Are you thinking of buying Asus gear?

In the last episode of , Paul
said:

DevilsPGD wrote:
In the last episode of , dan
said:

On Tue, 06 May 2014 10:50:42 -0700, DevilsPGD
wrote:

In the last episode of , dan
said:

On Mon, 05 May 2014 13:17:54 -0700, Ghostrider " 00 wrote:

On 5/4/2014 12:52 AM, dan wrote:
On Wed, 09 Apr 2014 19:12:49 -0700, DevilsPGD
wrote:

In the last episode of , Jim
said:

If so try to "talk" to someone in tech/cust support and see how bad it
is, it's a joke sent an email took them 2 days to reply and when they
did they refused to answer my question about their bios and told me to
look in the manual, which i had already done.
I've had great interactions with them on an unstable Sabertooth
motherboard, including a warranty replacement.
I have had horrible experience, they kept on saying contact your local
trading standards. Never will I buy Asus again.

Not living in the UK but if the ASUS board in question is not a
retail product from ASUS but an OEM board that should have been
sold to a systems builder, then it has made the right response.
This is a matter to be resolved between the buyer and the OEM
builder-seller and not ASUS.

OTOH, if the motherboard in question is a retail one, then ASUS
would have settled with you according to its warranty. Was there
a written warranty or guarantee from ASUS? This is the way ASUS
handles things in the US.

It is a retail MB that I bought from a store in London. But the store
no longer exists physically & only on the web. When I contacted the e
tailer they said their records no longer go back that far (2011). The
MB is a Asus sabertooth B3 p67 which says it has a 5 year warranty.
Interesting. I'm not sure about how UK law works, whether it's the
retailer or the vendor that is responsible for warranties, but I would
definitely take it to your local trading standards.

Companies rarely want to be dragged in front of a regulatory body, so
the fact that a company suggested it makes me wonder if there isn't
something more going on (or the rep knows that they will help if forced,
and is trying to push you in the right direction)

Beyond that, it just seems odd, unless of course you're missing the
purchase documentation and also didn't register the product when you
purchased it, in which case I can see why neither the vendor nor the
retailer might be willing to help (and they might kick you over to local
trading standards knowing that you don't have sufficient documentation
to get them to assist either)

As far as I know it is the retailer that is responsible for all
warranties in the UK. Asus kept on fobbing me off about trading
standards. I lost the purchase proof when I re arranged my store room,
yes I forgot to register the mb with Asus. I am one really unhappy,
now ex Asus customer. Gigabyte has a real UK telephone number to get
help from. Asus has a UK telephone number that when rung goes into a
loop about contact your vendor.

I guess my point is this: If it's the retailer who is responsible and
not the manufacturer or wholesaler, I don't blame the manufacturer for
not taking on responsibility that doesn't belong to them, I probably
wouldn't either.

Trading standards sounds like it would be the correct step, since you
may be able to beat the retailer into standing behind their product even
though the claim to not have records (but then since you don't either,
it complicates things significantly)

But really, without any proof of purchase, receipt, proof of purchase,
etc, what else do you expect them to do?


When Asus provides a warranty, the warranty period is based on
the serial number on the motherboard.

The warranty period with Asus, is measured from the date of manufacture.
For each month the product sits on a retailer shelf, that's a money
of your warranty gone.

Let's take my current motherboard, P5E Deluxe. Nominal warranty
is three years. When I got the motherboard, and checked
the lead two characters (the year and month characters), I
could determine that 18 months of my warranty was already
gone. The motherboard box in question, had been sitting on
the retailer shelf, from the date of introduction. The motherboard
would have been in the first lot hitting the North American shores.
And as a result of that, I had "half a warranty".

Under general consumer protection law in North America, this is not
correct. If you purchase from an authorized retailer and can prove the
date of purchase, that is the generally the date when your warranty
starts for most consumer purchases.

However, in the absence of documentation, the production dates are used.

And this means you should buy from high volume sellers,
not from people who hold a lot of stale product on the shelf.

By measuring from date of manufacture, there is no "sales receipt"
issue. Since it is not the purchase date used to start the warranty,
but the serial number (manufacture date), all parties know exactly
where they stand.

