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#1
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Can I virtually restore a PC?
Here's my dilemma: I want to recover some photos on my girl's now dead laptop (she spilled coffee in it, typical girl hehe). I have a backup. The laptop was a x63 Windows 10 system with an AMD chip that was 'soldered on', the modern trend where nothing is fixable, and the PC repair guy said it's not worth repairing (he actually got it to work before it completely died, but it had problems ever since the coffee spill that never went away, like some sort of residue was literally gumming up the mobo, possibly spraying some solvent on it would have helped, but I digress). I got a system with lots of RAM, also x64 Win 10, and I run Oracle VirtualBox. So is it possible to somehow virtually restore this dead laptop on VirtualBox? I could of course do a physical restore on my new laptop, get the photos, then restore back to my image file. Just wondering if there's another way. I hate restoring hard drives from image files since I always fear something bad will happen, though so far in the half dozen times I've done it nothing has.
RL |
#2
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Can I virtually restore a PC?
RayLopez99 wrote:
Here's my dilemma: I want to recover some photos on my girl's now dead laptop (she spilled coffee in it, typical girl hehe). I have a backup. The laptop was a x63 Windows 10 system with an AMD chip that was 'soldered on', the modern trend where nothing is fixable, and the PC repair guy said it's not worth repairing (he actually got it to work before it completely died, but it had problems ever since the coffee spill that never went away, like some sort of residue was literally gumming up the mobo, possibly spraying some solvent on it would have helped, but I digress). I got a system with lots of RAM, also x64 Win 10, and I run Oracle VirtualBox. So is it possible to somehow virtually restore this dead laptop on VirtualBox? I could of course do a physical restore on my new laptop, get the photos, then restore back to my image file. Just wondering if there's another way. I hate restoring hard drives from image files since I always fear something bad will happen, thou gh so far in the half dozen times I've done it nothing has. RL What did you use for your backup ? Chances are, you don't need to restore anything, and the image file just needs to be mounted. There are 20+ commercial backup tools, each different... Paul |
#3
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Can I virtually restore a PC?
Paul wrote:
RayLopez99 wrote: Here's my dilemma: I want to recover some photos on my girl's now dead laptop (she spilled coffee in it, typical girl hehe). I have a backup. The laptop was a x63 Windows 10 system with an AMD chip that was 'soldered on', the modern trend where nothing is fixable, and the PC repair guy said it's not worth repairing (he actually got it to work before it completely died, but it had problems ever since the coffee spill that never went away, like some sort of residue was literally gumming up the mobo, possibly spraying some solvent on it would have helped, but I digress). I got a system with lots of RAM, also x64 Win 10, and I run Oracle VirtualBox. So is it possible to somehow virtually restore this dead laptop on VirtualBox? I could of course do a physical restore on my new laptop, get the photos, then restore back to my image file. Just wondering if there's another way. I hate restoring hard drives from image files since I always fear something bad will happen, thou gh so far in the half dozen times I've done it nothing has. RL What did you use for your backup ? Chances are, you don't need to restore anything, and the image file just needs to be mounted. There are 20+ commercial backup tools, each different... Paul You mention a modern trend. Would this machine, perhaps, not have any backups at all ? And you're asking how to get files off an eMMC flash soldered to the motherboard ? You see, the CPU soldered to the motherboard, I think you're dropping a hint that this unit is "thin and light", and has thus many compromises in terms of access. When you know a new computer sucks with regard to this sort of thing, backups are much more important. Paul |
#4
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Can I virtually restore a PC?
