Rec'd Power Supplies for Asus?

It's been a long time, but the Asus site used to post recommended power
supplies for their boards. [or maybe I just can't find it now] I'm building
a new system and will go with a name brand PS, high efficiency, etc., but
the power requirements are rather vague. Many recommend a "high 12V rail"
which makes good sense, but what is "high"?

It seems the difference between say a 350 watt and a 500 watt PS is only a
few dollars, and that seems like rather cheap insurance against the next
video card that might gobble power.

The devices can only pull their rating, so why get a small one? Most cases
come with 300-350W, but it seems like 400-500W makes more sense, or am I
missing something?

bob9 wrote:

It's been a long time, but the Asus site used to post recommended power
supplies for their boards. [or maybe I just can't find it now] I'm building
a new system and will go with a name brand PS, high efficiency, etc., but
the power requirements are rather vague. Many recommend a "high 12V rail"
which makes good sense, but what is "high"?

Dear Bob9,

here is a very thorough power supply calculator:

http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculator.jsp

PC Power and Cooling has a power supply selector as well,

http://www.pcpowercooling.com/produc...lies/selector/

but more importantly, some of their background info, taken with a grain
of salt, is helpful:

http://www.pcpowercooling.com/technology/myths/

I see a new PC Power and Cooling "Silencer" power supply: a 610W unit,
EPS capable, which you may need.

Chances are this PCPC unit for $99 will be adequate, depending on how
powerful a system you are building:

http://www.pcpowercooling.com/produc...hp?show=S47ATX

Silent PC review likes Seasonic power supplies for their efficiency and
quiet operation:

http://www.silentpcreview.com/article28-page6.html

Note: in my experience, Seasonic does not put out quite as much power
per claimed watt as PCPC units: so, if you are going with Seasonic for
quiet and you need a "430", get the "500", and if you need the "500" get
the "600".

It seems the difference between say a 350 watt and a 500 watt PS is only a
few dollars, and that seems like rather cheap insurance against the next
video card that might gobble power.

Correct: and for heat (which degrades performance both short and long
term), etc.

The devices can only pull their rating, so why get a small one? Most cases
come with 300-350W, but it seems like 400-500W makes more sense, or am I
missing something?

Most power supplies that come with cases are not very good (an
understatement....a PSU is the heart of your system, don't cheap out on
it, a failing PSU can take lots of other components with it when it goes.)

Tom's Hardware did a big torture test last year: Fortron and Seasonic
(again) came out well:

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...st/page30.html

PC Power/Cooling units were 100% within specs, but, their fans were
noisy at full load.

Of note is that several power supplies *failed* (like OCZ's, not one of
my favorites: I am 0 for 2 on OCZ power supplies....)

Intro to Tom's article:

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...est/index.html

Uh oh, I notice they are hawking their own brand he tacky....

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...est/page2.html

And, from what I remember, they toned down the article, minimizing the
failure of the OCZ and the AcBel and BeQuiet and Cooler Master
units....hmm...

So, in summary, get a good name brand like PC Power/Cooling, or
Seasonic. Antec/Enermax/Fortron also good. Would recommend you avoid
modular cables, they introduce another failure point.

HTH,

BC

Note: this was written by PC PC CEO after some other power supply
company hacks wrote to complain that the Tom's 'torture test' was not
fair, after their units blew up:

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...st/page23.html

Statement From PC Power & Cooling

We would like to take the opportunity of including a statement from CEO
of PC Power & Cooling that we just received.

An honest power supply rating is for CONTINUOUS operation at FULL LOAD.
24 hours is a very short test. There should be no complaints! A PSU
should actually run at full load for weeks and months with no problems.

The voltages and output ripple should be within ATX specs at full load.
The tests are NOT too tough. In fact, they're easy, because they are run
at nominal input line voltage and room temperature. I suggest that tests
be conducted at low line voltage and high line voltage using a variac.
These tests would demonstrate the PSU's input operating range and
whether or not the PSU could withstand the sags and surges in today's
world at full load.