True. But this is not the way it's done legally and if it were, it would
allow manufacturers to dodge warranty claims entirely by manufacturing
items in bulk in advance.

More importantly, the poster is in the UK, where the retailer is
responsible for the warranty, not the manufacturer, so the claim is
first against the retailer.

--
Warning Dates in Calendar are closer than they appear.

On Tue, 06 May 2014 20:38:59 -0700, DevilsPGD
wrote:

In the last episode of , Paul
said:

DevilsPGD wrote:
In the last episode of , dan
said:

On Tue, 06 May 2014 10:50:42 -0700, DevilsPGD
wrote:

In the last episode of , dan
said:

On Mon, 05 May 2014 13:17:54 -0700, Ghostrider " 00 wrote:

On 5/4/2014 12:52 AM, dan wrote:
On Wed, 09 Apr 2014 19:12:49 -0700, DevilsPGD
wrote:

In the last episode of , Jim
said:

If so try to "talk" to someone in tech/cust support and see how bad it
is, it's a joke sent an email took them 2 days to reply and when they
did they refused to answer my question about their bios and told me to
look in the manual, which i had already done.
I've had great interactions with them on an unstable Sabertooth
motherboard, including a warranty replacement.
I have had horrible experience, they kept on saying contact your local
trading standards. Never will I buy Asus again.

Not living in the UK but if the ASUS board in question is not a
retail product from ASUS but an OEM board that should have been
sold to a systems builder, then it has made the right response.
This is a matter to be resolved between the buyer and the OEM
builder-seller and not ASUS.

OTOH, if the motherboard in question is a retail one, then ASUS
would have settled with you according to its warranty. Was there
a written warranty or guarantee from ASUS? This is the way ASUS
handles things in the US.

It is a retail MB that I bought from a store in London. But the store
no longer exists physically & only on the web. When I contacted the e
tailer they said their records no longer go back that far (2011). The
MB is a Asus sabertooth B3 p67 which says it has a 5 year warranty.
Interesting. I'm not sure about how UK law works, whether it's the
retailer or the vendor that is responsible for warranties, but I would
definitely take it to your local trading standards.

Companies rarely want to be dragged in front of a regulatory body, so
the fact that a company suggested it makes me wonder if there isn't
something more going on (or the rep knows that they will help if forced,
and is trying to push you in the right direction)

Beyond that, it just seems odd, unless of course you're missing the
purchase documentation and also didn't register the product when you
purchased it, in which case I can see why neither the vendor nor the
retailer might be willing to help (and they might kick you over to local
trading standards knowing that you don't have sufficient documentation
to get them to assist either)

As far as I know it is the retailer that is responsible for all
warranties in the UK. Asus kept on fobbing me off about trading
standards. I lost the purchase proof when I re arranged my store room,
yes I forgot to register the mb with Asus. I am one really unhappy,
now ex Asus customer. Gigabyte has a real UK telephone number to get
help from. Asus has a UK telephone number that when rung goes into a
loop about contact your vendor.

I guess my point is this: If it's the retailer who is responsible and
not the manufacturer or wholesaler, I don't blame the manufacturer for
not taking on responsibility that doesn't belong to them, I probably
wouldn't either.

Trading standards sounds like it would be the correct step, since you
may be able to beat the retailer into standing behind their product even
though the claim to not have records (but then since you don't either,
it complicates things significantly)

But really, without any proof of purchase, receipt, proof of purchase,
etc, what else do you expect them to do?


When Asus provides a warranty, the warranty period is based on
the serial number on the motherboard.

The warranty period with Asus, is measured from the date of manufacture.
For each month the product sits on a retailer shelf, that's a money
of your warranty gone.

Let's take my current motherboard, P5E Deluxe. Nominal warranty
is three years. When I got the motherboard, and checked
the lead two characters (the year and month characters), I
could determine that 18 months of my warranty was already
gone. The motherboard box in question, had been sitting on
the retailer shelf, from the date of introduction. The motherboard
would have been in the first lot hitting the North American shores.
And as a result of that, I had "half a warranty".

Under general consumer protection law in North America, this is not
correct. If you purchase from an authorized retailer and can prove the
date of purchase, that is the generally the date when your warranty
starts for most consumer purchases.

