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#1
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Build advice sought...
I'm planning to assemble a computer to replace my 11-year-old XP
desktop. This will be used for general computing and audio recording and editing. No gaming. I'm planning to run Windows 7 64-bit on it, so I want a CPU that's among the most recent and highest performing ones that will support Win7. I might later feel the need to move to Windows 10, but not anytime soon. From what I've read, it seems that the Intel i5-6500, i5-6600, or i5-6600k could make good candidates. Money is an object of course, but not the primary one. My goal is stability and longevity. So, a request for comments... - Are the Intel CPUs mentioned above good choices? If I understand correctly, there may be some issues installing Win7 from USB devices, but I can work around that. - I still need to find a motherboard. It must have a PCI slot for my old M-Audio AP2496 sound card. Any suggestions? I've had very good luck with ASUS in the past. Any thoughts you might have would be appreciated. I kinda lost track of the state of the technology several years ago and I'm trying to get back up to speed. |
#2
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Build advice sought...
Nil wrote:
I'm planning to assemble a computer to replace my 11-year-old XP desktop. This will be used for general computing and audio recording and editing. No gaming. I'm planning to run Windows 7 64-bit on it, so I want a CPU that's among the most recent and highest performing ones that will support Win7. I might later feel the need to move to Windows 10, but not anytime soon. From what I've read, it seems that the Intel i5-6500, i5-6600, or i5-6600k could make good candidates. Money is an object of course, but not the primary one. My goal is stability and longevity. So, a request for comments... - Are the Intel CPUs mentioned above good choices? If I understand correctly, there may be some issues installing Win7 from USB devices, but I can work around that. - I still need to find a motherboard. It must have a PCI slot for my old M-Audio AP2496 sound card. Any suggestions? I've had very good luck with ASUS in the past. Any thoughts you might have would be appreciated. I kinda lost track of the state of the technology several years ago and I'm trying to get back up to speed. The motherboard/CPU business is a shambles in terms of the "sparse matrix of support", so I doubt anybody really has a superior mental model of what to do. It's just a mess, with a high chance of a buyer getting burned when they "forgot to check something". In any case, I think you've started in just about the perfect place :-) I don't think going much further forward, even if the CPU was 5% faster ounce for ounce, would really be all that much better. Asus has some Win7 tables, but just seems to have lost their enthusiasm for providing quick data for users of the two newer sockets. Year Link 2004 https://www.asus.com/Static_WebPage/...el_Socket_775/ 2009 https://www.asus.com/Static_WebPage/...l_Socket_1156/ 2011 https://www.asus.com/Static_WebPage/...l_Socket_1155/ 2013 1150 Haswell (internal regulator, this generation only) 2015 1151 Skylake,KabyLake? 270, 370 ******* i5-6500 1151 Skylake i5-6600 1151 Skylake i5-6600k 1151 Skylake https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGA_1151 Z170 Skylake, Kaby Lake (BIOS update) Z270 Skylake, Kaby Lake Z370 Coffee Lake https://www.reddit.com/r/intel/comme...t_for_windows/ "Z270 supports Skylake, the last Intel processor to officially support Windows 7" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaby_Lake "Kaby Lake is the first Intel platform to lack official driver support from Microsoft for versions of Windows older than Windows 10, although an enthusiast-created modification was released that disabled the check and allowed Windows 8.1 and earlier to continue to work on the platform." And at some point, the quick power state change feature might not be supported by the older OSes. Which I don't think matters a whole lot. And the small processors don't have internal NUMA or SMP features that would be a particular problem. So we could shoot for a Z270 with one PCI slot. The PCI slot has to come from a PCI bridge chip, since the PCH has been missing that for a couple generations. It's quite common to need a bridge chip. One bridge chip provides an entire PCI bus, with multiple chip selects if needed. The two-slot PCI board only needs one bridge. GIGABYTE GA-Z270-HD3 (rev. 1.0) LGA 1151 Intel Z270 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.1 One PCI slot, M.2 slot near CPU ATX Motherboard $115 https://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...82E16813128974 ASUS PRIME Z270-K LGA 1151 Intel Z270 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.1 USB 3.0 Two PCI slot ATX Motherboards https://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...82E16813132938 For audio support, you want to do a DPC latency check on those. Which means tracking down a forum with the info. There are probably a couple hundred boards to sift through, one way or another. Take your time. You don't absolutely need Z270, so there are other chips I could have sifted for. Paul |
#3
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Build advice sought...
