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#1
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What if there are thousands of buffer underrun?
If a burner has buffer underrun (BU) protection (Justlink, etc), does
it mean I don't have to worry about BU at all under ALL circumstances? I have a DVD burner connected to a slow PC (P3-800MHz). I need to backup more than 35,000 files totalling about 1.7GB to a 2.4X DVD+RW. The source files are located on an old 8GB 5400rpm HD (everything about this PC is old apart from the DVD burner). I can foresee that the PC will have hard time keeping up with the burner (Nero doesn't allow me to select any speed other than 2.4X). Question : is there any harm if the BU kicks in many many times? Theoretically it should work, but does BU cause any reliability issue? |
#2
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Why not try it and see if it works.
You can always reuse the DVD+RW is it fails. You may have to write three blank CD disks which may write at the slow speed. Regards Brian (Chan WK) wrote: If a burner has buffer underrun (BU) protection (Justlink, etc), does it mean I don't have to worry about BU at all under ALL circumstances? I have a DVD burner connected to a slow PC (P3-800MHz). I need to backup more than 35,000 files totalling about 1.7GB to a 2.4X DVD+RW. The source files are located on an old 8GB 5400rpm HD (everything about this PC is old apart from the DVD burner). I can foresee that the PC will have hard time keeping up with the burner (Nero doesn't allow me to select any speed other than 2.4X). Question : is there any harm if the BU kicks in many many times? Theoretically it should work, but does BU cause any reliability issue? |
#3
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If DMA is set for the drives, I doubt the buffer protection will activate. A
hard drive - even an old one - should be able to keep up with a writer. -- Graham Mayor Chan WK wrote: If a burner has buffer underrun (BU) protection (Justlink, etc), does it mean I don't have to worry about BU at all under ALL circumstances? I have a DVD burner connected to a slow PC (P3-800MHz). I need to backup more than 35,000 files totalling about 1.7GB to a 2.4X DVD+RW. The source files are located on an old 8GB 5400rpm HD (everything about this PC is old apart from the DVD burner). I can foresee that the PC will have hard time keeping up with the burner (Nero doesn't allow me to select any speed other than 2.4X). Question : is there any harm if the BU kicks in many many times? Theoretically it should work, but does BU cause any reliability issue? |
#4
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I believe, but stand ready to be corrected, that if buffer underrun
protection does kick in, it will slow down the process. I think all that happens is burning stops before buffer is empty, then resumes, hence the slowdown, but resumption may be delayed until the cd spins to the right spot under the laser. Dave Cohen "Graham Mayor" wrote in message ... If DMA is set for the drives, I doubt the buffer protection will activate. A hard drive - even an old one - should be able to keep up with a writer. -- Graham Mayor Chan WK wrote: If a burner has buffer underrun (BU) protection (Justlink, etc), does it mean I don't have to worry about BU at all under ALL circumstances? I have a DVD burner connected to a slow PC (P3-800MHz). I need to backup more than 35,000 files totalling about 1.7GB to a 2.4X DVD+RW. The source files are located on an old 8GB 5400rpm HD (everything about this PC is old apart from the DVD burner). I can foresee that the PC will have hard time keeping up with the burner (Nero doesn't allow me to select any speed other than 2.4X). Question : is there any harm if the BU kicks in many many times? Theoretically it should work, but does BU cause any reliability issue? |
#5
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Dave Cohen wrote:
I believe, but stand ready to be corrected, that if buffer underrun protection does kick in, it will slow down the process. I think all that happens is burning stops before buffer is empty, then resumes, hence the slowdown, but resumption may be delayed until the cd spins to the right spot under the laser. Dave Cohen "Graham Mayor" wrote in message ... If DMA is set for the drives, I doubt the buffer protection will activate. A hard drive - even an old one - should be able to keep up with a writer. -- Graham Mayor Chan WK wrote: If a burner has buffer underrun (BU) protection (Justlink, etc), does it mean I don't have to worry about BU at all under ALL circumstances? I have a DVD burner connected to a slow PC (P3-800MHz). I need to backup more than 35,000 files totalling about 1.7GB to a 2.4X DVD+RW. The source files are located on an old 8GB 5400rpm HD (everything about this PC is old apart from the DVD burner). I can foresee that the PC will have hard time keeping up with the burner (Nero doesn't allow me to select any speed other than 2.4X). Question : is there any harm if the BU kicks in many many times? Theoretically it should work, but does BU cause any reliability issue? You are correct - protection entails stopping, seeking and restarting. Once a buffer underrun occurs, it is very likely to recur on each buffer load. The OP is burning a large number of (presumably) small files. Please see the page on Arithmetic 101 in the primer at my WWW site for insight. The critical speed for such a burn is not the transfer rate of the source but its seek time, since most of the time is spent going from file to file. The best bet is to burn from an image (even for HD-to-HD) to eliminate the seeks. Finally, there is no significant penalty other than burn speed and wear on the drives for multiple invocations of buffer underrun protection. Mike -- http://www.mrichter.com/ |
#6
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.. --------------------------------------
Mike Richter, were you born with "Scam Artist" emblazoned on your face? -------------------------------------- (Mike Richter, any Material Connection w/ Roxio?) http://groups.google.com/groups?selm...mindspring.com (Messages 10, 12 -- 34, 54 -- 69) ( No pipsqueaks have been able to prove ANY of the above is a libel ) ( -- despite Mikey's supposed to have proof of misquotes! ) Mike Richter (Friggin' Scum) wrote: The OP is burning a large number of (presumably) small files. ...The critical speed for such a burn is not the transfer rate of the source but its seek time, since most of the time is spent going from file to file. The best bet is to burn from an image (even for HD-to-HD) to eliminate the seeks. No friggin' ****, Mikey! Have you heard of caching by burn software, Mikey? |