Paul kirjoitti 16.4.2019 klo 8.59:
Paul wrote: RayLopez99 wrote: Here's my dilemma:Â* I want to recover some photos on my girl's now dead laptop (she spilled coffee in it, typical girl hehe).Â* I have a backup.Â* The laptop was a x63 Windows 10 system with an AMD chip that was 'soldered on', the modern trend where nothing is fixable, and the PC repair guy said it's not worth repairing (he actually got it to work before it completely died, but it had problems ever since the coffee spill that never went away, like some sort of residue was literally gumming up the mobo, possibly spraying some solvent on it would have helped, but I digress).Â* I got a system with lots of RAM, also x64 Win 10, and I run Oracle VirtualBox.Â* So is it possible to somehow virtually restore this dead laptop on VirtualBox?Â* I could of course do a physical restore on my new laptop, get the photos, then restore back to my image file.Â* Just wondering if there's another way.Â* I hate restoring hard drives from image files since I always fear something bad will happen, thou gh so far in the half dozen times I've done it nothing has. RL What did you use for your backup ? Chances are, you don't need to restore anything, and the image file just needs to be mounted. There are 20+ commercial backup tools, each different... Â*Â* Paul You mention a modern trend. Would this machine, perhaps, not have any backups at all ? And you're asking how to get files off an eMMC flash soldered to the motherboard ? You see, the CPU soldered to the motherboard, I think you're dropping a hint that this unit is "thin and light", and has thus many compromises in terms of access. When you know a new computer sucks with regard to this sort of thing, backups are much more important. Â*Â* Paul What is the make/model of her laptop? If it has a "normal" HDD, why not only take that of of it and connect to your machine? If it's a soldered eMMC, that might make it more problematical -- ----------------------------------------------------- Thomas Wendell Helsinki, Finland Translation to/from FI/SWE not always accurate ----------------------------------------------------- |
#5
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Can I virtually restore a PC?
On Tuesday, April 16, 2019 at 5:16:55 AM UTC-4, tumppiw wrote:
Paul kirjoitti 16.4.2019 klo 8.59: Paul wrote: RayLopez99 wrote: Here's my dilemma:Â* I want to recover some photos on my girl's now dead laptop (she spilled coffee in it, typical girl hehe).Â* I have a backup.Â* The laptop was a x63 Windows 10 system with an AMD chip that was 'soldered on', the modern trend where nothing is fixable, and the PC repair guy said it's not worth repairing (he actually got it to work before it completely died, but it had problems ever since the coffee spill that never went away, like some sort of residue was literally gumming up the mobo, possibly spraying some solvent on it would have helped, but I digress).Â* I got a system with lots of RAM, also x64 Win 10, and I run Oracle VirtualBox.Â* So is it possible to somehow virtually restore this dead laptop on VirtualBox?Â* I could of course do a physical restore on my new laptop, get the photos, then restore back to my image file.Â* Just wondering if there's another way.Â* I hate restoring hard drives from image files since I always fear something bad will happen, thou gh so far in the half dozen times I've done it nothing has. RL What did you use for your backup ? Chances are, you don't need to restore anything, and the image file just needs to be mounted. There are 20+ commercial backup tools, each different... Â*Â* Paul You mention a modern trend. Would this machine, perhaps, not have any backups at all ? And you're asking how to get files off an eMMC flash soldered to the motherboard ? You see, the CPU soldered to the motherboard, I think you're dropping a hint that this unit is "thin and light", and has thus many compromises in terms of access. When you know a new computer sucks with regard to this sort of thing, backups are much more important. Â*Â* Paul What is the make/model of her laptop? If it has a "normal" HDD, why not only take that of of it and connect to your machine? If it's a soldered eMMC, that might make it more problematical -- ----------------------------------------------------- Thomas Wendell Helsinki, Finland Translation to/from FI/SWE not always accurate ----------------------------------------------------- I see. Interesting. Well I'm not an expert with modern PC laptops but back in the day I've built towers and even soldered together ribbon cables, lol, but I think I can do what you ask, if I understood correctly. I will write what I understood below. From the two answers by Paul and tumppiw, I think there are two options on how to proceed. On the first option, the backup program (to answer Paul) was Macrium Reflect Free (I think, from memory, unless I used that cheap Chinese software backup forget the name now starts with an A). So regarding Paul's option, I wonder, if I pay for the Macrium Reflect Pro (paid version) that perhaps I can 'mount' the Image file from inside of the Macrium Pro (paid) version software? I bet I can! I recall seeing such a feature advertised in their website...if so, this might be the easiest thing to do, assuming I used Macrium Free for the backup. On the second option, to answer tumppiw, I guess I would need to connect the old mechanical HD to my system using a SATA cable, and power supply cable, then boot up with this HDD connected to the PC, but obviously in a secondary SATA slot not as the primary HDD (the "C:"), and what would happen? Even if it's got an OS in the boot sector, obviously as as secondary HDD it should show up renumbered as say the "D:" drive, right? Then, I go to the D: /Photos /Movies folders of this old mechanical HDD, copy what I want, power down, take the mechanical HD out of the PC, and done, right? Oh, that sounds so easy too! Much appreciated if you can confirm the above two options, as they are a lot faster and easier than what I was planning to do. RL |
#6
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Can I virtually restore a PC?