On 27 Nov 2017 05:40:59 GMT, Nil
wrote: I'm planning to assemble a computer to replace my 11-year-old XP desktop. This will be used for general computing and audio recording and editing. No gaming. I'm planning to run Windows 7 64-bit on it, so I want a CPU that's among the most recent and highest performing ones that will support Win7. I might later feel the need to move to Windows 10, but not anytime soon. From what I've read, it seems that the Intel i5-6500, i5-6600, or i5-6600k could make good candidates. Money is an object of course, but not the primary one. My goal is stability and longevity. So, a request for comments... - Are the Intel CPUs mentioned above good choices? If I understand correctly, there may be some issues installing Win7 from USB devices, but I can work around that. - I still need to find a motherboard. It must have a PCI slot for my old M-Audio AP2496 sound card. Any suggestions? I've had very good luck with ASUS in the past. Any thoughts you might have would be appreciated. I kinda lost track of the state of the technology several years ago and I'm trying to get back up to speed. An AMD Ryzen at some advanced point pulls into parity with Intel performance offerings at significantly, maybe half under Intel pricing. AMD as well takes up the slack, having written their own "pseudo-drivers', consequent Microsoft's stated abandonment of the computer hardware industry as it pertains to Windows 7 -- sic, whereas Intel would not -- in a manner tightly in lockstep to a "standard" given exclusion for only Windows10, among Intel flagship processors. I personally went with an octal core Bulldozer, dropped to fire sale status due to the Ryzen, $80 retail, and updated from an older quadcore, to replace the MB, CPU, and memory, all for under $200. I also selected a MB for the option, rather inclusion, among I'd suppose fewer boards that still provide XP drivers. A Ryzen is a whole different animal with a chipset for newer bus architecture applications, which of course Intel also provides. Read an article for Ryzen's specific design specifications, as a good place to start, then balance specifications to your perceived future needs. The AMD cost, again at near performance parity, is near half of the outlay for an Intel build. From a developer's standpoint, i.e. Intel is effectively now a unified version of Windows 10. Of residual drivers, as usual, a determine generically supportive of *NIX platforms, Linux probably is foremost placed from a developmental stage. It's nice when, at the manufacturer's site, drivers are given for future developmental stages. Unless they're not, for such as a PCI board otherwise capable of continued operations well within newer platform compatibility. Rather in a manner of a nice bet, to place, they in fact will still exist to be the business of satisfying customers. |
#4
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Build advice sought...
On Mon, 27 Nov 2017 02:50:19 -0500, Paul wrote:
| There are probably a couple hundred boards to sift through, | one way or another. Take your time. You don't absolutely | need Z270, so there are other chips I could have sifted for. If the OP doesn't intend to overclock anything, H270 could also be a consideration. I opted for an ASRock H270 the last time I bought a motherboard and have been totally happy with it. This ASUS H270 supports 6th (for Win 7) and 7th generation CPUs and has 2 PCI slots. https://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...16813132941&cm I'd skip Win 7 and go ahead with Win 10. Even though MS isn't publicizing it, Win 7 keys are still working to activate Win 10 as long as the Home/Pro level is the same. Larc |
#5
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Build advice sought...
On 27 Nov 2017, Paul wrote in
alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt: i5-6600k 1151 Skylake This is what I decided on. I don't necessarily want or need the ability to overclock, but I might want to play around with it in the future. The difference in cost between the locked and unlocked version is minimal. ASUS PRIME Z270-K LGA 1151 Intel Z270 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.1 USB 3.0 Two PCI slot ATX Motherboards https://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...82E16813132938 I liked the look of this one, so that'w what I'm going for. It has the features I want and gets decent reviews. For audio support, you want to do a DPC latency check on those. Which means tracking down a forum with the info. Not sure what that means. I will only use the built-in audio for system sounds and casual music listening. For my serious-er audio work (I record my own music) I rely on a serious-er 3rd-party audio adapter. I will have to take a chance that my old reliable M-Audio PCI card, but if for some reason it doesn't, I'm prepared to (reluctantly) replace it. Thanks very much for the suggestions. The field is very cluttered and overwhelming. I mainly needed to see some options laid out to help get a handle on the task. This is the third time in the past couple of years that I set out to choose hardware - the other two time I got bogged down and put it off till later. |
#6
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Build advice sought...
