Some CDr brands degrade within months article

(I only unplonked you to see this one response.)

smh wrote:

"Brendan R. Wehrung" wrote:

Sammy's comments degrade within nanoseconds of being written.
That's the only expalanation for why they smell so bad by they
time they get here.

Is that your pitiful way of "proving" any of the following is a
libel?

Sammy, Mike may be a liar or he may be a saint. BUT I DON'T CARE. YOU'RE
SPAMMING THE NEWSGROUPS. That's why many people have killfiled you.

*plonk*, again, this time for sure.

-- Niko

.. --------------------------------------
Mike Richter, were you born with
"Scam Artist" emblazoned on your face?
--------------------------------------

Nikos Chantziaras wrote:

(I only unplonked you to see this one response.)

Do you know which asshole you unplonked?


smh wrote:

"Brendan R. Wehrung" wrote:

Sammy's comments degrade within nanoseconds of being written.
That's the only expalanation for why they smell so bad by they
time they get here.

Is that your pitiful way of "proving" any of the following is a
libel?

Sammy, Mike may be a liar or he may be a saint. BUT I DON'T CARE. YOU'RE
SPAMMING THE NEWSGROUPS. That's why many people have killfiled you.

*plonk*, again, this time for sure.

When was the last time you checked how many assholes you had, Asshole?

You better make sure you plugged them all.

On 2 Sep 2003 13:51:20 -0700, (Who Me?) wrote:

Some CDr brands degrade within months article

http://theregister.co.uk/content/54/32593.html

Not much detail there, but I've certainly seen lots of CDs degrade
within 6 months or so. This includes TY, Kodak Gold, Kodak Silver,
etc. I also have cheap CDs (as well as the above brands) that have
lasted for years and are still going. Most of the older ones were
written at half speed on Plextor burners; full speed writing just lets
them decay even faster. Newer ones are on Teac and Lite-On burners;
I'm still testing them, but it looks like it's going to be the same
thing.

I don't care what the industry says about lifetimes, I know for a fact
this is a big problem.


Neil Maxwell - I don't speak for my employer

I've had good luck with Phthalocyanine CDRs. But how long they'll last
is a good question. I think the industry needs to come up with a
permanent data storage medium. Let's crank up the wattage and punch
holes in something durable



On Mon, 08 Sep 2003 16:45:05 -0700, Neil Maxwell
wrote:

On 2 Sep 2003 13:51:20 -0700, (Who Me?) wrote:

Some CDr brands degrade within months article

http://theregister.co.uk/content/54/32593.html

Not much detail there, but I've certainly seen lots of CDs degrade
within 6 months or so. This includes TY, Kodak Gold, Kodak Silver,
etc. I also have cheap CDs (as well as the above brands) that have
lasted for years and are still going. Most of the older ones were
written at half speed on Plextor burners; full speed writing just lets
them decay even faster. Newer ones are on Teac and Lite-On burners;
I'm still testing them, but it looks like it's going to be the same
thing.

I don't care what the industry says about lifetimes, I know for a fact
this is a big problem.


Neil Maxwell - I don't speak for my employer

On Tue, 09 Sep 2003 05:53:19 -0700, wrote:

I've had good luck with Phthalocyanine CDRs. But how long they'll last
is a good question. I think the industry needs to come up with a
permanent data storage medium. Let's crank up the wattage and punch
holes in something durable

Yep, there's sure no subsitute for pressed layers of aluminum...



Neil Maxwell - I don't speak for my employer

Neil Maxwell wrote:

On Tue, 09 Sep 2003 05:53:19 -0700, wrote:

I've had good luck with Phthalocyanine CDRs. But how long they'll last
is a good question. I think the industry needs to come up with a
permanent data storage medium. Let's crank up the wattage and punch
holes in something durable

Yep, there's sure no subsitute for pressed layers of aluminum...

Neil Maxwell - I don't speak for my employer

What might be the indications that a CDr is failing? Also, if it begins to
fail could one make a new copy using the very good EAC?

On Wed, 10 Sep 2003 00:06:29 GMT, lid
wrote:

What might be the indications that a CDr is failing? Also, if it begins to
fail could one make a new copy using the very good EAC?

Depends on how bad the failure is. Some of my older discs have areas
that are unreadable with any combination of hardware and software. If
you catch it early enough, you can make a copy. There's no visual
indication of trouble I've been able to find, even under a microscope.

