietest AMD PC I've ever owned (going back to K6
days).

I believe I now know why the HSF manufacturers have not rushed numerous A64
models to market as they did for the Athlons and Athlon XP's. No need = no
demand.
Of course, YMMV.

"Peter van der Goes" wrote in message
news:8ATDd.19233$ql2.776@okepread04...

"Jan" wrote in message
...
Athlon64 is frequently sold "boxed", I assume that includes cooling. Any
idea about noise levels? If it's high, it might be better to buy OEM and
a
fan...?


Just installed a 939 pin Athlon 64 3200+ (90 nm) w/retail HSF. Asus A8V
Deluxe w/ 1 MB PC 3200, 2 HD's, DVD+-RW, DVD ROM, Zip Drive, etc. I almost
replaced the fan before installing. Boy, am I glad I didn't! the fan
(70mm, I believe) runs at ~3000 rpm and is incredibly quiet compared the
the TMD fan HSF's I've been using in Athlon XP systems. The fan is
inaudible over my case fans (3 Vantec 80mm Stealth).
Temperatures, you ask?
Is I type this, my CPU temp is 30 C with a case temp of 22 C in a 21 C
room! This with an (admittedly very mild) 10% overclock. No, Cool 'n'
Quiet is *not* operational.
When I ran CPU stress test software, I couldn't get the CPU over 37 C!
This is the coolest and quietest AMD PC I've ever owned (going back to K6
days).

I believe I now know why the HSF manufacturers have not rushed numerous
A64 models to market as they did for the Athlons and Athlon XP's. No need
= no demand.
Of course, YMMV.


I don't mean to burst your bubble. In fact I agree that the stock A64
cooler is not bad, and it is fairly quiet.

But I have to say your temperature monitoring software is telling you
porkies. (Porky pies = lies, for those not familiar with cockney rhyming
slang!)

1. I *very* much doubt your case temp is only 1C above room temp. Probably
more like 5C to 10C above is more likely. If your room temp is 21C, your
case temps are in all probability somewhere around 30C. Anything less than
a 5C delta requires *extremely* high airflow and clean internal layout.

2. At 10% overclock, your CPU is putting out something like 80w when fully
stressed. With the best heatsink in the world and a screaming fan (with the
stock HS and fan are not), you need around a 10C delta between your CPU
*outer* temps and your case temps to dissipate 80 watts. (Assuming a
0.13C/W heatsink & fan.) With the stock heatsink and fan, you can more or
less double that. So your CPU *case* temps are probably somewhere around
45C to 50C under load. The CPU *core* temp - i.e. inside the chip itself
will be even higher; probably 50C to 55C.

Therefore, if your motherboard is saying your CPU is 37C under load, its
plainly incorrect. In fact its practically impossible with the stock
heatsink and fan. You would have to be sitting in a room at around 0C to
achieve this.

Don't be put out, or surprised by this. Motherboards are notorious for
inaccurately reporting temperatures. Its all too common, I am afraid.

Chip

On Sat, 08 Jan 2005 14:43:22 +0100, Jan wrote:

Athlon64 is frequently sold "boxed", I assume that includes cooling. Any
idea about noise levels? If it's high, it might be better to buy OEM and a
fan...?

The retail cooler is quite good. But the fan is weak (70x15mm). It's not
real loud but if you really want quiet, I'd replace it with a fan adapter
and 80x25mm fan of your choice. A high speed one with a fan control would
be perfect, but even the slowest of the 80x25mm fans work well. I run mine
at 2300rpm and it cools good even overclocked.

--
Abit KT7-Raid (KT133) Tbred B core CPU @2400MHz (24x100FSB)
http://mysite.verizon.net/res0exft/cpu.htm

"Chip" wrote in message
...


I don't mean to burst your bubble. In fact I agree that the stock A64
cooler is not bad, and it is fairly quiet.

No bubble to burst.
Let's assume the sensors are optimistically low and add 5 - 6C to the
readings.
It still gives no incentive to rush out to buy a 3rd party HSF.

snip

"Wes Newell" wrote in message
newsan.2005.01.08.23.22.41.894392@TAKEOUTverizon .net...
On Sat, 08 Jan 2005 14:43:22 +0100, Jan wrote:

Athlon64 is frequently sold "boxed", I assume that includes cooling. Any
idea about noise levels? If it's high, it might be better to buy OEM and
a
fan...?

The retail cooler is quite good. But the fan is weak (70x15mm). It's not
real loud but if you really want quiet, I'd replace it with a fan adapter
and 80x25mm fan of your choice. A high speed one with a fan control would
be perfect, but even the slowest of the 80x25mm fans work well. I run mine
at 2300rpm and it cools good even overclocked.

