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#21
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pluging into USB port crashing system
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 10:30:56 -0800 (PST), Flasherly
wrote: On Dec 30, 7:56 pm, Allen Drake wrote: On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:56:19 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote: "Allen Drake" wrote in messagenews:gk9sf7tqvh0qf3qi0rk364vcikfjgocg1b@4ax .com... On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 07:22:06 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote: "Allen Drake" wrote in messagenewskvqf7d8jmf1b8f40rogio8onsf2aeglta@4ax .com... On Thu, 29 Dec 2011 19:10:45 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote: "Allen Drake" wrote in messagenews:cdtpf7lhcrnjoq8v21s4ua7tvffqrkeea9@4ax .com... When I even get close to plugging anything into either of my front panel USB ports the system crashes and reboots. When it boots this time the report says there is no CPU present. I double checked to make sure the cable is plugged in correctly and tried another set of pins on motherboard, there are three, but the result is the same. I have been searching and find others claiming a underpowered PSU is to blame but I have a Termaltake 750 which is new. This is a newly build system and has no other problems. I am using an M4A87TD/US3 board with AMD Phenom and Supertalent RAM. If anyone has any ideas I would appreciate the help. Thanks. Al. It's possible you have a faulty PS. Do you by chance have a spare you could use temporarily? (I know, not exactly a closet shelf item.) Is it possible that the pinout is different from the previous MB (had that happen to me going from one ASUS MB to another)? If you have the manual for your MB (or check it out online), you can compare them. Is this a new problem, or did it manifest itself right after the build was completed? And by "newly build", does that include the case and all? I did check the pin out and actually moved the cable to another position on the board. I am getting a similar reaction by using the rear ports but in that case the system simply locks up. I have a USB3 external drive attached which I will remove and try more debugging later tonight. I am not sure if this just started or not. I have several builds going at one time and sometimes I lose focus. That and the 12 hour days at my day job wears me down a bit. Oh yeah, I remember those days all too well. When I worked at a Ford assembly plant back in the mid 70s, we were on an 80 hour work week for three months. My kids forgot my name and my wife found someone else (although she sure loved that 40 hours of overtime paycheck). We worked from 3PM to 3:30AM M-Sat, and 3-11:30PM on Sunday. After they got the number of vehicles they wanted in storage, they laid off everyone, some for up to two years. Not a good time in southeastern Michigan. I love work so I will take the OT any time I can get it. I have been in the work force since the 60s have done all shifts. I like the grave yard myself but now am confined to 6 AM to 6PM and 8 hrs on Saturdays. My last job I got one Sunday off a month. Defense industry and NASA but that has been cut back somewhat too. But I digress. Keep us posted on your PC. The USB3 ports are only in the back, on the MB, aren't they? The front panel ports are USB2 IIRC from glancing through the manual for your MB. Yes the USB 3 is on the back but the Antec Nine Hundred Two case has a USB 3 and two USB 2 posts on the top front. I think I will get out the multi meter now and see what I can find. I'll let you know what happens. The 3 plug-ins for USB78, 1112, and 910 are allUSB2.0, if I'm reading the manual right. So if the 3.0 on the case is plugged into any of them, that may be where your problem lies. I don't know if the pin-outs are different between USB2.0 and 3.0, but I wouldn't think so. There's no pin-out difference between 1.0 and 2.0, IIRC. (Just guessing here :-) ) I found the problem. It was a bad ground. I connected a wire with alligator clips on each end to the connector on the front to a part of the case that was not painted. It was crude as the small clip was connecting to the small rim of the outer edge of the connector. It barely held on while I looked for a place to connect the other end to and took a chance but it worked. Then I noticed a wire connecting underneath the top next to the large fan. It was a bit loose so I tightened it and so that must have been the real problem. I replaced it with a slightly longer screw and tightened it so it will hold. It seems that little screw is just not long enough to stay tight. I removed the alligator clip wire and all seems well. Now both the front and rear USB posts work as intended. That is weird, for a faulted ground connect to show up as a USB error. When I've had subsequent problems after assembling a system, I may rebuild it either in two ways: a) breadboarded, everything on plastic and connected for powering up together, or b) totally taken down, just for the MB and PS to be meticulously secured into the case, with care in watching for how it's powering up, one by one, then as any extra component are also