However, in the absence of documentation, the production dates are used.

And this means you should buy from high volume sellers,
not from people who hold a lot of stale product on the shelf.

By measuring from date of manufacture, there is no "sales receipt"
issue. Since it is not the purchase date used to start the warranty,
but the serial number (manufacture date), all parties know exactly
where they stand.

True. But this is not the way it's done legally and if it were, it would
allow manufacturers to dodge warranty claims entirely by manufacturing
items in bulk in advance.

More importantly, the poster is in the UK, where the retailer is
responsible for the warranty, not the manufacturer, so the claim is
first against the retailer.


Thanks to all replies.

So what more can I do a Asus are going to lose a future customer if
this is not sorted out.

In the last episode of , dan
said:

So what more can I do a Asus are going to lose a future customer if
this is not sorted out.

Contact local trading standards and see how they suggest you proceed.

--
The nice thing about standards, there is enough for everyone to have their own.

dan wrote:
On Tue, 06 May 2014 20:38:59 -0700, DevilsPGD
wrote:

In the last episode of , Paul
said:

DevilsPGD wrote:
In the last episode of , dan
said:

On Tue, 06 May 2014 10:50:42 -0700, DevilsPGD
wrote:

In the last episode of , dan
said:

On Mon, 05 May 2014 13:17:54 -0700, Ghostrider " 00 wrote:

On 5/4/2014 12:52 AM, dan wrote:
On Wed, 09 Apr 2014 19:12:49 -0700, DevilsPGD
wrote:

In the last episode of , Jim
said:

If so try to "talk" to someone in tech/cust support and see how bad it
is, it's a joke sent an email took them 2 days to reply and when they
did they refused to answer my question about their bios and told me to
look in the manual, which i had already done.
I've had great interactions with them on an unstable Sabertooth
motherboard, including a warranty replacement.
I have had horrible experience, they kept on saying contact your local
trading standards. Never will I buy Asus again.

Not living in the UK but if the ASUS board in question is not a
retail product from ASUS but an OEM board that should have been
sold to a systems builder, then it has made the right response.
This is a matter to be resolved between the buyer and the OEM
builder-seller and not ASUS.

OTOH, if the motherboard in question is a retail one, then ASUS
would have settled with you according to its warranty. Was there
a written warranty or guarantee from ASUS? This is the way ASUS
handles things in the US.
It is a retail MB that I bought from a store in London. But the store
no longer exists physically & only on the web. When I contacted the e
tailer they said their records no longer go back that far (2011). The
MB is a Asus sabertooth B3 p67 which says it has a 5 year warranty.
Interesting. I'm not sure about how UK law works, whether it's the
retailer or the vendor that is responsible for warranties, but I would
definitely take it to your local trading standards.

Companies rarely want to be dragged in front of a regulatory body, so
the fact that a company suggested it makes me wonder if there isn't
something more going on (or the rep knows that they will help if forced,
and is trying to push you in the right direction)

Beyond that, it just seems odd, unless of course you're missing the
purchase documentation and also didn't register the product when you
purchased it, in which case I can see why neither the vendor nor the
retailer might be willing to help (and they might kick you over to local
trading standards knowing that you don't have sufficient documentation
to get them to assist either)
As far as I know it is the retailer that is responsible for all
warranties in the UK. Asus kept on fobbing me off about trading
standards. I lost the purchase proof when I re arranged my store room,
yes I forgot to register the mb with Asus. I am one really unhappy,
now ex Asus customer. Gigabyte has a real UK telephone number to get
help from. Asus has a UK telephone number that when rung goes into a
loop about contact your vendor.
I guess my point is this: If it's the retailer who is responsible and
not the manufacturer or wholesaler, I don't blame the manufacturer for
not taking on responsibility that doesn't belong to them, I probably
wouldn't either.

Trading standards sounds like it would be the correct step, since you
may be able to beat the retailer into standing behind their product even
though the claim to not have records (but then since you don't either,
it complicates things significantly)

But really, without any proof of purchase, receipt, proof of purchase,
etc, what else do you expect them to do?

When Asus provides a warranty, the warranty period is based on
the serial number on the motherboard.

