Now let's fix the USB card!

OK

You guys helped me decide what to do about streaming old movies so how
about this annoyance.

Having to physically reinsert the card into the slot to get it found is
not working out. However there isn't a dust bunny to be found in the
computer any longer.

Windows XP SP3. 2 empty PCI slots. MSI NF980-G65 motherboard

Put the card in a slot, boot machine, asks for driver. Put enclosed CD
in, run setup finds card, shows up in device manager and the USB3 card
works perfectly. Even get a nag screen telling me hard drive could run
faster if I'd plug it in the new card. Do so. All is happy.
Shut machine down. Turn on next day, hard drive has disappeared.

OK. Look in device manager and no USB3 card to be found. Put hd back
on old usb port, it's back.

Opened up box, put card in same slot, went through above, works
perfectly until next cold boot.

Defective slot? Let's try the other slot. Same behavior. Works great
until power down and cold boot next morning.

Also cleaned the registry after each uninstall of the driver to be sure
it was reinstalling cleanly.

Reminds me of a 5 year old at a birthday party. Open present, play for
a couple minutes then move on and forget about it.

pheasant16 wrote:
OK

You guys helped me decide what to do about streaming old movies so how
about this annoyance.

Having to physically reinsert the card into the slot to get it found is
not working out. However there isn't a dust bunny to be found in the
computer any longer.

Windows XP SP3. 2 empty PCI slots. MSI NF980-G65 motherboard

Put the card in a slot, boot machine, asks for driver. Put enclosed CD
in, run setup finds card, shows up in device manager and the USB3 card
works perfectly. Even get a nag screen telling me hard drive could run
faster if I'd plug it in the new card. Do so. All is happy.
Shut machine down. Turn on next day, hard drive has disappeared.

OK. Look in device manager and no USB3 card to be found. Put hd back
on old usb port, it's back.

Opened up box, put card in same slot, went through above, works
perfectly until next cold boot.

Defective slot? Let's try the other slot. Same behavior. Works great
until power down and cold boot next morning.

Also cleaned the registry after each uninstall of the driver to be sure
it was reinstalling cleanly.

Reminds me of a 5 year old at a birthday party. Open present, play for
a couple minutes then move on and forget about it.


I see the system has a total of five PCI Express slots. The two x1 slots
are probably PCI Express Rev 1.1. The top two video could be x16 Rev 2.0
slots, while the bottom video could be a Rev 1.1 slot.

http://www.techfresh.net/wp-content/...980_G65-22.jpg

The thing is, I can't find any block diagrams this morning, to verify
what's up with the chipset. The MSI manual (of course), doesn't have
a block diagram. Gigabyte are more likely to include a block diagram.
I wouldn't really mind, if I could find an 980a diagram elsewhere.

The thing is, the PCI Express USB3 cards run faster in a Rev.2 slot.

But the card will be no easier to detect than when it sits in the
x1 slot.

PCI Express has a couple PRESENCE pins, and that may aid the chipset
in detecting cards. The BIOS could be doing the detection, and passing
a table to the OS. (PNP OS = No, is the standard BIOS setup where
the BIOS does the thinking, and passes a hardware table and memory
map to the OS. If PNP OS was Yes, the OS does the grunt-work.)

I've run my USB3 card in the x16 Rev2.0 video slot, and it
works faster that way, than in the Rev1.1 slot. You'll only
notice though, if using peripherals that are capable of
running all the way up to ~450MB/sec.

You could do a test with a Linux LiveCD, run "lspci" and
see whether all your current PCI Express cards are visible
after a reboot. That's the only other thing that comes to
mind, for verifying hardware detection using a second
OS. Just to see if the motherboard is a contributor
to the problem, or the Windows OS ENUM isn't working
properly in early boot.

Paul

On Sun, 02 Jul 2017 07:21:48 -0500, pheasant16
wrote:

Windows XP SP3. 2 empty PCI slots. MSI NF980-G65 motherboard

Put the card in a slot, boot machine, asks for driver. Put enclosed CD
in, run setup finds card, shows up in device manager and the USB3 card
works perfectly. Even get a nag screen telling me hard drive could run
faster if I'd plug it in the new card. Do so. All is happy.
Shut machine down. Turn on next day, hard drive has disappeared.

OK. Look in device manager and no USB3 card to be found. Put hd back
on old usb port, it's back.