added. Really ticks me off if I can't get it up and finally right, like the 775 MB/CPU Newegg sent me last time on a special sale. On the box it was shipped, in Newegg's big letters, the sticker says: You may have gotten quite a deal !! . . .A big deal, yep, up half the night tearing apart other systems to try and find a temporary fix for a working-parts combo, giving up, calling Newegg the next morning, and him telling me they're only paying half shipping if I return it? Oh, yea - he did it offer it to me again, at one over again and half off. . . .Be like a $75 MB for $35 on sale, he's finally offering at $17 if I'll just take it and get it out of his hair. Thanks, I said. Only, I just can't take the excitement of another sales frenzy, no more and no thanks. Used to love their open-box sales, but tend these days to look twice for reputable manufacturers and reviews within reasonable pricing on new sealed equipment. Lately I have been putting my systems together on a Top Deck Tech Station http://www.amazon.com/Deck-Tech-Stat.../dp/B001JYRZ54 but this one obviously escaped me as the problem was the case itself. For once I am thankful I couldn't figure out how to get the front off or I may never have found that loose screw. I am sort of used to those kind of things remembering those HeathKit ham radio days of the early 60s I have not fallen for any of those "deals" you mentioned. I just don't feel at my age I have that much time to do any more screwing around then I already do and don't mind disposing of some hard earned money when I have fewer gray matter than I do green. |
#22
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pluging into USB port crashing system
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 18:42:27 +0000 (GMT), "Rodney Pont"
wrote: On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 13:14:05 -0500, Allen Drake wrote: USB 3.0 has five extra pins compared to previous versions, see: http://www.usb3.com/usb3-info.html Yeah, I probably should have looked it up before posting that. Thanks for setting me straight :-) Even the cables are different. I wonder why make different cables if the USB3 is downward compatible. Have a look at the URL above, it explains it all. USB3.0 has 9 conductors while earlier versions have 4. You can fit an earlier cable into a USB3.0 socket but you can't fit a USB3.0 plug into an earlier socket. oh ya....I know that well. While I have never tried on purpose I find that my USB3 drive just won't fit that USB2 connector. |
#23
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pluging into USB port crashing system
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 16:19:19 -0500, Paul wrote:
Allen Drake wrote: On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 07:18:30 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote: "Rodney Pont" wrote in message fohit.me.uk... On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:56:19 -0500, SC Tom wrote: The 3 plug-ins for USB78, 1112, and 910 are allUSB2.0, if I'm reading the manual right. So if the 3.0 on the case is plugged into any of them, that may be where your problem lies. I don't know if the pin-outs are different between USB2.0 and 3.0, but I wouldn't think so. There's no pin-out difference between 1.0 and 2.0, IIRC. (Just guessing here :-) ) USB 3.0 has five extra pins compared to previous versions, see: http://www.usb3.com/usb3-info.html Yeah, I probably should have looked it up before posting that. Thanks for setting me straight :-) Even the cables are different. I wonder why make different cables if the USB3 is downward compatible. The USB3 socket has two sections. A high speed section and a low speed section. The USB1.1 or USB2 connector, fits into the low speed section of the USB3 socket. If a USB3 peripheral is plugged in, then it has access to the high speed interface. The reason it was done that way, is because they needed two diff pairs, to do a nice interface similar to how SATA and PCI Express work. They wanted to be competitive with those standards, and as time passes, USB3 will be able to evolve to match the speeds of the other standards. One thing that differs on USB3, compared to SATA and PCI Express, is the USB3 interconnect cabling can be longer. And that causes some difference in what you can safely do, when designing a standard for higher speeds. http://www.usb3.com/ "One thing to note is that operating simultaneously in SuperSpeed and Hi-Speed is not allowed. It is an either or scenario." So of the nine signals, they're not using all of them at exactly the same time. That page also mentions the names of the signals. VBUS \ D- \___ Traditional USB2 set of pins, includes bus power D+ / GND / RX- \ RX+ \ GND_Drain \___ Full duplex USB3 interface TX- / TX+ / Shield --- outer shield The diagram for that, is easier to see here. http://www.interfacebus.com/usb-cable-diagram-30.html Paul Paul you are overloading my cortex nightly limit. I will have to take a nap now dictated by my synapse energy depletion. ZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzz.................... |
#24
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pluging into USB port crashing system
On Dec 31 2011, 5:47 pm, Allen Drake wrote:
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 10:30:56 -0800 (PST), Flasherly wrote: On Dec 30, 7:56 pm, Allen Drake wrote: On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:56:19 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote: "Allen Drake" wrote in messagenews:gk9sf7tqvh0qf3qi0rk364vcikfjgocg1b@4ax .com... On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 07:22:06 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote: "Allen Drake" wrote in messagenewskvqf7d8jmf1b8f40rogio8onsf2aeglta@4ax .com... On Thu, 29 Dec 2011 19:10:45 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote: "Allen Drake" wrote in messagenews:cdtpf7lhcrnjoq8v21s4ua7tvffqrkeea9@4ax .com... When I even get close to plugging anything into either of my front panel USB ports the system crashes and reboots. When it boots this time the report says there is no CPU present. I double checked to make sure the cable is plugged in correctly and tried another set of pins on motherboard, there are three, but the result is the same. I have been searching and find others claiming a underpowered PSU is to blame but I have a Termaltake 750 which is new. This is a newly build system and has no other problems. I am using an M4A87TD/US3 board with AMD Phenom and Supertalent RAM. If anyone has any ideas I would appreciate the help. Thanks. Al. It's possible you have a faulty PS. Do you by chance have a spare you could use temporarily? (I know, not exactly a closet shelf item.) Is it possible that the pinout is different from the previous MB (had that happen to me going from one ASUS MB to another)? If you have the manual for your MB (or check it out online), you can compare them. Is this a new problem, or did it manifest itself right after the build was completed? And by "newly build", does that include the case and all? I did check the pin out and actually moved the cable to another position on the board. I am getting a similar reaction by using the rear ports but in that case the system simply locks up. I have a USB3 external drive attached which I will remove and try more debugging later tonight. I am not sure if this just started or not. I have several builds going at one time and sometimes I lose focus. That and the 12 hour days at my day job wears me down a bit. Oh yeah, I remember those days all too well. When I worked at a Ford assembly plant back in the mid 70s, we were on an 80 hour work week for three months. My kids forgot my name and my wife found someone else (although she sure loved that 40 hours of overtime paycheck). We worked from 3PM to 3:30AM M-Sat, and 3-11:30PM on Sunday. After they got the number of vehicles they wanted in storage, they laid off everyone, some for up to two years. Not a good time in southeastern Michigan. I love work so I will take the OT any time I can get it. I have been in the work force since the 60s have done all shifts. I like the grave yard myself but now am confined to 6 AM to 6PM and 8 hrs on Saturdays. My last job I got one Sunday off a month. Defense industry and NASA but that has been cut back somewhat too. But I digress. Keep us posted on your PC. The USB3 ports are only in the back, on the MB, aren't they? The front panel ports are USB2 IIRC from glancing through the manual for your MB. Yes the USB 3 is on the back but the Antec Nine Hundred Two case has a USB 3 and two USB 2 posts on the top front. I think I will get out the multi meter now and see what I can find. I'll let you know what happens. The 3 plug-ins for USB78, 1112, and 910 are allUSB2.0, if I'm reading the manual right. So if the 3.0 on the case is plugged into any of them, that may be where your problem lies. I don't know if the pin-outs are different between USB2.0 and 3.0, but I wouldn't think so. There's no pin-out difference between 1.0 and 2.0, IIRC. (Just guessing here :-) ) I found the problem. It was a bad ground. I connected a wire with alligator clips on each end to the connector on the front to a part of the case that was not painted. It was crude as the small clip was connecting to the small rim of the outer edge of the connector. It barely held on while I looked for a place to connect the other end to and took a chance but it worked. Then I noticed a wire connecting underneath the top next to the large fan. It was a bit loose so I tightened it and so that must have been the real problem. I replaced it with a slightly longer screw and tightened it so it will hold. It seems that little screw is just not long enough to stay tight. I removed the alligator clip wire and all seems well. Now both the front and rear USB posts work as intended. That is weird, for a faulted ground connect to show up as a USB error. When I've had subsequent problems after assembling a system, I may rebuild it either in two ways: a) breadboarded, everything on plastic and connected for powering up together, or b) totally taken down, just for the MB and PS to be meticulously secured into the case, with care in watching for how it's powering up, one by one, then as any extra component are also added. Really ticks me off if I can't get it up and finally right, like the 775 MB/CPU Newegg sent me last time on a special sale. On