The warranty period with Asus, is measured from the date of manufacture.
For each month the product sits on a retailer shelf, that's a money
of your warranty gone.

Let's take my current motherboard, P5E Deluxe. Nominal warranty
is three years. When I got the motherboard, and checked
the lead two characters (the year and month characters), I
could determine that 18 months of my warranty was already
gone. The motherboard box in question, had been sitting on
the retailer shelf, from the date of introduction. The motherboard
would have been in the first lot hitting the North American shores.
And as a result of that, I had "half a warranty".
Under general consumer protection law in North America, this is not
correct. If you purchase from an authorized retailer and can prove the
date of purchase, that is the generally the date when your warranty
starts for most consumer purchases.

However, in the absence of documentation, the production dates are used.

And this means you should buy from high volume sellers,
not from people who hold a lot of stale product on the shelf.

By measuring from date of manufacture, there is no "sales receipt"
issue. Since it is not the purchase date used to start the warranty,
but the serial number (manufacture date), all parties know exactly
where they stand.
True. But this is not the way it's done legally and if it were, it would
allow manufacturers to dodge warranty claims entirely by manufacturing
items in bulk in advance.

More importantly, the poster is in the UK, where the retailer is
responsible for the warranty, not the manufacturer, so the claim is
first against the retailer.


Thanks to all replies.

So what more can I do a Asus are going to lose a future customer if
this is not sorted out.


You can look up the warranty policy here. Mine is straightforward,
and follows the information found. In a country with Trading Standards,
Asus follows the law of the land, whatever it happens to be, for better
or worse. Such policies might even affect the retail price
paid in such a country. The warranty terms are merely a price
adder, and it isn't a precise science like "we used Grade B capacitors
so the warranty cost is $4.31 more over five years". The same thing
happened with hard drives, where the warranty period was something they
could dial, and change the retail pricing at will.

http://support.asus.com/download/opt...uage=en&type=4

Example of the policy for my board. 3 years.

http://support.asus.com/Warranty.asp...eluxe&p=1&s=22

Warranty claims do not include physical damage. If you snap off
pins or contacts in a CPU socket, they put the motherboard right
back in the box, and send it back to you "Warranty Denied". The motherbosrd
can't be full of dings and scratches, implying carelessness with a
screwdriver. Anything that could conceivably affect operation
(screwdriver slips and snaps off an SMT capacitor), the box with
the motherboard is coming right back.

Asus have done amazing repairs for people. When some ICH5 Southbridges
were failing, at least one user got his original motherboard back
(no refurb thrown his way), with a brand new Southbridge soldered to it.
This is a tricky operation at the best of times, but with the poor quality
motherboard materials used, a working motherboard in this case is nothing
short of a miracle :-) So they have done repairs, for which they would lose
all possible profit from the board. They would not have made any money
on that motherboard. Other repairs are a bit simpler (bricked BIOS is easy).

Repair time can be anywhere from four weeks to twelve weeks.
Many users end up buying another motherboard anyway, to remain up and running,
and sell the returned motherboard when it comes back.

*Never* leave anything on the motherboard, that you want back. If
sending a motherboard, clean everything off it. For example, if
you left a CPU and heatsink clamped to a motherboard, the motherboard
will come back with no CPU and no heatsink. The other components will
be promptly discarded. There would be no way to track them at the
repair facility. The toe tag is tied to the motherboard, and remains
with the item as it makes its journey. If you have a BT keyboard
dongle, you'd unplug it before returning the product. Otherwise, it'll
be removed and you won't get it back.

About the only way you might change things, is to give the motherboard
to a person outside of your country, where the policy happens to be
different. And hope that the serial numbers do not indicate the
country of distribution.

I don't know how picky they are about the sales receipt. On the one
hand, the serial number system establishes eligibility. The sales
receipt tells then whether Trading Standards rules apply or not,
which would be a reason for wanting to know where it was purchased.
They don't want to run afoul of national laws, which is why they
tolerate the differences. Whether the differences ultimately
help the consumer is up for discussion - most of the time, UK law
leads to a better outcome than you'd find in other countries. Having
your retailer go out of business, is not one of those cases.