RayLopez99 wrote:
On Tuesday, April 16, 2019 at 5:16:55 AM UTC-4, tumppiw wrote: Paul kirjoitti 16.4.2019 klo 8.59: Paul wrote: RayLopez99 wrote: Here's my dilemma: I want to recover some photos on my girl's now dead laptop (she spilled coffee in it, typical girl hehe). I have a backup. The laptop was a x63 Windows 10 system with an AMD chip that was 'soldered on', the modern trend where nothing is fixable, and the PC repair guy said it's not worth repairing (he actually got it to work before it completely died, but it had problems ever since the coffee spill that never went away, like some sort of residue was literally gumming up the mobo, possibly spraying some solvent on it would have helped, but I digress). I got a system with lots of RAM, also x64 Win 10, and I run Oracle VirtualBox. So is it possible to somehow virtually restore this dead laptop on VirtualBox? I could of course do a physical restore on my new laptop, get the photos, then restore back to my image file. Just wondering if there's another way. I hate restoring hard drives from image files since I always fear something bad will happen, thou gh so far in the half dozen times I've done it nothing has. RL What did you use for your backup ? Chances are, you don't need to restore anything, and the image file just needs to be mounted. There are 20+ commercial backup tools, each different... Paul You mention a modern trend. Would this machine, perhaps, not have any backups at all ? And you're asking how to get files off an eMMC flash soldered to the motherboard ? You see, the CPU soldered to the motherboard, I think you're dropping a hint that this unit is "thin and light", and has thus many compromises in terms of access. When you know a new computer sucks with regard to this sort of thing, backups are much more important. Paul What is the make/model of her laptop? If it has a "normal" HDD, why not only take that of of it and connect to your machine? If it's a soldered eMMC, that might make it more problematical -- ----------------------------------------------------- Thomas Wendell Helsinki, Finland Translation to/from FI/SWE not always accurate ----------------------------------------------------- I see. Interesting. Well I'm not an expert with modern PC laptops but back in the day I've built towers and even soldered together ribbon cables, lol, but I think I can do what you ask, if I understood correctly. I will write what I understood below. From the two answers by Paul and tumppiw, I think there are two options on how to proceed. On the first option, the backup program (to answer Paul) was Macrium Reflect Free (I think, from memory, unless I used that cheap Chinese software backup forget the name now starts with an A). So regarding Paul's option, I wonder, if I pay for the Macrium Reflect Pro (paid version) that perhaps I can 'mount' the Image file from inside of the Macrium Pro (paid) version software? I bet I can! I recall seeing such a feature advertised in their website...if so, this might be the easiest thing to do, assuming I used Macrium Free for the backup. On the second option, to answer tumppiw, I guess I would need to connect the old mechanical HD to my system using a SATA cable, and power supply cable, then boot up with this HDD connected to the PC, but obviously in a secondary SATA slot not as the primary HDD (the "C:"), and what would happen? Even if it's got an OS in the boot sector, obviously as as secondary HDD it should show up renumbered as say the "D:" drive, right? Then, I go to the D: /Photos /Movies folders of this old mechanical HDD, copy what I want, power down, take the mechanical HD out of the PC, and done, right? Oh, that sounds so easy too! Much appreciated if you can confirm the above two options, as they are a lot faster and easier than what I was planning to do. RL To "mount" an MRIMG in your possession, you could use: 1) Another Windows PC, install Macrium ReflectFree on it. 2) Connect backup drive with MRIMG on it. 3) Right-click the MRIMG file and examine the options offered. You can change the drive letter it mounts as, then copy the files out of the "virtual drive letter" it creates. ******* The "old" drive from the broken laptop, can be connected to your tower. It doesn't need a special port number or anything. Any enabled SATA port would do (i.e. not turned off in the BIOS for some reason). Master/slave means *nothing* to SATA. It's a sham. One-drive goes with one-cable goes with one-port. It's that simple. When booting the computer, you check the boot order in the BIOS, by opening the BIOS setup screen with the key it tells you to use. The POST screen has a legend at the bottom, which indicates (Asus) Prsss del to enter BIOS Press F8 for popup boot The POST screen is only visible, if you disable the manufacturer Splash Screen in the BIOS. (When the product is new, you consult the user manual with regard to the key press needed to enter the BIOS.) Different products use different keys. The above is an example. You can modify the boot order with the first key, and make sure the "old" drive is not at the top of the list. The F8 key presents a list of drives to boot from, and you select the OS drive the computer normally uses, rather than the "old" drive. The Popup boot key is preferred for control purposes (as you can easily steer the computer on every boot with it if you want). Either method should cause your "regular" OS to boot. Paul |
#7
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Can I virtually restore a PC?