the box it was shipped, in Newegg's big letters, the sticker says: You may have gotten quite a deal !! . . .A big deal, yep, up half the night tearing apart other systems to try and find a temporary fix for a working-parts combo, giving up, calling Newegg the next morning, and him telling me they're only paying half shipping if I return it? Oh, yea - he did it offer it to me again, at one over again and half off. . . .Be like a $75 MB for $35 on sale, he's finally offering at $17 if I'll just take it and get it out of his hair. Thanks, I said. Only, I just can't take the excitement of another sales frenzy, no more and no thanks. Used to love their open-box sales, but tend these days to look twice for reputable manufacturers and reviews within reasonable pricing on new sealed equipment. Lately I have been putting my systems together on a Top Deck Tech Stationhttp://www.amazon.com/Deck-Tech-Station-Open-Air-Standard/dp/B001JYRZ54 How about that. . .first I've seen the likes on one of those. Reminds me of my $300 coffee grinder with the top casings removed for easy burr adjustments. Same applies to both - watch where you're putting that drink, bub. but this one obviously escaped me as the problem was the case itself. For once I am thankful I couldn't figure out how to get the front off or I may never have found that loose screw. I am sort of used to those kind of things remembering those HeathKit ham radio days of the early 60s I have not fallen for any of those "deals" you mentioned. I just don't feel at my age I have that much time to do any more screwing around then I already do and don't mind disposing of some hard earned money when I have fewer gray matter than I do green. Yea, I hear you. (I looked up your ASUS MB before that first post, too - it has some nice reviews along King Overclocker/Tweaker). Last look/see I went through was Pentium D duos and core 2s, various new and used combos;- got frustrating when I realized I liked a (last of the semi-new, being 775 sockets are getting sparser) Intel 45-micron dual core best, over the Celeron lines, on present production lines. |
#25
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pluging into USB port crashing system
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 21:33:06 -0800 (PST), Flasherly
wrote: On Dec 31 2011, 5:47 pm, Allen Drake wrote: On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 10:30:56 -0800 (PST), Flasherly wrote: On Dec 30, 7:56 pm, Allen Drake wrote: On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:56:19 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote: "Allen Drake" wrote in messagenews:gk9sf7tqvh0qf3qi0rk364vcikfjgocg1b@4ax .com... On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 07:22:06 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote: "Allen Drake" wrote in messagenewskvqf7d8jmf1b8f40rogio8onsf2aeglta@4ax .com... On Thu, 29 Dec 2011 19:10:45 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote: "Allen Drake" wrote in messagenews:cdtpf7lhcrnjoq8v21s4ua7tvffqrkeea9@4ax .com... When I even get close to plugging anything into either of my front panel USB ports the system crashes and reboots. When it boots this time the report says there is no CPU present. I double checked to make sure the cable is plugged in correctly and tried another set of pins on motherboard, there are three, but the result is the same. I have been searching and find others claiming a underpowered PSU is to blame but I have a Termaltake 750 which is new. This is a newly build system and has no other problems. I am using an M4A87TD/US3 board with AMD Phenom and Supertalent RAM. If anyone has any ideas I would appreciate the help. Thanks. Al. It's possible you have a faulty PS. Do you by chance have a spare you could use temporarily? (I know, not exactly a closet shelf item.) Is it possible that the pinout is different from the previous MB (had that happen to me going from one ASUS MB to another)? If you have the manual for your MB (or check it out online), you can compare them. Is this a new problem, or did it manifest itself right after the build was completed? And by "newly build", does that include the case and all? I did check the pin out and actually moved the cable to another position on the board. I am getting a similar reaction by using the rear ports but in that case the system simply locks up. I have a USB3 external drive attached which I will remove and try more debugging later tonight. I am not sure if this just started or not. I have several builds going at one time and sometimes I lose focus. That and the 12 hour days at my day job wears me down a bit. Oh yeah, I remember those days all too well. When I worked at a Ford assembly plant back in the mid 70s, we were on an 80 hour work week for three months. My kids forgot my name and my wife found someone else (although she sure loved that 40 hours of overtime paycheck). We worked from 3PM to 3:30AM M-Sat, and 3-11:30PM on Sunday. After they got the number of vehicles they wanted in storage, they laid off everyone, some for up to two years. Not a good time in southeastern Michigan. I love work so I will take the OT any time I can get it. I have been in the work force since the 