Paul

On Wed, 07 May 2014 15:04:12 -0400, Paul wrote:

dan wrote:
On Tue, 06 May 2014 20:38:59 -0700, DevilsPGD
wrote:

In the last episode of , Paul
said:

DevilsPGD wrote:
In the last episode of , dan
said:

On Tue, 06 May 2014 10:50:42 -0700, DevilsPGD
wrote:

In the last episode of , dan
said:

On Mon, 05 May 2014 13:17:54 -0700, Ghostrider " 00 wrote:

On 5/4/2014 12:52 AM, dan wrote:
On Wed, 09 Apr 2014 19:12:49 -0700, DevilsPGD
wrote:

In the last episode of , Jim
said:

If so try to "talk" to someone in tech/cust support and see how bad it
is, it's a joke sent an email took them 2 days to reply and when they
did they refused to answer my question about their bios and told me to
look in the manual, which i had already done.
I've had great interactions with them on an unstable Sabertooth
motherboard, including a warranty replacement.
I have had horrible experience, they kept on saying contact your local
trading standards. Never will I buy Asus again.

Not living in the UK but if the ASUS board in question is not a
retail product from ASUS but an OEM board that should have been
sold to a systems builder, then it has made the right response.
This is a matter to be resolved between the buyer and the OEM
builder-seller and not ASUS.

OTOH, if the motherboard in question is a retail one, then ASUS
would have settled with you according to its warranty. Was there
a written warranty or guarantee from ASUS? This is the way ASUS
handles things in the US.
It is a retail MB that I bought from a store in London. But the store
no longer exists physically & only on the web. When I contacted the e
tailer they said their records no longer go back that far (2011). The
MB is a Asus sabertooth B3 p67 which says it has a 5 year warranty.
Interesting. I'm not sure about how UK law works, whether it's the
retailer or the vendor that is responsible for warranties, but I would
definitely take it to your local trading standards.

Companies rarely want to be dragged in front of a regulatory body, so
the fact that a company suggested it makes me wonder if there isn't
something more going on (or the rep knows that they will help if forced,
and is trying to push you in the right direction)

Beyond that, it just seems odd, unless of course you're missing the
purchase documentation and also didn't register the product when you
purchased it, in which case I can see why neither the vendor nor the
retailer might be willing to help (and they might kick you over to local
trading standards knowing that you don't have sufficient documentation
to get them to assist either)
As far as I know it is the retailer that is responsible for all
warranties in the UK. Asus kept on fobbing me off about trading
standards. I lost the purchase proof when I re arranged my store room,
yes I forgot to register the mb with Asus. I am one really unhappy,
now ex Asus customer. Gigabyte has a real UK telephone number to get
help from. Asus has a UK telephone number that when rung goes into a
loop about contact your vendor.
I guess my point is this: If it's the retailer who is responsible and
not the manufacturer or wholesaler, I don't blame the manufacturer for
not taking on responsibility that doesn't belong to them, I probably
wouldn't either.

Trading standards sounds like it would be the correct step, since you
may be able to beat the retailer into standing behind their product even
though the claim to not have records (but then since you don't either,
it complicates things significantly)

But really, without any proof of purchase, receipt, proof of purchase,
etc, what else do you expect them to do?

When Asus provides a warranty, the warranty period is based on
the serial number on the motherboard.

The warranty period with Asus, is measured from the date of manufacture.
For each month the product sits on a retailer shelf, that's a money
of your warranty gone.

Let's take my current motherboard, P5E Deluxe. Nominal warranty
is three years. When I got the motherboard, and checked
the lead two characters (the year and month characters), I
could determine that 18 months of my warranty was already
gone. The motherboard box in question, had been sitting on
the retailer shelf, from the date of introduction. The motherboard
would have been in the first lot hitting the North American shores.
And as a result of that, I had "half a warranty".
Under general consumer protection law in North America, this is not
correct. If you purchase from an authorized retailer and can prove the
date of purchase, that is the generally the date when your warranty
starts for most consumer purchases.

However, in the absence of documentation, the production dates are used.

And this means you should buy from high volume sellers,
not from people who hold a lot of stale product on the shelf.