--
Abit KT7-Raid (KT133) Tbred B core CPU @2400MHz (24x100FSB)
http://mysite.verizon.net/res0exft/cpu.htm

Oh, darn you Wes. Now I'll end up getting an adapter and trying an 80mm fan

As I mentioned to Chip, assuming my sensor readings are optimistic to the
tune of 5 - 6C, how do they compare with your temperatures? I've read a lot
of reports of pretty low temperatures with A64 90 nm CPU's and felt mine
were in the ballpark, so to speak.

On Sat, 08 Jan 2005 18:54:25 -0600, Peter van der Goes wrote:

Oh, darn you Wes. Now I'll end up getting an adapter and trying an 80mm
fan
As I mentioned to Chip, assuming my sensor readings are optimistic to the
tune of 5 - 6C, how do they compare with your temperatures? I've read a
lot of reports of pretty low temperatures with A64 90 nm CPU's and felt
mine were in the ballpark, so to speak.

Don't know how they compare, but here's mine running the cpu at full bore
100% using burn, with the slow fan speed of 2300rpm.

CPU Temp: +49°C (low = +15°C, high = +55°C) sensor = diode
M/B Temp: +25°C (low = +15°C, high = +40°C) sensor = thermistor

And at idle it's about 35C. I consider anything under 50C at full load
more than cool enough.

--
Abit KT7-Raid (KT133) Tbred B core CPU @2400MHz (24x100FSB)
http://mysite.verizon.net/res0exft/cpu.htm

"Peter van der Goes" wrote in message
news:Ic%Dd.20116$ql2.12180@okepread04...

"Chip" wrote in message
...


I don't mean to burst your bubble. In fact I agree that the stock A64
cooler is not bad, and it is fairly quiet.

No bubble to burst.
Let's assume the sensors are optimistically low and add 5 - 6C to the
readings.
It still gives no incentive to rush out to buy a 3rd party HSF.

Yes... and no.

You can forget about adding 5 - 6C. Think more like 8 - 23C. I suspect
your CPU temp under load is low to mid 50's in reality. 45C is about the
lowest possible credible number for an overclocked Winchester CPU with a
"fair" heatsink and fan like the stock one. In all probability the temps
are higher than that.

Does this mean you need to rush out and replace the hs & fan? No, of course
not.

But if you are interested in hs+fan combos that cool better than this, *and*
are quieter too, then there are plenty to choose from.

Chip

"Ed" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 8 Jan 2005 14:43:22 +0100, "Jan"
wrote:

Athlon64 is frequently sold "boxed", I assume that includes cooling. Any
idea about noise levels? If it's high, it might be better to buy OEM and a
fan...?


I'm running a boxed 3200+ (Newcastle), it cools really well and not
noisy at all IMO, I'm not using the Cool n Quite option either.

AMD64 is a big improvement over their older chips in power usage/heat,
and their new 90nm chips use even less power/run cooler.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu...64-3200_3.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu...64-90nm_4.html
http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/200...m4_570-20.html

Ed
--
VNF3-250/3200+
A7N8X/2800+


Just out of curiosity, Ed, what kinds of temperature readings are you
getting from your Athlon 64?

Chip wrote:
"Peter van der Goes" wrote in message
news:Ic%Dd.20116$ql2.12180@okepread04...

"Chip" wrote in message
...


I don't mean to burst your bubble. In fact I agree that the stock
A64 cooler is not bad, and it is fairly quiet.

No bubble to burst.
Let's assume the sensors are optimistically low and add 5 - 6C to the
readings.
It still gives no incentive to rush out to buy a 3rd party HSF.

Yes... and no.

You can forget about adding 5 - 6C. Think more like 8 - 23C. I
suspect your CPU temp under load is low to mid 50's in reality. 45C
is about the lowest possible credible number for an overclocked
Winchester CPU with a "fair" heatsink and fan like the stock one. In
all probability the temps are higher than that.

Hey, Chip, *I'm* supposed to be the annoying
"you-have-physically-impossible-temperatures" guy (though I do admit I
haven't been very vocal on the subject recently ...)

However, I think 0.13 deg C/watt for air is being a little too generous.
Anything much below 0.2 is getting into watercooling territory, 0.2's are
where you'd be with a heatpipe and a 120mm delta screamer (if they even make
'em that big ...). You pretty much need a heatpipe based cooler to get to
the lower 0.3's, and I'd put the stock AMD fan at late 0.3's to early 0.4's.
This would give you a temperature rise of closer to 30 deg C over the air
temperature, giving a realistic core temperature of mid to late 50's. Which
is fine, given the chip is fine up to 70 deg C.

Like I've said many a time ...
1) If it's Prime95 stable and you're not overvolting by much then it's not
too hot.
2) If it's Prime95 unstable with the side on and Prime95 stable with it off,
then it's too hot.
3) Absolute temperature measurements mean nothing ... the variation in
readings even between identical boards makes it impossible to figure out the
"real" temperature.
4) The only use they have is seeing if changing {x} makes it go up or down.

[...]

--
Michael Brown
www.emboss.co.nz : OOS/RSI software and more
Add michael@ to emboss.co.nz ---+--- My inbox is always open