Paul kirjoitti 18.4.2019 klo 5.41:
RayLopez99 wrote: On Tuesday, April 16, 2019 at 5:16:55 AM UTC-4, tumppiw wrote: Paul kirjoitti 16.4.2019 klo 8.59: Paul wrote: RayLopez99 wrote: Here's my dilemma:Â* I want to recover some photos on my girl's now dead laptop (she spilled coffee in it, typical girl hehe).Â* I have a backup.Â* The laptop was a x63 Windows 10 system with an AMD chip that was 'soldered on', the modern trend where nothing is fixable, and the PC repair guy said it's not worth repairing (he actually got it to work before it completely died, but it had problems ever since the coffee spill that never went away, like some sort of residue was literally gumming up the mobo, possibly spraying some solvent on it would have helped, but I digress).Â* I got a system with lots of RAM, also x64 Win 10, and I run Oracle VirtualBox. So is it possible to somehow virtually restore this dead laptop on VirtualBox?Â* I could of course do a physical restore on my new laptop, get the photos, then restore back to my image file.Â* Just wondering if there's another way.Â* I hate restoring hard drives from image files since I always fear something bad will happen, thou gh so far in the half dozen times I've done it nothing has. RL What did you use for your backup ? Chances are, you don't need to restore anything, and the image file just needs to be mounted. There are 20+ commercial backup tools, each different... Â*Â* Paul You mention a modern trend. Would this machine, perhaps, not have any backups at all ? And you're asking how to get files off an eMMC flash soldered to the motherboard ? You see, the CPU soldered to the motherboard, I think you're dropping a hint that this unit is "thin and light", and has thus many compromises in terms of access. When you know a new computer sucks with regard to this sort of thing, backups are much more important. Â*Â*Â* Paul What is the make/model of her laptop? If it has a "normal" HDD, why not only take that of of it and connect to your machine? If it's a soldered eMMC, that might make it more problematical -- ----------------------------------------------------- Thomas Wendell Helsinki, Finland Translation to/from FI/SWE not always accurate ----------------------------------------------------- I see.Â* Interesting.Â* Well I'm not an expert with modern PC laptops but back in the day I've built towers and even soldered together ribbon cables, lol, but I think I can do what you ask, if I understood correctly.Â* I will write what I understood below.Â* From the two answers by Paul and tumppiw, I think there are two options on how to proceed. On the first option, the backup program (to answer Paul) was Macrium Reflect Free (I think, from memory, unless I used that cheap Chinese software backup forget the name now starts with an A).Â* So regarding Paul's option, I wonder, if I pay for the Macrium Reflect Pro (paid version) that perhaps I can 'mount' the Image file from inside of the Macrium Pro (paid) version software?Â* I bet I can!Â* I recall seeing such a feature advertised in their website...if so, this might be the easiest thing to do, assuming I used Macrium Free for the backup. On the second option, to answer tumppiw, I guess I would need to connect the old mechanical HD to my system using a SATA cable, and power supply cable, then boot up with this HDD connected to the PC, but obviously in a secondary SATA slot not as the primary HDD (the "C:"), and what would happen?Â* Even if it's got an OS in the boot sector, obviously as as secondary HDD it should show up renumbered as say the "D:" drive, right?Â* Then, I go to the D: /Photos /Movies folders of this old mechanical HDD, copy what I want, power down, take the mechanical HD out of the PC, and done, right?