By measuring from date of manufacture, there is no "sales receipt"
issue. Since it is not the purchase date used to start the warranty,
but the serial number (manufacture date), all parties know exactly
where they stand.
True. But this is not the way it's done legally and if it were, it would
allow manufacturers to dodge warranty claims entirely by manufacturing
items in bulk in advance.

More importantly, the poster is in the UK, where the retailer is
responsible for the warranty, not the manufacturer, so the claim is
first against the retailer.


Thanks to all replies.

So what more can I do a Asus are going to lose a future customer if
this is not sorted out.


You can look up the warranty policy here. Mine is straightforward,
and follows the information found. In a country with Trading Standards,
Asus follows the law of the land, whatever it happens to be, for better
or worse. Such policies might even affect the retail price
paid in such a country. The warranty terms are merely a price
adder, and it isn't a precise science like "we used Grade B capacitors
so the warranty cost is $4.31 more over five years". The same thing
happened with hard drives, where the warranty period was something they
could dial, and change the retail pricing at will.

http://support.asus.com/download/opt...uage=en&type=4

Example of the policy for my board. 3 years.

http://support.asus.com/Warranty.asp...eluxe&p=1&s=22

Warranty claims do not include physical damage. If you snap off
pins or contacts in a CPU socket, they put the motherboard right
back in the box, and send it back to you "Warranty Denied". The motherbosrd
can't be full of dings and scratches, implying carelessness with a
screwdriver. Anything that could conceivably affect operation
(screwdriver slips and snaps off an SMT capacitor), the box with
the motherboard is coming right back.

Asus have done amazing repairs for people. When some ICH5 Southbridges
were failing, at least one user got his original motherboard back
(no refurb thrown his way), with a brand new Southbridge soldered to it.
This is a tricky operation at the best of times, but with the poor quality
motherboard materials used, a working motherboard in this case is nothing
short of a miracle :-) So they have done repairs, for which they would lose
all possible profit from the board. They would not have made any money
on that motherboard. Other repairs are a bit simpler (bricked BIOS is easy).

Repair time can be anywhere from four weeks to twelve weeks.
Many users end up buying another motherboard anyway, to remain up and running,
and sell the returned motherboard when it comes back.

*Never* leave anything on the motherboard, that you want back. If
sending a motherboard, clean everything off it. For example, if
you left a CPU and heatsink clamped to a motherboard, the motherboard
will come back with no CPU and no heatsink. The other components will
be promptly discarded. There would be no way to track them at the
repair facility. The toe tag is tied to the motherboard, and remains
with the item as it makes its journey. If you have a BT keyboard
dongle, you'd unplug it before returning the product. Otherwise, it'll
be removed and you won't get it back.

About the only way you might change things, is to give the motherboard
to a person outside of your country, where the policy happens to be
different. And hope that the serial numbers do not indicate the
country of distribution.

I don't know how picky they are about the sales receipt. On the one
hand, the serial number system establishes eligibility. The sales
receipt tells then whether Trading Standards rules apply or not,
which would be a reason for wanting to know where it was purchased.
They don't want to run afoul of national laws, which is why they
tolerate the differences. Whether the differences ultimately
help the consumer is up for discussion - most of the time, UK law
leads to a better outcome than you'd find in other countries. Having
your retailer go out of business, is not one of those cases.

Paul

Apologies for the late reply. so what am I supposed to do?

dan wrote:


Apologies for the late reply. so what am I supposed to do?

Since your country overrides the standard warranty, and
enforces other terms, you talk to Trading Standards. I
don't see another option.

http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/a...mer-advice.cfm

http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/a...oods-sum16.cfm

You would think, in this age, a "booklet" could be available
as a PDF from the site, rather than following some creaky
delivery chain. I can't really drill down any further on that
last page, to answer your question.

Paul

On Sat, 10 May 2014 09:59:00 -0400, Paul wrote:

dan wrote:


Apologies for the late reply. so what am I supposed to do?

Since your country overrides the standard warranty, and
enforces other terms, you talk to Trading Standards. I
don't see another option.

http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/a...mer-advice.cfm

http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/a...oods-sum16.cfm

You would think, in this age, a "booklet" could be available
as a PDF from the site, rather than following some creaky
delivery chain. I can't really drill down any further on that
last page, to answer your question.

Paul


Thank you.

Regards

Dan.