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#251
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On Wed, 25 May 2005 02:38:31 GMT, Leythos
wrote: In article , says... You are NEVER gonna convince Lameboy that the EULA is anything but God's Laws. A burning bush gave the EULA to Billses on stone tablets. I was not addressing it's validity, and my reply had nothing to do with it. He said people could not read the EULA before purchasing the product or opening the box, which is not true - it's on-line and you can request a copy if you call MS. .... and you don't see a problem with that. There is a problem with that, but you ignore it. The online EULA is fine if it's required prior to online purchase, but is no substitute for a EULA at the time and place of purchase since what is actually being purchased is only a license. There is a difference between being in INFORMED customer and an Ignorant one, the choice is up to the customer as the information IS available without purchase. Yes, an informed customer is one who is able to read the terms attached to the specific product, not going elsewhere to guess if they apply to a specific product. |
#252
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On Wed, 25 May 2005 10:55:18 GMT, Leythos
wrote: In article , "David Candy" . says... Why would one go to a company that one has no relationship with. The OEM issues the license not Microsoft. The EULA is between the user and the OEM (not so on retail and upgrade - it's MS on those versions, but they a minute portion of MS sales). Also the sale takes place before the EULA screen shows. The licensing of the software, the requirement for it, is, when a packaged machine is purchased from a place like CompUSA, Gateway, etc... included in the manual that ships with the boxes. There is also wording on the CD in many cases. Again, you/they can choose to be ignorant or not. You are choosing to be ignorant and it's a bit ridiculous that you keep trying to imply the customer is. On the contrary, they choose to KNOW what the license is for that specific product- not some license that has no guarantee of applying to a product found elsewhere. Your oversimplified concept of "ignorance" can't be applied to actual purchase scenarios, but would have to apply to ALL of them to be a workable solution. There can be no "grey areas" in whether one knows the terms of a the specific product but there are. |
#253
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On Wed, 25 May 2005 02:19:11 GMT, Leythos
wrote: In article , says... You still don't get it. The buyer is only ignorant because of MS' neglecting to disclose terms. MS has hidden the terms and should be forthcoming. You try to shift blame when I already stated an obvious solution- a packaging that discloses the terms. MS Didn't hide anything, you can get all the information even before you purchase the OS/System. -- No, you can't. Be specific, show us this information that is _GUARANTEED_ in writing sufficient to hold up in court, that it applies to some randomly-selected (as would occur when one comes across a product) WIndows. The terms are not consistent across all distributions of WIndows and therefore can not be "gotten" and assumed to apply to a product which can't be verified before purchase to have same (terms). |
#254
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On Wed, 25 May 2005 16:53:32 GMT, Leythos
wrote: No, you can't. Be specific, show us this information that is _GUARANTEED_ in writing sufficient to hold up in court, that it applies to some randomly-selected (as would occur when one comes across a product) WIndows. The terms are not consistent across all distributions of WIndows and therefore can not be "gotten" and assumed to apply to a product which can't be verified before purchase to have same (terms). When did I mention anything about court If it doesn't hold up on court then your idea about EULA or terms is pretty irrelevant, isn't it? What ARE customers agreeing to then? NOTHING if it doesn't stand up to legal definitions. - your statement was that people purchased a computer/system with Windows without any means to read the EULA before the purchase and that it made the return of Windows impossible or highly unlikely for those that do not agree to the EULA. Not impossible, BUT any additional effort or expense is not same thing as being able to reject it without any additional burden, as is the case with any other agreement where terms are disclosed at THAT time, not elsewhere, "maybe". Your statement is 100% false, the information IS available to those that don't want to purchase blindly. Oh? Show me. Show us all where we can be GUARANTEED we'd reading something that applies to any SPECIFIC possible-to-purchase product. I don't give a sh!t about legal or not, only that your inflammatory statement was false - the EULA is available BEFORE purchase to any customer that chooses to be informed. No, it's not always and often not available. Even if you can read "something" you are not guaranteed what you read applies. When you purchase a license there must be some fixation of terms at the time and point of entering into that agreement, not beforehand via a 3rd party nor after the sale. |
#256
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Leythos wrote:
In article , says... No, it's not always and often not available. Even if you can read "something" you are not guaranteed what you read applies. You're hopeless. Said the Queen of the delusional! -- Peace! Kurt Self-anointed Moderator microscum.pubic.windowsexp.gonorrhea http://microscum.com/mscommunity "Trustworthy Computing" is only another example of an Oxymoron! "Produkt-Aktivierung macht frei" |
#257
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On Wed, 25 May 2005 18:35:27 GMT, Leythos
wrote: In article , says... No, it's not always and often not available. Even if you can read "something" you are not guaranteed what you read applies. You're hopeless. That's ironic. |
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