Â* Oh, that sounds so easy too! Much appreciated if you can confirm the above two options, as they are a lot faster and easier than what I was planning to do. RL To "mount" an MRIMG in your possession, you could use: 1) Another Windows PC, install Macrium ReflectFree on it. 2) Connect backup drive with MRIMG on it. 3) Right-click the MRIMG file and examine the options offered. You can change the drive letter it mounts as, then copy the files out of the "virtual drive letter" it creates. ******* The "old" drive from the broken laptop, can be connected to your tower. It doesn't need a special port number or anything. Any enabled SATA port would do (i.e. not turned off in the BIOS for some reason). Master/slave means *nothing* to SATA. It's a sham. One-drive goes with one-cable goes with one-port. It's that simple. When booting the computer, you check the boot order in the BIOS, by opening the BIOS setup screen with the key it tells you to use. The POST screen has a legend at the bottom, which indicates (Asus) Â*Â* Prsss del to enter BIOS Â*Â* Press F8 for popup boot The POST screen is only visible, if you disable the manufacturer Splash Screen in the BIOS. (When the product is new, you consult the user manual with regard to the key press needed to enter the BIOS.) Different products use different keys. The above is an example. You can modify the boot order with the first key, and make sure the "old" drive is not at the top of the list. The F8 key presents a list of drives to boot from, and you select the OS drive the computer normally uses, rather than the "old" drive. The Popup boot key is preferred for control purposes (as you can easily steer the computer on every boot with it if you want). Either method should cause your "regular" OS to boot. Â*Â* Paul No you don't need the MacriumReflect Pro, the free version can do that.. -- ----------------------------------------------------- Thomas Wendell Helsinki, Finland Translation to/from FI/SWE not always accurate ----------------------------------------------------- |
#8
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Can I virtually restore a PC?
On Mon, 15 Apr 2019 21:41:41 -0700 (PDT), RayLopez99
wrote: I hate restoring hard drives from image files since I always fear something bad will happen, though so farin the half dozen times I've done it nothing has. -- All I do is work with virtual files: binary-image stream restoration, at its basic -- I do not do hibernation files, or various OS stream files for loading up a programming development platform that runs multiple operating systems from its imagery repository. If you've a trashed laptop, that's that. If, and thus, you've a working HD, to consequently salvage by pulling it from the otherwise trashed laptop, that makes that: the trashed computer's HDD just works if you can physically can make the interface. Windows 10 is going to run with NT filesystem. Interface with that HDD's filesystem, say from a USB docking station, with any version of Windows, it will see it well enough to navigate to get what you want from My Pictures. (If you have a rough and ready PC desktop handy, run a SATA interface to the HDD, provided it's within your MB's standards.) An image restoration file is for an active HDD partition and booting purposes. Microsoft has their Level securities, written into the core of the OS, and low-level access is critically denied to some of their files while it's running. That is what causes the purpose of a binary-stream program: to get at those protected files while the Microsoft is -Not- running. It's the only thing that works with Microsoft, outside of Microsoft's own fun and games and schemes. Like everything, you, thus, must put on your FearLess T-Shirt. Except know that it has gotten worse. Commercial, Peter Norton Ghost, which Symantec bought when Peter Norton got out early, to leave it all behind, was shortly after released as Symantec's Ghost ENTERPRISE. It was the only imagery software, I'm aware, that you could go into and physically edit an image. But you're not doing that, booting into another OS platform, fearlessly through a selective partition activation arbitrator, commonly, off a floppy, USB, or optical device (with relative crap imagery software compared to Ghost Enterprise). What you're doing is copying pictures off a HDD. A relatively simple operation, all else that can go wrong and doesn't considered. |
#9
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Can I virtually restore a PC?
