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Ghost: How to differentiate between drives when cloning?



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 20th 06, 06:37 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
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Default Ghost: How to differentiate between drives when cloning?


Concerning Symantec's Ghost (7.51):

Any practical tips to make ghosting more secure and ease when
cloning disk to disk? Sizes, partitions, etc. are almost same so
formatting target disk before cloning is a (bad) option.

No way to name/label them, or must change to some other cloning
software?


Googled:
http://service1.symantec.com/SUPPORT...s v_lvl=&seg=

and same tinyed:
http://tinyurl.com/l8758

which indicates some kind of dead end or flaw.


Jukka

  #2  
Old June 20th 06, 07:10 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
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Default Ghost: How to differentiate between drives when cloning?

Concerning Symantec's Ghost (7.51):

Use Ghost 8.3



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  #3  
Old June 20th 06, 07:17 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
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Default Ghost: How to differentiate between drives when cloning?

Jukka I Seppänen wrote

Concerning Symantec's Ghost (7.51):


Any practical tips to make ghosting more secure and ease
when cloning disk to disk? Sizes, partitions, etc. are almost
same so formatting target disk before cloning is a (bad) option.


No way to name/label them, or must change to some other cloning software?


Googled:
http://service1.symantec.com/SUPPORT...s v_lvl=&seg=


and same tinyed:
http://tinyurl.com/l8758


which indicates some kind of dead end or flaw.


Use True Image and get quite a bit of extra stuff as well.


  #4  
Old June 20th 06, 09:30 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
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Default Ghost: How to differentiate between drives when cloning?

""Jukka I Seppänen"" wrote:

Concerning Symantec's Ghost (7.51):

Any practical tips to make ghosting more secure and ease when
cloning disk to disk? Sizes, partitions, etc. are almost same so
formatting target disk before cloning is a (bad) option.

No way to name/label them, or must change to some other cloning
software?



You don't say what the problem is.

In my own periodic archiving of clones, I put folders on the
Desktop of the new clone before I start it up that have names
that identify the date of cloning and which hard drive they're
on and which partition they are in on the archive hard drive.
Then, when the clone is started up, I can see from a glance
at the Desktop that I have the right clone. This is easy to do
with the utility that I use because the entire cloning process
is done with Windows running, and when the process is done,
I have immediate access to the clone's file structure. That
utility is Casper XP, and you can download a free 30-day trial
copy from www.FSSdev.com/products/casperxp/ .

If you want to keep multiple clones on a large backup hard
drive as I do, it's easy if you know the syntax of the boot.ini
file. If you want to get into that, Google for my posting on
"The meaning of "rdisk()" in January of this year in this NG.
What I said about PATA drives applies also to SATA drives
except that there is no concern with jumpering. If you get into
maintaining multiple clones - all equally bootable - it helps to
put hard drive and partition location information into the text
string portion of each entry in boot.ini so you know what
you're selecting at boot time.

*TimDaniels*

  #5  
Old June 20th 06, 10:16 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
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Default Ghost: How to differentiate between drives when cloning?

Timothy Daniels wrote
Jukka I Seppänen wrote


Concerning Symantec's Ghost (7.51):


Any practical tips to make ghosting more secure and ease when
cloning disk to disk? Sizes, partitions, etc. are almost same so
formatting target disk before cloning is a (bad) option.


No way to name/label them, or must change to some other cloning software?


You don't say what the problem is.


Cloning backwards, getting the source and destination reversed
so instead of cloning the drive you want to clone, you clone the
destination to what should be the source and you lose everything.

In my own periodic archiving of clones, I put folders on the
Desktop of the new clone before I start it up that have names
that identify the date of cloning and which hard drive they're
on and which partition they are in on the archive hard drive.
Then, when the clone is started up, I can see from a glance
at the Desktop that I have the right clone. This is easy to do
with the utility that I use because the entire cloning process
is done with Windows running, and when the process is done,
I have immediate access to the clone's file structure. That
utility is Casper XP, and you can download a free 30-day trial
copy from www.FSSdev.com/products/casperxp/ .


If you want to keep multiple clones on a large backup hard
drive as I do, it's easy if you know the syntax of the boot.ini
file. If you want to get into that, Google for my posting on
"The meaning of "rdisk()" in January of this year in this NG.


No point, it utterly mangled the story.

What I said about PATA drives applies also to SATA drives
except that there is no concern with jumpering. If you get into
maintaining multiple clones - all equally bootable - it helps to
put hard drive and partition location information into the text
string portion of each entry in boot.ini so you know what
you're selecting at boot time.