Opened up box, put card in same slot, went through above, works
perfectly until next cold boot.

Defective slot? Let's try the other slot. Same behavior. Works great
until power down and cold boot next morning.

Also cleaned the registry after each uninstall of the driver to be sure
it was reinstalling cleanly.

Reminds me of a 5 year old at a birthday party. Open present, play for
a couple minutes then move on and forget about it.

Much the similar experience I had with a Gigabyte Intel 775 and a PCI
USB3 card. Perhaps a few more anomalies due to [co]existing USB2 and
various understated though unwanted interactions between the card and
the MB's USB ports -- an eventuality, same experiences and end to an
inconsistent long-term residency specific one power-cycle only, then
to draw by inconclusive results from the populated USB3 slot
standpoint promoted for any add-on PCI vantage.

That will interestingly also be the same scenario, for both USB2 and
USB3 to coexist on a new MB, of late acquired, although natively built
as USB3-chipped into and for an included MB driver CD. Haven't
actually quite turned it on from the BIOS as yet, so to initiate the
install;- Two backplane USB3 ports only, with vaguely some notion to
extend them, out to the front, with a powered USB3 hub. ...Short of as
well ACHI compliancy, extensibility an hot-swapping capabilities and
a abundance of SATA ports lacking prior, all further options I hadn't,
now in a somewhat lessened USB3 "imperative". I suppose though that
USB3 really should work immaculately now, at least on the new MB, or
to be otherwise surprised if it didn't.

pheasant16 wrote:

Having to physically reinsert the card into the slot to get
it found is not working out. However there isn't a dust
bunny to be found in the computer any longer.

Windows XP SP3. 2 empty PCI slots. MSI NF980-G65
motherboard

You go on and on talking about a "USB card". You need to define
what that is. Probably a USB flash drive or thumb drive, but it
could be other things.

On Sun, 2 Jul 2017 18:49:53 -0000 (UTC), John Doe
wrote:

pheasant16 wrote:

Having to physically reinsert the card into the slot to get
it found is not working out. However there isn't a dust
bunny to be found in the computer any longer.

Windows XP SP3. 2 empty PCI slots. MSI NF980-G65
motherboard

You go on and on talking about a "USB card". You need to define
what that is. Probably a USB flash drive or thumb drive, but it
could be other things.

You're right and it is. Here's an example of one suitable for
defining, within a sizeable OEM market to fulfill updated USB2, to
USB3, functionality --

4 Port USB 3.0 HUB to PCI-e PCI Express Card Adapter VIA Chipset
Internal Item price $9.95
Shipping service free Standard Shipping
Package include:
1 x 4 ports High Speed PCI Express (PCI-e) USB 3.0
1 x CD driver

No less apparently, as do others functionally fail to meet a minimal
requirement advanced.

pheasant16 wrote:

Having to physically reinsert the card into the slot to get it found is
not working out. However there isn't a dust bunny to be found in the
computer any longer.

why not go into Device Manager (devmgmt.msc) and disable then reenable
the USB card?

Windows XP SP3. 2 empty PCI slots. MSI NF980-G65 motherboard

Put the card in a slot, boot machine, asks for driver. Put enclosed CD
in, run setup finds card, shows up in device manager and the USB3 card
works perfectly.

Windows XP does not have included support for USB3. That's why the
driver is required. If the driver is not loading properly upon boot of
Windows XP, maybe you should check if there is a firmware update for the
PCI USB3 card.

Alternatively, you can define a batch (.bat) file that enables and
enables a device. Get devcon.exe from Microsoft (it's the non-GUI
version of Device Manager) and use it to disable that device and then
enable it. Put the .bat file in your Startup group or add as a
scheduled event in Task Scheduler to run on login.

OK. Look in device manager and no USB3 card to be found. Put hd back
on old usb port, it's back.

The card is not listed as a controller or root hub at all? Then I'd
check for a firmware update. For example, StarTech has the PCI (not
PCI-e but PCI) USB3 card and there is a firmware update for it. You
never mentioned whose USB3 PCI card you have.

Opened up box, put card in same slot, went through above, works
perfectly until next cold boot.

You should not be plugging in daughtercards while there is power to the
slot. Slot cards are not hot-pluggable devices. Could fry them.

Defective slot? Let's try the other slot. Same behavior. Works great
until power down and cold boot next morning.