For data:
The blue screen while reading is a dead giveaway. In less drastic
deterioration, my Ultraplex reader will slow down in the middle and
chunk away more, eventually reading it, but slowly. Generally a
burner will read discs that a reader won't, but as they get worse,
neither works, and you're just out of luck. Best bet is to try an
assortment of drives.

For audio:
I have several finicky readers, and some robust ones. My NAD changer
on the big stereo is the most finicky, and is a great test bed.
Generally, a music CD will work fine when freshly burned, but over
time, will start skipping and stuttering (burning at half the max
burner speed adds greatly to the life). The same CD works fine longer
in my Apex DVD/MP3 reader, but eventually will stop reading there as
well. I pulled out an old compilation from '97, and the NAD wouldn't
even play the first track without skipping. The Apex would read up to
about track 8 (of 15), but started skipping badly after that. The PC
had no luck reading the disc, but I didn't try EAC on it. I'll give
that a shot this weekend.




Neil Maxwell - I don't speak for my employer

On Wed, 10 Sep 2003 18:10:30 +0100, James Perrett
wrote:

Decent media written in a good drive shouldn't be showing any errors -
at least in my experience of around 8 years of CD-R usage. If you are
getting any errors at all then you are either scrimping on the media or
have a faulty drive.

Nope, not a case of scrimping, even when media was really expensive
($5/disk and more). I used to use expensive drives until I figured
out that it didn't matter.

I've used various writers (JVC 2x, Plextor 4x and 8x, Teac/Liteon/
whatever in the 24x+ lineups) and the best media available at the
time, according to Usenet wisdom (not always based on fact, of
course), including Mitsui, KAO, Kodak Gold, Kodak Silver, and various
TY (as well as some cheap stuff here and there), some with labels,
some not.

Kodak Gold discs burned on a Plextor writer at half-max speed have
shown the problem of data deterioration.

Storage conditions vary for these discs, but even discs stored in
cool, dark, dry locations have problems, while other discs stored next
to them don't.

This is not something unique; lots of people out there have had these
problems. There was a long thread from Mac types back in 2000 he
http://www.macintouch.com/cdrfailure.html

Lots of hypotheses, guesses, and tribal knowledge, very little hard
data, but plenty of CDR lifetime failures.

YMMV, of course, but CDRs are not archival by any stretch of the
imagination.



Neil Maxwell - I don't speak for my employer

Neil Maxwell wrote:

On Wed, 10 Sep 2003 18:10:30 +0100, James Perrett
wrote:

Decent media written in a good drive shouldn't be showing any errors -
at least in my experience of around 8 years of CD-R usage. If you are
getting any errors at all then you are either scrimping on the media or
have a faulty drive.

Nope, not a case of scrimping, even when media was really expensive
($5/disk and more). I used to use expensive drives until I figured
out that it didn't matter.

I've used various writers (JVC 2x, Plextor 4x and 8x, Teac/Liteon/
whatever in the 24x+ lineups) and the best media available at the
time, according to Usenet wisdom (not always based on fact, of
course), including Mitsui, KAO, Kodak Gold, Kodak Silver, and various
TY (as well as some cheap stuff here and there), some with labels,
some not.

Kodak Gold discs burned on a Plextor writer at half-max speed have
shown the problem of data deterioration.

Storage conditions vary for these discs, but even discs stored in
cool, dark, dry locations have problems, while other discs stored next
to them don't.

This is not something unique; lots of people out there have had these
problems. There was a long thread from Mac types back in 2000 he
http://www.macintouch.com/cdrfailure.html

Lots of hypotheses, guesses, and tribal knowledge, very little hard
data, but plenty of CDR lifetime failures.

YMMV, of course, but CDRs are not archival by any stretch of the
imagination.

Neil Maxwell - I don't speak for my employer


This is interesting because you list many of the same makes that I have
used. Maybe I should go back and check a few more of my older discs. Now
that I have a Plextor Premium drive it is much easier to obtain hard
error rate data.

Cheers.

James.

In article , Neil Maxwell wrote:
On Tue, 09 Sep 2003 05:53:19 -0700, wrote:

I've had good luck with Phthalocyanine CDRs. But how long they'll last
is a good question. I think the industry needs to come up with a
permanent data storage medium. Let's crank up the wattage and punch
holes in something durable

Yep, there's sure no subsitute for pressed layers of aluminum...

Maybe not, I've read of a fungus that grows between the layers
"eating" the aluminum and therefore the data.

--wally.