  #6  
Old June 21st 06, 01:56 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
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Default Ghost: How to differentiate between drives when cloning?

"Peter" writes:

Concerning Symantec's Ghost (7.51):


Use Ghost 8.3


1.436 MB with floppies, oucht!

Thanks anyway, will test.

Jukka
  #7  
Old June 21st 06, 02:16 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
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Default Ghost: How to differentiate between drives when cloning?

"Timothy Daniels" writes:

""Jukka I Seppänen"" wrote:


You don't say what the problem is.


("...windows running..."). Ok, left out some die-hard DOS-habits and
some easy to use practises.


Goal is to make fast repairs a long away with dummies (more than I am).
So when that dreaded total disaster hits (by babies, trucks, etc.)
thing can be explained by phone:
"Take that HD and connect two (different) cables, check up- and down-
positions, plug and go. Don't put HD over anything metal, just sides
connect with metal."

For a small companies fast turn up times might be critical, theirs
customers won't wait days, maybe only one hour max. no matter the
reason.

Identical 1:1 copies are good, thats why differentiate between new
and old is difficult.

Yes, those RAID's are too bulky and expensive.
Trying just to keep things simple for simple people, anything more
complicated is too prone to user errors for people which don't do
those things everyday, without hurry, dead tired or any former
background.

I have immediate access to the clone's file structure. That
utility is Casper XP, and you can download a free 30-day trial
copy from www.FSSdev.com/products/casperxp/ .



Will check that. Thanks.


Jukka
  #8  
Old June 21st 06, 03:45 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
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Default Ghost: How to differentiate between drives when cloning?

Concerning Symantec's Ghost (7.51):

Use Ghost 8.3


1.436 MB with floppies, oucht!


Floppies??? Don't you have CD/DVD-ROM?



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  #9  
Old June 21st 06, 03:49 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
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Default Ghost: How to differentiate between drives when cloning?

(SNIP & more SNIP)...

Jukka:
In addition to the recomendations you've already received, let me add a few
thoughts which may prove of some interest to you...

Assuming you're dealing in an XP OS environment, I think you should jettison
that Ghost 7+ version. There are so many incompatibilities with that version
of Ghost with respect to XP that it's simply not a viable tool to use in my
view.

Assuming that your interest is chiefly, if not exclusively, in straight
disk-to-disk cloning with the objective of providing a near-failsafe backup
system that's relatively simple to employ and effective in its results, here
are my thoughts on the matter...

Over the years we've used various versions of the Norton Ghost program to
undertake direct disk-to-disk cloning operations. Where the XP OS is
concerned we use the Ghost 2003 version. We've found it to be a most
effective tool for our purposes (see below) as well as being simple &
straightforward to use. I've not been thrilled with either Symantec's later
Norton Ghost 9 or their current 10 versions. In comparison with the Ghost
2003 version, I've found both programs awkward to use and unnecessarily
complex for my purposes. So let me now make it clear as to my fundamental
objective in using a disk imaging program such as the Norton Ghost
program...

My exclusive interest is to establish a near-failsafe backup system and to
do so effectively in a reasonably direct, reasonably simple, and reasonably
quick way. I use this type of program for basic disk-to-disk cloning. I'm
not interested in incremental, "differential", or scheduled backups, nor am
I interested in creating "disk images" on removable media such as CD/DVD. My
basic objective is to *directly* clone the contents of my day-to-day working
HD to another HD (either internal or external) so that the "destination"
drive will be (for all practical purposes) an exact duplicate of the
"source" drive and as such, can be used for restoration purposes should the
need arise.

So if your objectives are the same as mine, read on...

Before I provide you (and others who may be interested) with the detailed
instructions involved, let me make the following points.
1. This is *not* complicated business. Using the Ghost 2003 program in an XP
environment in the manner in which I will set forth is a relatively simple &
straightforward process.
2. It (nearly) goes without saying, that in order for the cloning process to
be successful, both the source disk (the drive you're cloning from) and the
destination disk (the drive you're cloning to) must be non-defective and
properly connected/configured in your system.
3. The OS that you're cloning must be free from system files corruption. If
you clone garbage, garbage is what you'll get.
4. In using the Ghost 2003 program, our preference is to work with a Ghost
2003 bootable floppy disk (or on occasion a Ghost 2003 bootable CD). We find
that media simpler to use in comparison with the Windows-Ghost GUI and we
enjoy the portability aspects of using that media. But there's no reason why
you can't work within the Windows-Ghost GUI should you prefer to do so.