Your BIOS isn't recognizing the card and why the driver is needed.
Seems the problem is the driver isn't getting loaded when Windows loads.

Also cleaned the registry after each uninstall of the driver to be sure
it was reinstalling cleanly.

Reminds me of a 5 year old at a birthday party. Open present, play for
a couple minutes then move on and forget about it.

Some PCI USB3 cards (e.g., the StarTech example) have a jumper to change
the bus frequency between 33 and 66 Mhz. 66 Mhz should only be used if
the slot is a PCI-X slot (has 2 keys in the slot so the card must have 2
slots to accommodate the keys in the slot). The StarTech card comes
pre-configured with the jumper on which means the card uses 33MHz. Only
if plugged into a 66 MHz slot should the card's jumper be removed (or
hung from a single pin for storage) to auto-negotiate up to 66 MHz. No
idea what motherboard you have (not mentioned) to know if it has only
PCI slots or PCI-X slots.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCI-X

Even if your mobo has no PCI-X slots, check the BIOS does not have a 66
MHz bus speed setting and it is configured for that. Non-PCI-X cards
would also have problems if they were given 66 Mhz clock but you didn't
mention if there are any other PCI cards in your mobo. When I first got
a BIOS with the 66 MHz setting, I figured to use it to make the cards
operate faster. Nope, the cards weren't fast enough. Had to use the
standard 33 Mhz bus clock speed.

Since no idea what mobo you have, it is possible it could have PCI 1.0,
PCI 2.0, or PCI 2.1 slots. Specs on the mobo will tell you which type
of PCI slots it has. You need PCI 2.1 to have 66 Mhz support.

Details are needed:
- Brand and model of motherboard.
- Brand and model of PCI USB3 card.

With that info, you should be able to tell if the card should use a 33
or 66 Mhz clock. If the card doesn't have a jumper or auto-negotiate
clock speed then it should be only a 33 Mhz card and the BIOS shouldn't
be forcing a 66 Mhz clock.

VanguardLH wrote:

pheasant16 wrote:

Having to physically reinsert the card into the slot to get it found is
not working out. However there isn't a dust bunny to be found in the
computer any longer.

why not go into Device Manager (devmgmt.msc) and disable then reenable
the USB card?

Windows XP SP3. 2 empty PCI slots. MSI NF980-G65 motherboard

Put the card in a slot, boot machine, asks for driver. Put enclosed CD
in, run setup finds card, shows up in device manager and the USB3 card
works perfectly.

Windows XP does not have included support for USB3. That's why the
driver is required. If the driver is not loading properly upon boot of
Windows XP, maybe you should check if there is a firmware update for the
PCI USB3 card.

Alternatively, you can define a batch (.bat) file that enables and
enables a device. Get devcon.exe from Microsoft (it's the non-GUI
version of Device Manager) and use it to disable that device and then
enable it. Put the .bat file in your Startup group or add as a
scheduled event in Task Scheduler to run on login.

OK. Look in device manager and no USB3 card to be found. Put hd back
on old usb port, it's back.

The card is not listed as a controller or root hub at all? Then I'd
check for a firmware update. For example, StarTech has the PCI (not
PCI-e but PCI) USB3 card and there is a firmware update for it. You
never mentioned whose USB3 PCI card you have.

Opened up box, put card in same slot, went through above, works
perfectly until next cold boot.

You should not be plugging in daughtercards while there is power to the
slot. Slot cards are not hot-pluggable devices. Could fry them.

Defective slot? Let's try the other slot. Same behavior. Works great
until power down and cold boot next morning.

Your BIOS isn't recognizing the card and why the driver is needed.
Seems the problem is the driver isn't getting loaded when Windows loads.

Also cleaned the registry after each uninstall of the driver to be sure
it was reinstalling cleanly.

Reminds me of a 5 year old at a birthday party. Open present, play for
a couple minutes then move on and forget about it.

Some PCI USB3 cards (e.g., the StarTech example) have a jumper to change
the bus frequency between 33 and 66 Mhz. 66 Mhz should only be used if
the slot is a PCI-X slot (has 2 keys in the slot so the card must have 2
slots to accommodate the keys in the slot). The StarTech card comes
pre-configured with the jumper on which means the card uses 33MHz. Only
if plugged into a 66 MHz slot should the card's jumper be removed (or
hung from a single pin for storage) to auto-negotiate up to 66 MHz. No
idea what motherboard you have (not mentioned) to know if it has only
PCI slots or PCI-X slots.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCI-X

Even if your mobo has no PCI-X slots, check the BIOS does not have a 66
MHz bus speed setting and it is configured for that. Non-PCI-X cards
would also have problems if they were given 66 Mhz clock but you didn't
mention if there are any other PCI cards in your mobo. When I first got
a BIOS with the 66 MHz setting, I figured to use it to make the cards
operate faster. Nope, the cards weren't fast enough. Had to use the
standard 33 Mhz bus clock speed.

