Building your own computer

On 15/10/2011 2:37 AM, whitneyl wrote:
On Oct 14, 4:03 am, Man-wai wrote:
On 14/10/11 1:00 PM, whitneyl wrote:

How hard (or easy) is it to build your own super fast state of the art
computer? Is it something a person that's never tried it could do on
his own in a reasonable amount of time? Would I be able to get some
good help from the group? Is it worth it?

Do you have a friend to guide you?

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I don't, but I kind of thought I could get help from this forum and
maybe users like you. I think I'm going to take another users advice
and buy an "upgradable" system, then modify as needed.

Thanks for your response.
Regards,
Larry

Building your own system is a very satisfying thing to do but you won't
save much money by doing it. Unless you have a lot of experience
selecting components for their value to "you", you will end up with a
horribly mismatched system.

People tend to pass on their old computers to me and I have gained a lot
of experience with computers that way. Recently a friend gave me his old
P4 system after an upgrade and I set about checking it out The CPU was
an LGA775 socket processor with hyperthreading (supposedly) running at
3.4 GHz. After I did a reinstall of Windows XP, I noticed that it didn't
have the zip that I would have expected of a CPU of this speed. In fact,
it was decidedly lethargic. On inspecting the BIOS settings, I noticed
the CPU Host Frequency was set at 100MHz. This is the default setting.
Having previously spent time reading through the motherboard manual, I
recalled reading the following section;

CPU Host Frequency (Mhz)
This item will be available when "CPU Host Clock Control" is set to
Enabled. 100MHz ~ 355MHz Set CPU Host Clock from 100MHz to 355MHz.
If you use FSB800 Pentium 4 processor, please set "CPU Host Frequency "
to 200MHz. Incorrect using it may cause your system broken. For power
End-User use only !

The fractured English is theirs, not mine! ;-)

Now the CPU in the machine did indeed have an FSB800 processor so it
should have been set to 200MHz but was only running at 100MHz. I
adjusted the setting and suddenly I had a P4 that ran like it should.

Two things I find strange about this;

Firstly, the owner of the computer should have noticed the speed being
woefully inadequate. Admittedly, The BIOS, on startup, gives no CPU
speed indication and if his previous computer was back in P3 territory,
he would have seen a performance increase though only half what it
should have been.

Secondly, the system was built by a local shopfront PC builder. I would
have thought that he would have noticed the lack of performance. It was
painfully obvious to me and I'm only a tinkerer, not a system builder.
Well, he's bought his new computer from the same person so I hope that's
running to spec!

--

Krypsis

On 15/10/2011 3:41 AM, Nil wrote:
On 14 Oct 2011, wrote in
alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt:

How hard (or easy) is it to build your own super fast state of the
art computer? Is it something a person that's never tried it
could do on his own in a reasonable amount of time? Would I be
able to get some good help from the group? Is it worth it?

The most difficult part is deciding on the components. Once you have
them all on hand, assembly isn't difficult, especially with the wealth
of on-line information.

It's worth it to me. My total cost is usually about the same or just a
little more than a similarly-spec'd store-bought computer. The
difference is that I've hand-picked the components so my $s have gone
to those that are most important to me. I consider the total cost to be
a good and fair value, though maybe not a bargain. And it's fun.

However, you have to be prepared to troubleshoot and fix the machine
when the inevitable happens. You can't call up Tech Support in a panic,
'cause you're it.

I'd recommend that most average, non-technical users buy their computer
from Dell or some company that offers support. I've always avoided
building computers for friends and family because I don't want them
calling me up every time their system hiccups.

Some of the larger computer supply establishments here will quote on and
build a computer to your own specifications. You do the research and
work out what components are the best for your. Any pricing
differential, + or -, is offset by the fact that the entire unit is
warranted by the builder. It can be a hassle haggling over warrantable
items if you build up the computer yourself.

The only computer I built from scratch was a Q6600 Quadcore machine a
few years back, early 2008 if I recall correctly. The only component
that has died has been the NVidia GS8500 video card and it was well out
of warranty. I recently upgraded the RAM to 8 Gig and added a new Video
card. I might add, I have only just begun using the machine seriously as
it was way overkill for my needs. Now that I'm tinkering with virtual
machines, it's getting a bit of use but it still isn't my primary
computer. The trap therefore is that you can end up with a computer that
suits your desires but not your needs. You see, "state of the art" and
"superfast" are way overkill for the needs of nearly all save extreme
gamers. Since I'm not a gamer of note, a dual core Pentium and a 6 year
old G5 PowerMac Dual Processor serve 99% of my needs. The Dual Core
Pentium is capable of running virtual machines but the Quad does it so
much better! ;-)

--

Krypsis

whitneyl wrote:

How hard (or easy) is it to build your own super fast state of the art
computer?

It's a heck of a lot easier than it used to be. You can't beat the price
on a low-end purchased system, but that's not what you want.
Depending upon how you define "high-end" and "state-of-the-art,"
and your specific needs, it could be as simple as screwing a few things
into a case and connecting a few wires. Windows 7 practically installs
itself. You can pick a case that *you* like.

Is it something a person that's never tried it could do on his own in
a reasonable amount of time? Would I be able to get some good
help from the group? Is it worth it?

You seem reasonably intelligent. You don't write incredibly long,
often nonsensical non-sentences like Flasherly. The fact that you
are even considering it is a virtual guarantee of success! There are
lots of knowledgeable people here who would be happy to help with
parts selection and warn of possible pitfalls.

