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Booting w/ a flash drive
It would seem that a flash drive with a Serial ATA interface would be the
way to go for installing the operating system. I've been wanting to do that for years, but the capacities of flash drives have only recently come done enough to where this is feasible. There are 4GB IDE flash drives available now for like $400... not bad when you consider how expensive 128MB flash RAM was five years ago. Does anyone know of any problems one would run into that I might not have thought of? For instance, is there a limit as to how many times you can read/write with flash RAM, or if so is the number smaller than a mechanical hard drive? Also, I notice that my 128MB USB flash drive is a lot slower than my hard drive, but I figure that's because of USB 1.1 backwards compatibility. But is it possible that perhaps flash RAM is significantly slower than standard RAM? And what about the interface; will mechanical hard drives' transfer rates ever exceed the bottleneck of the fastest interface (i.e. Serial ATA, or whatever's faster if anything), and if so what would be the point of switching to a flash drive? Might also like to move the swap file over to this drive. I'd like to hear people's opinions on booting from a flash drive. Might even like to know about large RAID configs... whether for increasing the capacity or increasing the speed. Not much about computer hardware thrills me anymore. Graphics card technology has accelerated so fast that the fun is gone. But this stuff ... this stuff is the last lingering concept that still thrills me. Jon |
#2
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On Fri, 21 May 2004 16:49:19 -0700, "Jon Davis"
wrote: It would seem that a flash drive with a Serial ATA interface would be the way to go for installing the operating system. I've been wanting to do that for years, but the capacities of flash drives have only recently come done enough to where this is feasible. There are 4GB IDE flash drives available now for like $400... not bad when you consider how expensive 128MB flash RAM was five years ago. Does anyone know of any problems one would run into that I might not have thought of? For instance, is there a limit as to how many times you can read/write with flash RAM, or if so is the number smaller than a mechanical hard drive? Yes, that is one of the reasons very few people use flash drives. Typically they'll withstand 10,000-1,000,000 write cycles. Best use would be to put a swap file or any other often-accessed files on a ramdrive of system memory instead of the flash drive. Also, I notice that my 128MB USB flash drive is a lot slower than my hard drive, but I figure that's because of USB 1.1 backwards compatibility. But is it possible that perhaps flash RAM is significantly slower than standard RAM? yes, it is much, much slower... another reason why few people use flash drives. IIRC the peak is still under 10MB/s. And what about the interface; will mechanical hard drives' transfer rates ever exceed the bottleneck of the fastest interface (i.e. Serial ATA, or whatever's faster if anything), and if so what would be the point of switching to a flash drive? Well it's a chicken-or-egg situation. IF the interface were much faster, the drives could be redesigned to transfer from their cache much faster, and it would be more beneficial to have larger cache. The platter itself is still slower though. The point of using a flash drive is elimination of moving parts, for shock resistance, a smaller system case, or power reduction. Might also like to move the swap file over to this drive. That is exactly what you don't want to do. I'd like to hear people's opinions on booting from a flash drive. Might even like to know about large RAID configs... whether for increasing the capacity or increasing the speed. What is there to have an opinion about so far as booting is concerned? It's a drive, you boot it, same as any other, but with all the limitations and benefits of flash memory. Not much about computer hardware thrills me anymore. Graphics card technology has accelerated so fast that the fun is gone. But this stuff ... this stuff is the last lingering concept that still thrills me. Every now and then I think about running a system from a flash drive, but done a little differently. My idea was to use MS Drivespace, with the flash drive holding the partition image file, then when system boots the first thing that happens is a ramdrive is created, the partition image is copied over from the flash drive (which is the end of the flash drive's function in the system), then system boots Windows (probably 98lite) from the Drivespace volume on the system-memory ramdrive. The key to making tha work might be to have the ramdrive drivespace volume file copied back to the flash drive whenever the system is rebooted, so it's good for a few thousand reboots at least. |
#3
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Okay then. So I retract. There went that longing. whoosh .. LOL .. *sob*
Jon "kony" wrote in message ... On Fri, 21 May 2004 16:49:19 -0700, "Jon Davis" wrote: It would seem that a flash drive with a Serial ATA interface would be the way to go for installing the operating system. I've been wanting to do that for years, but the capacities of flash drives have only recently come done enough to where this is feasible. There are 4GB IDE flash drives available now for like $400... not bad when you consider how expensive 128MB flash RAM was five years ago. Does anyone know of any problems one would run into that I might not have thought of? For instance, is there a limit as to how many times you can read/write with flash RAM, or if so is the number smaller than a mechanical hard drive? Yes, that is one of the reasons very few people use flash drives. Typically they'll withstand 10,000-1,000,000 write cycles. Best use would be to put a swap file or any other often-accessed files on a ramdrive of system memory instead of the flash drive. Also, I notice that my 128MB USB flash drive is a lot slower than my hard drive, but I figure that's because of USB 1.1 backwards compatibility. But is it possible that perhaps flash RAM is significantly slower than standard RAM? yes, it is much, much slower... another reason why few people use flash drives. IIRC the peak is still under 10MB/s. And what about the interface; will mechanical hard drives' transfer rates ever exceed the bottleneck of the fastest interface (i.e. Serial ATA, or whatever's faster if anything), and if so what would be the point of switching to a flash drive? Well it's a chicken-or-egg situation. IF the interface were much faster, the drives could be redesigned to transfer from their cache much faster, and it would be more beneficial to have larger cache. The platter itself is still slower though. The point of using a flash drive is elimination of moving parts, for shock resistance, a smaller system case, or