60s have done all shifts. I like the grave yard myself but now am confined to 6 AM to 6PM and 8 hrs on Saturdays. My last job I got one Sunday off a month. Defense industry and NASA but that has been cut back somewhat too. But I digress. Keep us posted on your PC. The USB3 ports are only in the back, on the MB, aren't they? The front panel ports are USB2 IIRC from glancing through the manual for your MB. Yes the USB 3 is on the back but the Antec Nine Hundred Two case has a USB 3 and two USB 2 posts on the top front. I think I will get out the multi meter now and see what I can find. I'll let you know what happens. The 3 plug-ins for USB78, 1112, and 910 are allUSB2.0, if I'm reading the manual right. So if the 3.0 on the case is plugged into any of them, that may be where your problem lies. I don't know if the pin-outs are different between USB2.0 and 3.0, but I wouldn't think so. There's no pin-out difference between 1.0 and 2.0, IIRC. (Just guessing here :-) ) I found the problem. It was a bad ground. I connected a wire with alligator clips on each end to the connector on the front to a part of the case that was not painted. It was crude as the small clip was connecting to the small rim of the outer edge of the connector. It barely held on while I looked for a place to connect the other end to and took a chance but it worked. Then I noticed a wire connecting underneath the top next to the large fan. It was a bit loose so I tightened it and so that must have been the real problem. I replaced it with a slightly longer screw and tightened it so it will hold. It seems that little screw is just not long enough to stay tight. I removed the alligator clip wire and all seems well. Now both the front and rear USB posts work as intended. That is weird, for a faulted ground connect to show up as a USB error. When I've had subsequent problems after assembling a system, I may rebuild it either in two ways: a) breadboarded, everything on plastic and connected for powering up together, or b) totally taken down, just for the MB and PS to be meticulously secured into the case, with care in watching for how it's powering up, one by one, then as any extra component are also added. Really ticks me off if I can't get it up and finally right, like the 775 MB/CPU Newegg sent me last time on a special sale. On the box it was shipped, in Newegg's big letters, the sticker says: You may have gotten quite a deal !! . . .A big deal, yep, up half the night tearing apart other systems to try and find a temporary fix for a working-parts combo, giving up, calling Newegg the next morning, and him telling me they're only paying half shipping if I return it? Oh, yea - he did it offer it to me again, at one over again and half off. . . .Be like a $75 MB for $35 on sale, he's finally offering at $17 if I'll just take it and get it out of his hair. Thanks, I said. Only, I just can't take the excitement of another sales frenzy, no more and no thanks. Used to love their open-box sales, but tend these days to look twice for reputable manufacturers and reviews within reasonable pricing on new sealed equipment. Lately I have been putting my systems together on a Top Deck Tech Stationhttp://www.amazon.com/Deck-Tech-Station-Open-Air-Standard/dp/B001JYRZ54 How about that. . .first I've seen the likes on one of those. Reminds me of my $300 coffee grinder with the top casings removed for easy burr adjustments. Same applies to both - watch where you're putting that drink, bub. but this one obviously escaped me as the problem was the case itself. For once I am thankful I couldn't figure out how to get the front off or I may never have found that loose screw. I am sort of used to those kind of things remembering those HeathKit ham radio days of the early 60s I have not fallen for any of those "deals" you mentioned. I just don't feel at my age I have that much time to do any more screwing around then I already do and don't mind disposing of some hard earned money when I have fewer gray matter than I do green. Yea, I hear you. (I looked up your ASUS MB before that first post, too - it has some nice reviews along King Overclocker/Tweaker). Last look/see I went through was Pentium D duos and core 2s, various new and used combos;- got frustrating when I realized I liked a (last of the semi-new, being 775 sockets are getting sparser) Intel 45-micron dual core best, over the Celeron lines, on present production lines. I have an Intel D915PBL sitting on a Tech Station in front of me that I resurrected that I like. Nice little Pentium E6800 3.33 GHz Processor - Dual-core(775 Socket) sitting on top that does a fine job for most things anyone would need to do. The board cost me $25. I used DVD-ROM and HDD I had sitting around for some time along with an oldish PSU and 2 GIG or DDR2 I had from who knows when. I presently have six new systems just sitting here three of which are WinXP tow waiting to go into cases. Some on those cases are going for around $50. although I do like the IN WIN BUC I used last week and the ANTEC Nine Hundred Two, the one with the lose wire. No time for HAM any more. Everyone's on Ultra UHF these days anyway. |
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