So... gaming? Video encoding? Overclocking? AMD or Intel? Budget?

On Oct 15, 9:51 am, "Fishface" wrote:

You seem reasonably intelligent. You don't write incredibly long,
often nonsensical non-sentences like Flasherly. The fact that you
are even considering it is a virtual guarantee of success!

Warning of possible pitfalls, you say. I just finished bending a
couple rows of pins on a socket AMD2 CPU, halfway down and through,
starting at the keyed corner. Some old Arctic Silver had mated
exceptionally tight between the CPU and fan heatsink, perhaps having
turned to a thickened compound because of the age of the tube. I
needed, besides to reassemble the computer from scratch, to exchange
out the stock AMD heatsink for a better heatwick setup. After
releasing and freeing the stock cooler clamps, the motherboard's
retaining lever securing the CPU was engaged as I began twisting the
stock heatsink on its horizontal axis from the viscosity of the
compound. The CPU, however, popped out early. Being it was supposed
to be secured, either the lever faulted or a torsion strength I'd been
applying had exceeded the MB retention lever's capacities. The CPU
pins were bent, numbering, starting from the keyed corner,
approximately eight units over two rows adjacent the edge.

On the bases of an assessment your providing as a virtual guarantee of
success, in tangible words you somehow think I'm incapable, consider
now how explain to Whitneyl why that particular computer, on a card
table behind me, is a finished assembly and properly working. How,
specifically, I managed successfully to straighten delicately
miniscule pins without ruining the CPU? If it's good enough,
Fishface, I'd be right behind also to virtually assure submitting such
a post at Tom's Hardware become a standard for those in need of your
references.

I'm sorry, Flasherly but I stopped trying to read your posts
a while ago. Google's translation services don't yet offer a
Flasherly unobfuscator. Too much effort is required. I have
trouble with outsourced tech support, also.

Paul nospam needed.com wrote:

As an example, let's pretend to buy a Dell computer, then put a
better processor in it. Does Dell have a web page telling you
what processors fit ?

Last time I checked, they have a good website full of information
about each of the computers they sell, including significant
technical information. More than what you get from a component
manufacturer or retailer.

Dell might use a BTX design, with a single combo fan/cooler,

I'm sure he could tell.

The custom design, can function as a "lock-in" of the customer.

Lots of people will have modified their Dells, but it's a lot
harder depending on the situation. Can you upgrade a Dell
motherboard BIOS ? Does it have settings to adjust the memory
timing parameters of that new memory you bought. The memory that
needs 2.1V to meet timing ?

So yes, on the face of it, pre-built systems have the ability to
be upgraded, but the devil is in the details.

They have a variety of types, probably some more easy to upgrade
than others.

If you want the absolute best, you can buy an Alienware, with
the hottest hardware available for purchase in it. But you'll
also be handing them $1000 profit right off the top, for the
privilege. (Price versus material cost.)

Right, if he has the money. Apparently Dell sells them.

http://www.dell.com/us/p/desktops.as...n&s=dhs&~ck=mn

There's no getting around it - like a lot of things in life, it
has a certain "market efficiency". There's no "something for
nothing". It's a matter of how important this is to you, as to
what approach you use.

I like a prebuilt system, because I can buy an operating system
package with the right attributes. If the OS is nice enough,
that it might be worth reinstalling, I can buy a "retail"
version. If the OS isn't that wonderful,

I'm pretty sure that everybody knows what to expect after a
Windows OS has been out for a while. Microsoft has a big
following, whether their followers like it or not.

I can buy an "OEM" version, which can't be transfered from
machine to machine. But that's better than the "Dell approach",
where the OS is a dead loss as soon as you get it.

A dead loss?

I would remove all of the garbage software that they junk into it.
I would find out in a big hurry how workable their included
version of Windows is. From what I can see, if they include a
restore CD, that has Windows without the bloatware. I have been
able to work my neighbors Dell computer easily enough. I'm sure
some models are more upgradable than others.

At some time in the past, Dell sold Linux desktop PCs.

As for calling Dell... If the original poster doesn't know enough
to be able to use a prebuilt system, he definitely shouldn't be
planning to build his own.

Besides upgradability, most critical to me would be the ability to
backup the system using Macrium Reflect. Now that I have a cheap
750 GB secondary hard drive, making copies of the 32 GB Windows
partition/drive is pretty much limitless.
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Paul

whitneyl whitneyl123 verizon.net wrote:

Do you have any comment on Manufacturers?

If I considered Dell, I would look at their small-business computers.
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Thanks Again.
Larry

If you want the absolute best, you can buy an Alienware

* Internal "theater" Lighting
* Over 25 billion possible system lighting combinations with AlienFX

For the man with everything...

John Doe wrote:
If you want the absolute best, you can buy an Alienware

* Internal "theater" Lighting
* Over 25 billion possible system lighting combinations with AlienFX

For the man with everything...

When you're high as a kite, why wouldn't you want one of those
to stare at :-)

For the rest of us, we'll just have to stick with the good
ole reliable "USB Disco Ball".

http://img.alibaba.com/wsphoto/v0/40...-led-light.jpg

Paul

On Oct 15, 4:35 pm, "Fishface" wrote:
I'm sorry, Flasherly but I stopped trying to read your posts
a while ago. Google's translation services don't yet offer a
Flasherly unobfuscator. Too much effort is required. I have
trouble with outsourced tech support, also.

Can't say the same, but perhaps that wouldn't be so strange a
provision were I first to admit the notion of cloning aliases lacks a
certain appeal to causality.