Another legitimate test condition is to run the PSUs at full load with
the ambient temperature elevated about 15C to represent the real-life
condition in the computer, rather than the condition on the test bench
(many power supplies have exaggerated wattage claims based on low
ambient temperature assumptions). One more important test would be a
dynamic load test (instantaneous pulse of the +12V output). This would
demonstrate a PSU's ability to handle multiple hard drive access
(servers) or quick changes in CPU and video power loads (gaming PCs,
especially SLI).

In conclusion, the stress tests being conducted by Tom's Hardware are
more than fair. Products that do not pass should be redesigned or
de-rated to realistic power levels.

Doug Dodson, CEO, PC Power & Cooling


PS: I do not work for PCPC....

"BC" wrote in message
.com...
[snip]

Great info--many thanks!

Yeah I have to agree pc power and cooling makes some damn good power
supplies can be spendy but, you get what you pay for....

Best Regards,
Dan


BC wrote:
bob9 wrote:

It's been a long time, but the Asus site used to post recommended power
supplies for their boards. [or maybe I just can't find it now] I'm building
a new system and will go with a name brand PS, high efficiency, etc., but
the power requirements are rather vague. Many recommend a "high 12V rail"
which makes good sense, but what is "high"?

Dear Bob9,

here is a very thorough power supply calculator:

http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculator.jsp

PC Power and Cooling has a power supply selector as well,

http://www.pcpowercooling.com/produc...lies/selector/

but more importantly, some of their background info, taken with a grain
of salt, is helpful:

http://www.pcpowercooling.com/technology/myths/

I see a new PC Power and Cooling "Silencer" power supply: a 610W unit,
EPS capable, which you may need.

Chances are this PCPC unit for $99 will be adequate, depending on how
powerful a system you are building:

http://www.pcpowercooling.com/produc...hp?show=S47ATX

Silent PC review likes Seasonic power supplies for their efficiency and
quiet operation:

http://www.silentpcreview.com/article28-page6.html

Note: in my experience, Seasonic does not put out quite as much power
per claimed watt as PCPC units: so, if you are going with Seasonic for
quiet and you need a "430", get the "500", and if you need the "500" get
the "600".

It seems the difference between say a 350 watt and a 500 watt PS is only a
few dollars, and that seems like rather cheap insurance against the next
video card that might gobble power.

Correct: and for heat (which degrades performance both short and long
term), etc.

The devices can only pull their rating, so why get a small one? Most cases
come with 300-350W, but it seems like 400-500W makes more sense, or am I
missing something?

Most power supplies that come with cases are not very good (an
understatement....a PSU is the heart of your system, don't cheap out on
it, a failing PSU can take lots of other components with it when it goes.)

Tom's Hardware did a big torture test last year: Fortron and Seasonic
(again) came out well:

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...st/page30.html

PC Power/Cooling units were 100% within specs, but, their fans were
noisy at full load.

Of note is that several power supplies *failed* (like OCZ's, not one of
my favorites: I am 0 for 2 on OCZ power supplies....)

Intro to Tom's article:

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...est/index.html

Uh oh, I notice they are hawking their own brand he tacky....

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...est/page2.html

And, from what I remember, they toned down the article, minimizing the
failure of the OCZ and the AcBel and BeQuiet and Cooler Master
units....hmm...

So, in summary, get a good name brand like PC Power/Cooling, or
Seasonic. Antec/Enermax/Fortron also good. Would recommend you avoid
modular cables, they introduce another failure point.

HTH,

BC

Note: this was written by PC PC CEO after some other power supply
company hacks wrote to complain that the Tom's 'torture test' was not
fair, after their units blew up:

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...st/page23.html

Statement From PC Power & Cooling

We would like to take the opportunity of including a statement from CEO
of PC Power & Cooling that we just received.