It is *vital* that you work with the latest version of the Ghost 2003
program. That's the Ghost 2003.793 build. Should you have an earlier version
of the Ghost 2003 program, you can use Symantec's LiveUpdate feature
available in the Ghost program to download & automatically install that
latest update. Note that the Ghost 2003 program is included in the Ghost 9
and Ghost 10 retail packages and to the best of my knowledge the included
version is the latest (final) version - Ghost 2003.793.

Symantec includes the Ghost 2003 program in their later versions indicating
that they do so because the 2003 version is designed for previous operating
systems, i.e., Win9x/Me. We have found, however, that for basic disk-to-disk
cloning, as described in these instructions, the 2003 version works just
fine in an XP environment. In our view it's simpler to use and just as
effective as the later versions.

So, here are step-by-step instructions for using the Ghost 2003 program
(using a Ghost 2003 bootable floppy disk or bootable CD) to directly clone
the contents of one HD to another HD...

(You needn't be unduly concerned with using this DOS-based media with the
Ghost 2003 program. There are no complicated or exotic DOS commands that one
needs to invoke. As a matter of fact, there are *no* DOS or DOS-like
commands to enter. The entire process is simple, straightforward, and quite
effective)

Creating the bootable Ghost floppy disk:
1. Install the Ghost 2003 program on your computer. As indicated above,
make sure you're using the latest "build" - Ghost 2003.793. If not, use
Ghost's LiveUpdate feature to automatically download the latest version.
It's important that you be using this latest "build".
2. Insert a blank floppy disk (it need not be formatted) and access your
Ghost program.
3. Click on Ghost Utilities.
4. Click on Norton Ghost Boot Wizard.
5. Select Standard Ghost Boot Disk. A dialog box will appear.
a. Select the USB 2.0 Support option (assuming you have that
capability).
b. Select the Assign DOS drive letters option and click Next.
6. Select the Use PC-DOS option.
7. Complete the process following the screen prompts.
8. Remove floppy and label accordingly.

That's it. Now you have a Ghost bootable floppy disk which you can use time
& time again to undertake your present and future cloning operations. Now
when you want to clone the contents of one HD to another HD you simply
insert the Ghost bootable floppy disk in your floppy drive and boot up with
both drives connected.

Should you prefer to use a Ghost bootable CD to undertake cloning
operations, after creating the Ghost bootable floppy disk, you can create a
Ghost bootable CD from it using the Roxio or Nero CD burning programs, or
most other CD burning programs that allow you to create a bootable CD.
Unfortunately I know of no way to *directly* create this bootable CD from
the Ghost program (as you can do, for example, with the Acronis True Image
program).

Before undertaking the cloning operation ensure that the only storage
devices connected are the two HDs that will be involved in the cloning
process, i.e., your source and destination disks. Disconnect any flash
drives, ZIP drives, etc.

Here's how to perform the cloning operation...
1. With both drives connected, boot up with the Ghost bootable floppy (or
Ghost bootable CD). You'll get an initial screen that displays "License
agreement warning". Right-arrow (or tab) over to the "Continue without
marking drives" button and press Enter.
2. The "About Norton Ghost" screen appears. Click OK.
3. Right-arrow twice over to the "To Disk" button and press Enter.
4. The next screen will list both your drives - the Drive 1 (source disk)
and Drive 2 (destination disk). MAKE ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN Drive 1 IS INDEED
YOUR SOURCE DISK, I.E., THE DISK YOU'RE CLONING *FROM*!
Drive 1 will be highlighted. Press Enter.
5. The next screen will have Drive 2 (destination disk) highlighted. AGAIN,
ENSURE THAT Drive 2 IS YOUR DESTINATION DISK, I.E., THE DISK YOU'RE CLONING
*TO*! Press Enter.
6. The next screen is the "Destination Drive Details" window, and reflects
your ultimate destination disk, i.e., your current Drive 2. Press your Tab
key to highlight the OK button and press Enter.
7. The "Proceed with disk clone?" dialog box will open. Left-arrow over to
the Yes button and press Enter.
8. The cloning process will begin. The data transfer speed will vary
depending upon the speed of your processor and the HDs involved. On a medium
to high-powered system you should get transfer speeds ranging from 800
MB/min nearly 2.0 GB/min should you be cloning internal drives. It will be
considerably slower if you're cloning to a USB external HD.
9. After you get the "Clone Completed Successfully" message, left-arrow over
to the Continue button and press Enter.
10. Down-arrow to Quit and press Enter.
11. Click Yes at the "Are you sure you want to quit?" message.
12. Remove the Ghost floppy and shut down the computer.
13. Disconnect your source disk and boot up with the cloned drive. In most
cases (but not always), a Windows "Found New Hardware" message will appear
in the Desktop's Notification Area shortly followed by a "System Settings
Change"
message window informing you that new hardware has been found and asks "Do
you want to restart your computer now?" Click Yes for the reboot.
14. BTW, the reboot of the newly-cloned drive usually takes a longer time
than usual, so one must be patient. On rare occasions the system will fail
to reboot - the system will hang before reaching the Windows XP Welcome
screen. It's a rare occurrence, but you may experience it from time-to-time.
If that does occur, simply use the Ctrl-Alt-Delete keys to reboot.