power reduction. Might also like to move the swap file over to this drive. That is exactly what you don't want to do. I'd like to hear people's opinions on booting from a flash drive. Might even like to know about large RAID configs... whether for increasing the capacity or increasing the speed. What is there to have an opinion about so far as booting is concerned? It's a drive, you boot it, same as any other, but with all the limitations and benefits of flash memory. Not much about computer hardware thrills me anymore. Graphics card technology has accelerated so fast that the fun is gone. But this stuff .... this stuff is the last lingering concept that still thrills me. Every now and then I think about running a system from a flash drive, but done a little differently. My idea was to use MS Drivespace, with the flash drive holding the partition image file, then when system boots the first thing that happens is a ramdrive is created, the partition image is copied over from the flash drive (which is the end of the flash drive's function in the system), then system boots Windows (probably 98lite) from the Drivespace volume on the system-memory ramdrive. The key to making tha work might be to have the ramdrive drivespace volume file copied back to the flash drive whenever the system is rebooted, so it's good for a few thousand reboots at least. |
#4
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Jon,
Interesting concept, I like the idea but it looks like consumer technology is not up to par quite yet, maybe very soon. Thanks for the information Kony!! Edward W. El Paso, TX "Jon Davis" wrote in message ... Okay then. So I retract. There went that longing. whoosh .. LOL .. *sob* Jon "kony" wrote in message ... On Fri, 21 May 2004 16:49:19 -0700, "Jon Davis" wrote: It would seem that a flash drive with a Serial ATA interface would be the way to go for installing the operating system. I've been wanting to do that for years, but the capacities of flash drives have only recently come done enough to where this is feasible. There are 4GB IDE flash drives available now for like $400... not bad when you consider how expensive 128MB flash RAM was five years ago. Does anyone know of any problems one would run into that I might not have thought of? For instance, is there a limit as to how many times you can read/write with flash RAM, or if so is the number smaller than a mechanical hard drive? Yes, that is one of the reasons very few people use flash drives. Typically they'll withstand 10,000-1,000,000 write cycles. Best use would be to put a swap file or any other often-accessed files on a ramdrive of system memory instead of the flash drive. Also, I notice that my 128MB USB flash drive is a lot slower than my hard drive, but I figure that's because of USB 1.1 backwards compatibility. But is it possible that perhaps flash RAM is significantly slower than standard RAM? yes, it is much, much slower... another reason why few people use flash drives. IIRC the peak is still under 10MB/s. And what about the interface; will mechanical hard drives' transfer rates ever exceed the bottleneck of the fastest interface (i.e. Serial ATA, or whatever's faster if anything), and if so what would be the point of switching to a flash drive? Well it's a chicken-or-egg situation. IF the interface were much faster, the drives could be redesigned to transfer from their cache much faster, and it would be more beneficial to have larger cache. The platter itself is still slower though. The point of using a flash drive is elimination of moving parts, for shock resistance, a smaller system case, or power reduction. Might also like to move the swap file over to this drive. That is exactly what you don't want to do. I'd like to hear people's opinions on booting from a flash drive. Might even like to know about large RAID configs... whether for increasing the capacity or increasing the speed. What is there to have an opinion about so far as booting is concerned? It's a drive, you boot it, same as any other, but with all the limitations and benefits of flash memory. Not much about computer hardware thrills me anymore. Graphics card technology has accelerated so fast that the fun is gone. But this stuff ... this stuff is the last lingering concept that still thrills me. Every now and then I think about running a system from a flash drive, but done a little differently. My idea was to use MS Drivespace, with the flash drive holding the partition image file, then when system boots the first thing that happens is a ramdrive is created, the partition image is copied over from the flash drive (which is the end of the flash drive's function in the system), then system boots Windows (probably 98lite) from the Drivespace volume on the system-memory ramdrive. The key to making tha work might be to have the ramdrive drivespace volume file copied back to the flash drive whenever the system is rebooted, so it's good for a few thousand reboots at least. |
#5
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One more thing you forgot to mention is that flash drives are made with
SRAM(Static Ramdom Access Memory) which does not need a constant charge to sustain it's data. It does use transistors as the basis for holding binary information. Please correct me if i'm wrong. Thanks, Edward W. El paso, Tx "Jon Davis" wrote in message ... It would seem that a flash drive with a Serial ATA interface would be the way to go for installing the operating system. I've been wanting to do that for years, but the capacities of flash drives have only recently come done enough to where this is feasible. There are 4GB IDE flash drives available now for like $400... not bad when you consider how expensive 128MB flash RAM was five years ago. Does anyone know of any problems one would run into that I might not have thought of? For instance, is there a limit as to how many times you can read/write with flash RAM, or if so is the number smaller than a mechanical hard drive? Also, I notice that my 128MB USB flash drive is a lot slower than my hard drive, but I figure that's because of USB 1.1 backwards compatibility. But is it possible that perhaps flash RAM is significantly slower than standard RAM? And what about the interface; will mechanical hard drives' transfer rates ever exceed the bottleneck of the fastest interface (i.e. Serial ATA, or whatever's faster if anything), and if so what would be the point of switching to a flash drive? Might also like to move the swap file over to this drive. I'd like to hear people's opinions on booting from a flash drive. Might even like to know about large RAID configs... whether for increasing the capacity or increasing the speed. Not much about computer hardware thrills me anymore. Graphics card technology has accelerated so fast that the fun is gone. But this stuff .... this stuff is the last lingering concept that still thrills me. Jon |
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