#7
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.. --------------------------------------
Mike Richter, were you born with "Scam Artist" emblazoned on your face? -------------------------------------- (Mike Richter, any Material Connection w/ Roxio?) http://groups.google.com/groups?selm...mindspring.com (Messages 10, 12 -- 34, 54 -- 69) Mike Richter (Friggin' Scum) wrote: The OP is burning a large number of (presumably) small files. ...The critical speed for such a burn is not the transfer rate of the source but its seek time, since most of the time is spent going from file to file. The best bet is to burn from an image (even for HD-to-HD) to eliminate the seeks. No friggin' ****, Mikey! Have you heard of "idiotic" caching/buffering of Easy Coaster Creator, Mikey? --------------------------------------------- FAQs, Fixes, and Known Issues in Version 4.01 Unnecessary caching at 6x or faster write speeds: No matter what the system tests show for your system's abilities to keep up with these write speeds, if you attempt to record at 6x or higher speed, Easy CD Creator will first create an image on hard disk of the entire CD layout, then will record from that image to CD - which makes the recording process twice as long. This will be fixed in a future version. --------------------------------------------- ====================== From: Mike Richter (Friggin' Scum) Subject: "Burn Proof" - good or bad? Date: 3/13/01 I just installed a new Plextor 12/10/32 "burn-proof" CDR with EZCD 5. I see that the "burn-proof" feature is now an option in EZCD 5 - you can enable or disable it. The only other advantage of burn-proof is that selecting the option .... means that ECDC 5's idiotic buffering is defeated. ====================== From: Mike Richter (Friggin' ****) Subject: What is EZCD5 doing? It wants 700 meg of temp space! Date: 3/16/01 I've just gotten ezcd5, and recording is a pain. It's literally copying all the files to the temp directory before burning! Join the crowd - the beta testers had months of screaming before it got to the real world and that didn't help either. There's a page on ECDC 5 buffering and a file that may help at my WWW site. Sorry, that's the best I can offer until Roxio fixes the bug. ====================== ------------------------------- Mikey, you are a Friggin' Scum! ------------------------------- |
#8
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With Nero 5.5, what exactly does caching do? Does it merely copy the
source file to the caching drive or does it create an image of the final burn? What happen if one is continuing a multi-session disc? In my case, burning to an image first is not an option since I will be doing incremental update of the files using multi-session. I may finalize the disc at the end of each month and then archive it to DVDR. I tried it last night and the burn/verification was successful. I suspect the underrun protection was activated many times because Nero's "buffer level" indicator went from xx% to 0%, then up again, then down to 0% again. The LED on the burner also went from ON to OFF to ON to OFF to ON.... |
#9
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Chan WK wrote:
With Nero 5.5, what exactly does caching do? Does it merely copy the source file to the caching drive or does it create an image of the final burn? What happen if one is continuing a multi-session disc? In my case, burning to an image first is not an option since I will be doing incremental update of the files using multi-session. I may finalize the disc at the end of each month and then archive it to DVDR. I tried it last night and the burn/verification was successful. I suspect the underrun protection was activated many times because Nero's "buffer level" indicator went from xx% to 0%, then up again, then down to 0% again. The LED on the burner also went from ON to OFF to ON to OFF to ON.... Cache buffer is used to reduce the time to open/read/close many small files, not to create an image. Check the drive's DMA setting, clean up \windows\temp folder, and defrag the hard disk. To allay your fears about underrun protection kicking in and reliability, see this thread: ram.net |
#10
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"Chan WK" wrote in message
... If a burner has buffer underrun (BU) protection (Justlink, etc), does it mean I don't have to worry about BU at all under ALL circumstances? I have a DVD burner connected to a slow PC (P3-800MHz). I need to backup more than 35,000 files totalling about 1.7GB to a 2.4X DVD+RW. The source files are located on an old 8GB 5400rpm HD (everything about this PC is old apart from the DVD burner). I can foresee that the PC will have hard time keeping up with the burner (Nero doesn't allow me to select any speed other than 2.4X). Question : is there any harm if the BU kicks in many many times? Theoretically it should work, but does BU cause any reliability issue? DVD+RW is only 2.4x. Some newer ones allow 4x, but nothing slower. 2.4x is like 3240KB/s. Thats about 3 megabytes/sec. A modern ATA/100 (well, thats not really all that new....but common) will allow 40MB/sec to be read easily. That 2.4x DVD speed is equal to 9x that in CD speed, so thats 22x CD-R. If you can burn at 24x CD-RW or higher, then you shouldn't have any problems doing that 1.7GB burn @ 2.4x. But, yes, the buffer underrun is designed so that the disc stops writing and can resume writing once it gets the next bit of data, even if it is isnt coming in at 2.4x, it will wait for the buffer to fill up. Ive had this happen when I burn some 52x CDs when doing some intensive other stuff. The Nero buffer is 80MB, so it burns 80MB at a time, so I end up with 4 or 5 buffer underrun saves [usually doesnt happen until 300-400MB into the disc]. Once you burn, use a program like DVDInfoPro to run a read error check on the disc. If the drive can read back all the sectors then the disc is 100% okay. |
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