Assuming you've cloned the contents of your working drive to your second
internal drive, that second drive will be bootable (after disconnecting your
primary one, of course) as indicated above. You also have the option of
cloning your working drive to a USB external hard drive. In that case the
USB EHD is *not* bootable (at least we haven't been able to boot the XP OS
from a USB EHD although we're aware of a number of reports purporting that
this is possible), but you could clone the contents back to your internal
drive for restoration purposes should the need arise.

Just one other point I wish to emphasize with respect to the cloning
operation involving internal drives. Immediately following the cloning
operation and the shutdown of your machine, disconnect your source drive and
boot ONLY to the newly-cloned drive (as indicated in step 13. above). DO NOT
BOOT IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING THE CLONING OPERATION WITH BOTH DRIVES CONNECTED.
Doing so is likely to cause future boot problems with the cloned drive.
Obviously there is no problem in this area should a USB EHD be involved in
the cloning process since that device is not bootable in an XP environment.

I trust the preceding will be of use to you and others who might be thinking
about using the Ghost 2003 program for a routine backup system.

Let me add that there are other disk imaging programs that can do the job,
such as Acronis True Image. Our limited experience with that program has
been quite positive. I know one of your responders, Tim Daniels, is a fan of
the Casper XP program so you might try that program as well.
Anna


  #10  
Old June 21st 06, 06:55 PM posted to comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
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Default Ghost: How to differentiate between drives when cloning?

""Jukka I Seppänen"" wrote:
Goal is to make fast repairs a long away with dummies (more than I am).
So when that dreaded total disaster hits (by babies, trucks, etc.)
thing can be explained by phone:
"Take that HD and connect two (different) cables, check up- and down-
positions, plug and go. Don't put HD over anything metal, just sides
connect with metal."

For a small companies fast turn up times might be critical, theirs
customers won't wait days, maybe only one hour max. no matter the
reason.

Identical 1:1 copies are good, thats why differentiate between new
and old is difficult.



Anna has had good luck with providing systems to her customers
that have removable hard drive racks installed. These are sometimes
called "drive caddies" or "mobile racks" or "removable trays" or
other similar names. It requires use of a spare 5 1/5" bay, and the
racks are made in versions for parallel and serial ATA hard drives.
With such a rack installed, switching from the normal internal hard
drive to a hard drive in a removable hard drive tray involves merely
sliding shutting down the computer, sliding in the tray containing
the removable hard drive, turning the power switch for the removable
tray to "ON", and then starting up the computer. If the removable
hard drive is already in the rack, all one needs to do is to shut down
the computer, switch on the removable hard drive's power switch,
and start up the computer again. There are many makers of such
removable trays, but the brand that I have been using for about 3
years is Kingwin. Their "mobile racks" for PATA drives are described
he http://www.kingwin.com/pdut_Cat.asp?CateID=25 . The same
thing for SATA drives are described he
http://www.kingwin.com/pdut_Cat.asp?CateID=47 .
For PATA drives, I like the model that has the cooling fan in the
bottom of the removable tray. It works well in drawing air in the
front, then down and around the drive, then straight out the back
toward the PC's power supply:
http://www.kingwin.com/pdut_detail.a...teID=25&ID=136 .
This model comes in black as well as beige.
Athena also has some models (model nos. ending with "ATN") with
a bottom fan: http://www.athenapower.com/ .

If you have a jack available for an eSATA cable, you can use
an external enclosure with an eSATA jack for a SATA hard drive
and not have to use up a 5 1/2" expansion bay on the computer.
If the computer doesn't have an eSATA jack available, there are
adapters on the market which fit on the back of the computer.
Here is a place that sells such hardwa
http://www.firewire-1394.com/externa...-solutions.htm .
There are also a slowly growing number of makers of external
enclosures that have eSATA connectors, but you'll have to Google
for them as I still live in the PATA world.

*TimDaniels*


 




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