An honest power supply rating is for CONTINUOUS operation at FULL LOAD.
24 hours is a very short test. There should be no complaints! A PSU
should actually run at full load for weeks and months with no problems.

The voltages and output ripple should be within ATX specs at full load.
The tests are NOT too tough. In fact, they're easy, because they are run
at nominal input line voltage and room temperature. I suggest that tests
be conducted at low line voltage and high line voltage using a variac.
These tests would demonstrate the PSU's input operating range and
whether or not the PSU could withstand the sags and surges in today's
world at full load.

Another legitimate test condition is to run the PSUs at full load with
the ambient temperature elevated about 15C to represent the real-life
condition in the computer, rather than the condition on the test bench
(many power supplies have exaggerated wattage claims based on low
ambient temperature assumptions). One more important test would be a
dynamic load test (instantaneous pulse of the +12V output). This would
demonstrate a PSU's ability to handle multiple hard drive access
(servers) or quick changes in CPU and video power loads (gaming PCs,
especially SLI).

In conclusion, the stress tests being conducted by Tom's Hardware are
more than fair. Products that do not pass should be redesigned or
de-rated to realistic power levels.

Doug Dodson, CEO, PC Power & Cooling


PS: I do not work for PCPC....

Actually next case I buy I hope doesn't come with a power supply. So I
have reason to get a good pc power and cooling.

Think that might be my problem is I got a bad power supply look a
couple threads down about 2 or 2.5 gigs working with new vid card but 3
gigs that worked with old vid card won't work with new vid. And the
video card recommends 350 watt I got semit good 430 true power antec
supply that was included in case. Gonna try two power supplies with
just board supplied with power and see if anything changes.

Power supply is one of the most underated items when lay people build
pc's.

-Dan



BC wrote:
bob9 wrote:

It's been a long time, but the Asus site used to post recommended power
supplies for their boards. [or maybe I just can't find it now] I'm building
a new system and will go with a name brand PS, high efficiency, etc., but
the power requirements are rather vague. Many recommend a "high 12V rail"
which makes good sense, but what is "high"?

Dear Bob9,

here is a very thorough power supply calculator:

http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculator.jsp

PC Power and Cooling has a power supply selector as well,

http://www.pcpowercooling.com/produc...lies/selector/

but more importantly, some of their background info, taken with a grain
of salt, is helpful:

http://www.pcpowercooling.com/technology/myths/

I see a new PC Power and Cooling "Silencer" power supply: a 610W unit,
EPS capable, which you may need.

Chances are this PCPC unit for $99 will be adequate, depending on how
powerful a system you are building:

http://www.pcpowercooling.com/produc...hp?show=S47ATX

Silent PC review likes Seasonic power supplies for their efficiency and
quiet operation:

http://www.silentpcreview.com/article28-page6.html

Note: in my experience, Seasonic does not put out quite as much power
per claimed watt as PCPC units: so, if you are going with Seasonic for
quiet and you need a "430", get the "500", and if you need the "500" get
the "600".

It seems the difference between say a 350 watt and a 500 watt PS is only a
few dollars, and that seems like rather cheap insurance against the next
video card that might gobble power.

Correct: and for heat (which degrades performance both short and long
term), etc.

The devices can only pull their rating, so why get a small one? Most cases
come with 300-350W, but it seems like 400-500W makes more sense, or am I
missing something?

Most power supplies that come with cases are not very good (an
understatement....a PSU is the heart of your system, don't cheap out on
it, a failing PSU can take lots of other components with it when it goes.)

Tom's Hardware did a big torture test last year: Fortron and Seasonic
(again) came out well:

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...st/page30.html

PC Power/Cooling units were 100% within specs, but, their fans were
noisy at full load.

Of note is that several power supplies *failed* (like OCZ's, not one of
my favorites: I am 0 for 2 on OCZ power supplies....)

Intro to Tom's article:

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...est/index.html

Uh oh, I notice they are hawking their own brand he tacky....