On 27 Nov 2017, Larc wrote in
alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt: If the OP doesn't intend to overclock anything, H270 could also be a consideration. I opted for an ASRock H270 the last time I bought a motherboard and have been totally happy with it. This ASUS H270 supports 6th (for Win 7) and 7th generation CPUs and has 2 PCI slots. I'd like the otion to overclock. I like to tinker. I'd skip Win 7 and go ahead with Win 10. Even though MS isn't publicizing it, Win 7 keys are still working to activate Win 10 as long as the Home/Pro level is the same. I'm determined to stick with Windows 7 for now. I have an unused license I've saving for this project. If I feel forced into Win10 later, this machine will certainly run that well. |
#7
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Build advice sought...
On 27 Nov 2017, Flasherly wrote in
alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt: An AMD Ryzen at some advanced point pulls into parity with Intel performance offerings at significantly, maybe half under Intel pricing. I looked into Ryzen CPUs, and it seems their support for Windows 7 is poor or nonexistant. Their higher-end chips are not that much less expensive than the Core i5 chips I'm looking at. If I was building a more budget-minded computer, they would probably be under serious consideration. |
#8
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Build advice sought...
On Tue, 28 Nov 2017 22:02:54 -0500, Nil
wrote: I looked into Ryzen CPUs, and it seems their support for Windows 7 is poor or nonexistant. Their higher-end chips are not that much less expensive than the Core i5 chips I'm looking at. If I was building a more budget-minded computer, they would probably be under serious consideration. AMD's thumbing off MSFT: AMD's Windows 7 drivers are widely employed across the whole of the Pacific Rim brand manufacturing of motherboards. I can't offhand say where a sexi or octal core, say, is to Ryzen interlap across the I5 series: 1) for processor performance, 2) a further advanced architectural bus provision given AMD's Window 7 support, over some 3) cost consideration, if at all, potentially to surpass Intel. I might, though, personally be interested in provision no.2 -- given I could significantly realize cost advantages for no.1, to account and derive a Ryzen chipset edge possibly over older Intel limitations -- both being, of course, on a Windows 7 platform. AMD Windows 7 support obviously can't be tangibly reported back by the industry in terms of MSFT licensing, now denying all but Windows 10 support for "newer hardware". Which is how I was impressed when reading hardware industry Ryzen release publications. They cannot legally commit to what MSFT has denied AMD. Budgetary constraints and a matter of temperance, I suppose, is what is left to commit to flagellation exercises, in the Machiavellian dens of hardware site forums, for direct Ryzen end user driver experiences and a Windows 7 relevancy. Were I not already budgeted nice and plenteously by a $80 octal core Bulldozer build, from a couple months ago;- still, I'd need the time on a Ryzen to try and form an objective opinion of Ryzen's Windows 7 drivers, though. |
#9
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Build advice sought...
Flasherly wrote:
AMD Windows 7 support obviously can't be tangibly reported back by the industry in terms of MSFT licensing, now denying all but Windows 10 support for "newer hardware". Which is how I was impressed when reading hardware industry Ryzen release publications. They cannot legally commit to what MSFT has denied AMD. Interesting point (if I understand it). Someone (who?) said newer processors won't be supporting older version of windows--but it wasn't AMD. |
#10
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Build advice sought...
On Wed, 29 Nov 2017 10:00:03 -0500, Bill
wrote: Interesting point (if I understand it). Someone (who?) said newer processors won't be supporting older version of windows--but it wasn't AMD. Both AMD and MSFT. AMD in a limited sense that they can ensure support for instances of Ryzen drivers operating within Windows 7 compatibility. Which leaves MSFT, which outright denies a Ryzen platform, unless the Ryzen of course is sanctioned within its present licensing terms, for "newer hardware", fully supported by Windows 10. That is a stated premise for any press representative upon taking possession of a Ryzen, and a supportive motherboard, the latter which will include Windows 7 chipset support drivers. That representative may not directly call AMD to account over issues and limitations with the drivers, which in some sense do not perform identically to a Windows 10 environment -- as the AMD drivers provided are classified for developmental reasons, faux and of 3rd-party origins, not written by Microsoft, nor to be assumed within an associative provision by MSFT. It falls upon the purchaser to arrange and provide for any liability incurred, upon being disappointed with AMD Ryzen Window 7 chipset support drivers, within such purveyance of a private agreement from terms provided by a seller-buyer contract. Not so different, AMD Ryzen chipset support, than were you to buy any ol' PCI stick-in gizmo. In this case, whether ASUS, GIGABYTE, or a BIOSTAR implementation of Ryzen Windows7 chipset provided with a MB. You assume degrees of risk, both from a varied source of manufacturer accountability and a return policy, if any from a distribution centre. AMD, ipso facto, is out of the circuit. - Keep your enemies closer than your friends. -Niccolò di Bernardo dei Machiavelli |
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