tumppiw wrote:
Paul kirjoitti 18.4.2019 klo 5.41: RayLopez99 wrote: On Tuesday, April 16, 2019 at 5:16:55 AM UTC-4, tumppiw wrote: Paul kirjoitti 16.4.2019 klo 8.59: Paul wrote: RayLopez99 wrote: Here's my dilemma: I want to recover some photos on my girl's now dead laptop (she spilled coffee in it, typical girl hehe). I have a backup. The laptop was a x63 Windows 10 system with an AMD chip that was 'soldered on', the modern trend where nothing is fixable, and the PC repair guy said it's not worth repairing (he actually got it to work before it completely died, but it had problems ever since the coffee spill that never went away, like some sort of residue was literally gumming up the mobo, possibly spraying some solvent on it would have helped, but I digress). I got a system with lots of RAM, also x64 Win 10, and I run Oracle VirtualBox. So is it possible to somehow virtually restore this dead laptop on VirtualBox? I could of course do a physical restore on my new laptop, get the photos, then restore back to my image file. Just wondering if there's another way. I hate restoring hard drives from image files since I always fear something bad will happen, thou gh so far in the half dozen times I've done it nothing has. RL What did you use for your backup ? Chances are, you don't need to restore anything, and the image file just needs to be mounted. There are 20+ commercial backup tools, each different... Paul You mention a modern trend. Would this machine, perhaps, not have any backups at all ? And you're asking how to get files off an eMMC flash soldered to the motherboard ? You see, the CPU soldered to the motherboard, I think you're dropping a hint that this unit is "thin and light", and has thus many compromises in terms of access. When you know a new computer sucks with regard to this sort of thing, backups are much more important. Paul What is the make/model of her laptop? If it has a "normal" HDD, why not only take that of of it and connect to your machine? If it's a soldered eMMC, that might make it more problematical -- ----------------------------------------------------- Thomas Wendell Helsinki, Finland Translation to/from FI/SWE not always accurate ----------------------------------------------------- I see. Interesting. Well I'm not an expert with modern PC laptops but back in the day I've built towers and even soldered together ribbon cables, lol, but I think I can do what you ask, if I understood correctly. I will write what I understood below. From the two answers by Paul and tumppiw, I think there are two options on how to proceed. On the first option, the backup program (to answer Paul) was Macrium Reflect Free (I think, from memory, unless I used that cheap Chinese software backup forget the name now starts with an A). So regarding Paul's option, I wonder, if I pay for the Macrium Reflect Pro (paid version) that perhaps I can 'mount' the Image file from inside of the Macrium Pro (paid) version software? I bet I can! I recall seeing such a feature advertised in their website...if so, this might be the easiest thing to do, assuming I used Macrium Free for the backup. On the second option, to answer tumppiw, I guess I would need to connect the old mechanical HD to my system using a SATA cable, and power supply cable, then boot up with this HDD connected to the PC, but obviously in a secondary SATA slot not as the primary HDD (the "C:"), and what would happen? Even if it's got an OS in the boot sector, obviously as as secondary HDD it should show up renumbered as say the "D:" drive, right? Then, I go to the D: /Photos /Movies folders of this old mechanical HDD, copy what I want, power down, take the mechanical HD out of the PC, and done, right? Oh, that sounds so easy too! Much appreciated if you can confirm the above two options, as they are a lot faster and easier than what I was planning to do. RL To "mount" an MRIMG in your possession, you could use: 1) Another Windows PC, install Macrium ReflectFree on it. 2) Connect backup drive with MRIMG on it. 3) Right-click the MRIMG file and examine the options offered. You can change the drive letter it mounts as, then copy the files out of the "virtual drive letter" it creates. ******* The "old" drive from the broken laptop, can be connected to your tower. It doesn't need a special port number or anything. Any enabled SATA port would do (i.e. not turned off in the BIOS for some reason). Master/slave means *nothing* to SATA. It's a sham. One-drive goes with one-cable goes with one-port. It's that simple. When booting the computer, you check the boot order in the BIOS, by opening the BIOS setup screen with the key it tells you to use. The POST screen has a legend at the bottom, which indicates (Asus) Prsss del to enter BIOS Press F8 for popup boot The POST screen is only visible, if you disable the manufacturer Splash Screen in the BIOS. (When the product is new, you consult the user manual with regard to the key press needed to enter the BIOS.) Different products use different keys. The above is an example. You can modify the boot order with the first key, and make sure the "old" drive is not at the top of the list. The F8 key presents a list of drives to boot from, and you select the OS drive the computer normally uses, rather than the "old" drive. The Popup boot key is preferred for control purposes (as you can easily steer the computer on every boot with it if you want). Either method should cause your "regular" OS to boot. Paul No you don't need the MacriumReflect Pro, the free version can do that.. What the paid version gives you is "incremental backups". The free one does "full backups" and "differential backups". And for most people, even an infrequent "full" is better than nothing at all. There's a table with the capabilities. https://www.macrium.com/reflectfree Paul |
#10
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Can I virtually restore a PC?
On Thursday, April 18, 2019 at 4:08:08 AM UTC-4, tumppiw wrote:
No you don't need the MacriumReflect Pro, the free version can do that.. Thank you tumppiw, and to Paul and Flasherly. RL |
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