Since no idea what mobo you have, it is possible it could have PCI 1.0,
PCI 2.0, or PCI 2.1 slots. Specs on the mobo will tell you which type
of PCI slots it has. You need PCI 2.1 to have 66 Mhz support.

Details are needed:
- Brand and model of motherboard.
- Brand and model of PCI USB3 card.

With that info, you should be able to tell if the card should use a 33
or 66 Mhz clock. If the card doesn't have a jumper or auto-negotiate
clock speed then it should be only a 33 Mhz card and the BIOS shouldn't
be forcing a 66 Mhz clock.

Oops, missed you said "MSI NF980-G65 motherboard".

http://s.kaskus.id/images/2014/04/22...0422025909.JPG

Don't see any PCI-X (or PCI-64) slots on that mobo. Just PCI (just one
key in slot). So check the BIOS for bus clock setting and check if
there is a jumper on the USB3 card for bus speed.

Paul wrote:

The thing is, the PCI Express USB3 cards run faster in a Rev.2 slot.

The OP said he used a PCI slot for the card, not a PCI-e slot. Will
have to wait for clarification from the OP. I know of one PCI (not
PCI-e) USB3 card. There might be other PCI USB3 cards but I know of the
one from StarTech. Users of that card have complained about the card
not found on boot. StarTech came out with a firmware update to help but
they're still working with Gigabyte for a resolution (apparently a BIOS
problem on the Gigabyte mobos).

The OP never mentioned what USB3 card he has (brand and model) to be
sure if it uses a PCI or PCI-e slot. That mobo has both PCI and PCI-e
slots. Only know, so far, the OP said "PCI", not "PCI-e".

https://www.cnet.com/products/msi-nf...-series/specs/

Even if the OP has a PCI-e card, that mobo doesn't have version 2.1
PCI-e slots, just 2.0.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCI_Ex...CI_Express_2.1
"However, the speed is the same as PCI Express 2.0."

So how would a 2.1 PCI-e slot be faster than a 2.0 PCI-e slot?

VanguardLH wrote:
Paul wrote:

The thing is, the PCI Express USB3 cards run faster in a Rev.2 slot.

The OP said he used a PCI slot for the card, not a PCI-e slot. Will
have to wait for clarification from the OP. I know of one PCI (not
PCI-e) USB3 card. There might be other PCI USB3 cards but I know of the
one from StarTech. Users of that card have complained about the card
not found on boot. StarTech came out with a firmware update to help but
they're still working with Gigabyte for a resolution (apparently a BIOS
problem on the Gigabyte mobos).

The OP never mentioned what USB3 card he has (brand and model) to be
sure if it uses a PCI or PCI-e slot. That mobo has both PCI and PCI-e
slots. Only know, so far, the OP said "PCI", not "PCI-e".

https://www.cnet.com/products/msi-nf...-series/specs/

Even if the OP has a PCI-e card, that mobo doesn't have version 2.1
PCI-e slots, just 2.0.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PCI_Ex...CI_Express_2.1
"However, the speed is the same as PCI Express 2.0."

So how would a 2.1 PCI-e slot be faster than a 2.0 PCI-e slot?

It's a PCI express slot.

Bought the card at Best Buy, it's an Insignia

John Doe wrote:
pheasant16 wrote:

Having to physically reinsert the card into the slot to get
it found is not working out. However there isn't a dust
bunny to be found in the computer any longer.

Windows XP SP3. 2 empty PCI slots. MSI NF980-G65
motherboard

You go on and on talking about a "USB card". You need to define
what that is. Probably a USB flash drive or thumb drive, but it
could be other things.


??? What do you call expansion cards daughtercards that are inserted
into the motherboard? Thought the term card was self explanatory. Flash
and thumb drives are inserted into the slots on the card. Sorry if my
vernacular isn't up to your standards. Now that that's clear how
about some help?