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...est/page2.html

And, from what I remember, they toned down the article, minimizing the
failure of the OCZ and the AcBel and BeQuiet and Cooler Master
units....hmm...

So, in summary, get a good name brand like PC Power/Cooling, or
Seasonic. Antec/Enermax/Fortron also good. Would recommend you avoid
modular cables, they introduce another failure point.

HTH,

BC

Note: this was written by PC PC CEO after some other power supply
company hacks wrote to complain that the Tom's 'torture test' was not
fair, after their units blew up:

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/07/...st/page23.html

Statement From PC Power & Cooling

We would like to take the opportunity of including a statement from CEO
of PC Power & Cooling that we just received.

An honest power supply rating is for CONTINUOUS operation at FULL LOAD.
24 hours is a very short test. There should be no complaints! A PSU
should actually run at full load for weeks and months with no problems.

The voltages and output ripple should be within ATX specs at full load.
The tests are NOT too tough. In fact, they're easy, because they are run
at nominal input line voltage and room temperature. I suggest that tests
be conducted at low line voltage and high line voltage using a variac.
These tests would demonstrate the PSU's input operating range and
whether or not the PSU could withstand the sags and surges in today's
world at full load.

Another legitimate test condition is to run the PSUs at full load with
the ambient temperature elevated about 15C to represent the real-life
condition in the computer, rather than the condition on the test bench
(many power supplies have exaggerated wattage claims based on low
ambient temperature assumptions). One more important test would be a
dynamic load test (instantaneous pulse of the +12V output). This would
demonstrate a PSU's ability to handle multiple hard drive access
(servers) or quick changes in CPU and video power loads (gaming PCs,
especially SLI).

In conclusion, the stress tests being conducted by Tom's Hardware are
more than fair. Products that do not pass should be redesigned or
de-rated to realistic power levels.

Doug Dodson, CEO, PC Power & Cooling


PS: I do not work for PCPC....

I've had an Antec Smart power for years and it works fine with my ASUS
boards.

On Tue, 4 Jul 2006 08:08:45 -0700, "bob9" wrote:

It's been a long time, but the Asus site used to post recommended power
supplies for their boards. [or maybe I just can't find it now] I'm building
a new system and will go with a name brand PS, high efficiency, etc., but
the power requirements are rather vague. Many recommend a "high 12V rail"
which makes good sense, but what is "high"?

It seems the difference between say a 350 watt and a 500 watt PS is only a
few dollars, and that seems like rather cheap insurance against the next
video card that might gobble power.

The devices can only pull their rating, so why get a small one? Most cases
come with 300-350W, but it seems like 400-500W makes more sense, or am I
missing something?



I recommend the asus EPS Server version of their 550watt ps.

Like you say, it's not much more money.

You can get more expensive stuff, but I think this is the best bang
for your buck from a reputable firm.

"BC" wrote in message
.com...

Wow-now that I've had a few hours to digest all those links, I appreciate
your posting all the more!
I know more about PS's now than I ever wanted to know, but found it
fascinating stuff.

Biggest surprise was the false claims and pure BS that makers put in their
specs. There is no standard so they can pretty much make up what they want.
Efficiency low? Test at a lower ambient temp and the PS is more efficient
and put that in the spec. The fact that no computer operates in a 20C room
doesn't phase them at all.

Most interesting is the phony "dual 12 V rail". There is a safety standard
that wires easily accessible to the public cannot carry more than 240
voltamps, so the old 12 V rail could not carry more than 20 amps, max. [it's
ok inside TV's and monitors because they are not normally accessible]

But the 12 volt rail needed to be increased for today's machines. The
solution? Bring out two wires FROM THE SAME EXACT SOURCE and call it dual
rails. Several testing agencies noted this flim-flam. One tester said a dual
rail with 16 amps on each one, can actually carry 32 amps on one and zero on
the other, and the PS will never burp or know the difference.

Interesting, eh?

Anyway, I have my list and will see which has the best price at Frys
tomorrow.