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#1
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Could a network connection work like a phone jack
I have a WDTV and a smart TV. I only have one network connection at
the location. I really don't need another one, or the current one for that matter. Both are also wireless. It just made me wonder if the devices could be made with an in/out Cat5 port. I say that because I would only be using one or the other at any time anyway. I do understand that to use both would cut the through put in half, but that would probably still be better than wireless. |
#2
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Could a network connection work like a phone jack
Seymore4Head wrote:
I have a WDTV and a smart TV. I only have one network connection at the location. I really don't need another one, or the current one for that matter. Both are also wireless. It just made me wonder if the devices could be made with an in/out Cat5 port. I say that because I would only be using one or the other at any time anyway. I do understand that to use both would cut the through put in half, but that would probably still be better than wireless. You can make network connections directly between devices. Even Wifi devices support such a configuration (adhoc). When a router assigns IP addresses with DHCP, it does it in such a way that the addresses are unique per device. One device becomes 192.168.0.2, the other 192.168.0.3, which would be two non-routable local addresses. If you operate two peer level devices, ones where neither of them operates a DHCP server, then it is up to the user to statically define an IP address. And select values which don't conflict with other IP address assignments. Ethernet cables with RJ45 connectors on the end, come as "straight thru" or "crossover" cables. For direct computer to computer usage, a crossover cable is used. This connects TX on one device to RX on the other, and vice versa. When Gigabit Ethernet NICs were invented, they were given MDI/MDIX capability, and those can automatically determine who has a TX, who has an RX, and do the right thing on each device. If you have older 10/100BT NICs (the slower ones), those don't have MDI/MDIX and they only use pins 1,2,3,6. Those four wires is enough for two cross-coupled pairs. On the older cables, they might only have a total of four wires, arranged as two twisted pairs. Modern cables have all eight wires, arranged as four pairs. And MDI/MDIX support is a natural part of distinguishing between four wire and eight wire usage scenarios. Without MDI/MDIX capable NICs, a person ends up stocking both straight-thru and crossover type cables, and trying them until one of them works. I have a crossover cable here, which has a blue connector on one end and a red connector on the other end. Which implies crossover. If the connectors are the same color on either end, the cable is more likely to be straight thru. With a multimeter, it is easy to verify the wiring pattern. So, to connect your WDTV to your Smart TV *directly* you'd need: 1) A crossover cable, if they're not MDI/MDIX capable. Either type of cable, if they support MDI/MDIX. 2) An accessible user interface to allow device programming. This is easy on the Smart TV, as it has a nice glass screen to show the current IP address. The WDTV might need some other means of being programmed. 3) Program static IP addresses in each unit. 4) Connect the units together. Windows devices can use APIPA addresses, which attempt to solve the problem without step (2). I don't know the details of APIPA on embedded devices like your WDTV and your Smart TV. Maybe they'll "just work" when connected together. I would test with the crossover cable first, as it's more likely to work in a "direct connect" scenario. But, like when dealing with serial ports, you keep all polarities of cables available, and you can usually cobble something together that works. In some cases, without careful shopping, it can cost as much for cabling, as for electronics. I could buy a four port wired router for $40, and the four cables I needed to go with it, cost $10 each. So the cables cost as much as the (powered by wall adapter) router box. One advantage I suppose, of wireless devices, is no pricey cables are needed. I bought my cables around 9PM at night, from a local retailer, so there was no opportunity to acquire a cheaper cable. At $10 each, it was "take it or leave it" time. At least they weren't Monster branded, or "gold plated". Just ordinary cables. With wireless, there is "adhoc mode", but you also have the daunting task of getting them to work with one another. One benefit of the wired setup, versus the wireless, is the wired setup is more secure to abuse from a neighbor or someone sitting on the street with a Wifi receiver. The physical isolation of wired connections, is one less thing to worry about. ******* I'm sure you'll figure something out. One option is going to require more "manual reading" than the other. And one option is going to cost more than the other, to set up. Paul |
#3
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Could a network connection work like a phone jack
On Mon, 20 Oct 2014 03:36:05 -0400, Paul wrote:
Seymore4Head wrote: I have a WDTV and a smart TV. I only have one network connection at the location. I really don't need another one, or the current one for that matter. Both are also wireless. It just made me wonder if the devices could be made with an in/out Cat5 port. I say that because I would only be using one or the other at any time anyway. I do understand that to use both would cut the through put in half, but that would probably still be better than wireless. You can make network connections directly between devices. Even Wifi devices support such a configuration (adhoc). When a router assigns IP addresses with DHCP, it does it in such a way that the addresses are unique per device. One device becomes 192.168.0.2, the other 192.168.0.3, which would be two non-routable local addresses. If you operate two peer level devices, ones where neither of them operates a DHCP server, then it is up to the user to statically define an IP address. And select values which don't conflict with other IP address assignments. Ethernet cables with RJ45 connectors on the end, come as "straight thru" or "crossover" cables. For direct computer to computer usage, a crossover cable is used. This connects TX on one device to RX on the other, and vice versa. When Gigabit Ethernet NICs were invented, they were given MDI/MDIX capability, and those can automatically determine who has a TX, who has an RX, and do the right thing on each device. If you have older 10/100BT NICs (the slower ones), those don't have MDI/MDIX and they only use pins 1,2,3,6. Those four wires is enough for two cross-coupled pairs. On the older cables, they might only have a total of four wires, arranged as two twisted pairs. Modern cables have all eight wires, arranged as four pairs. And MDI/MDIX support is a natural part of distinguishing between four wire and eight wire usage scenarios. Without MDI/MDIX capable NICs, a person ends up stocking both straight-thru and crossover type cables, and trying them until one of them works. I have a crossover cable here, which has a blue connector on one end and a red connector on the other end. Which implies crossover. If the connectors are the same color on either end, the cable is more likely to be straight thru. With a multimeter, it is easy to verify the wiring pattern. So, to connect your WDTV to your Smart TV *directly* you'd need: 1) A crossover cable, if they're not MDI/MDIX capable. Either type of cable, if they support MDI/MDIX. 2) An accessible user interface to allow device programming. This is easy on the Smart TV, as it has a nice glass screen to show the current IP address. The WDTV might need some other means of being programmed. 3) Program static IP addresses in each unit. 4) Connect the units together. Windows devices can use APIPA addresses, which attempt to solve the problem without step (2). I don't know the details of APIPA on embedded devices like your WDTV and your Smart TV. Maybe they'll "just work" when connected together. I would test with the crossover cable first, as it's more likely to work in a "direct connect" scenario. But, like when dealing with serial ports, you keep all polarities of cables available, and you can usually cobble something together that works. In some cases, without careful shopping, it can cost as much for cabling, as for electronics. I could buy a four port wired router for $40, and the four cables I needed to go with it, cost $10 each. So the cables cost as much as the (powered by wall adapter) router box. One advantage I suppose, of wireless devices, is no pricey cables are needed. I bought my cables around 9PM at night, from a local retailer, so there was no opportunity to acquire a cheaper cable. At $10 each, it was "take it or leave it" time. At least they weren't Monster branded, or "gold plated". Just ordinary cables. With wireless, there is "adhoc mode", but you also have the daunting task of getting them to work with one another. One benefit of the wired setup, versus the wireless, is the wired setup is more secure to abuse from a neighbor or someone sitting on the street with a Wifi receiver. The physical isolation of wired connections, is one less thing to worry about. ******* I'm sure you'll figure something out. One option is going to require more "manual reading" than the other. And one option is going to cost more than the other, to set up. Paul Thanks It was just a general question posted in hopes that someone that actually worked in the field might think it was a good idea. I rarely (never) use the smart TV Internet anyway. If I did I could just switch the cable. Just thinking out loud, it would be nice if electronics came with an in/out port to enable connection sharing. While sharing a connection might not be the most efficient for computers, it may be adequate for TVs and such. (And I would hope it would work without having to use a crossover.) |
#4
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Could a network connection work like a phone jack
On Mon, 20 Oct 2014 15:36:42 -0400, Seymore4Head wrote:
It was just a general question posted in hopes that someone that actually worked in the field might think it was a good idea. I rarely (never) use the smart TV Internet anyway. If I did I could just switch the cable. Just thinking out loud, it would be nice if electronics came with an in/out port to enable connection sharing. While sharing a connection might not be the most efficient for computers, it may be adequate for TVs and such. It sounds as if you need a switch. Something like the below. You plug the modem into one port and your other devices into the others. http://www.cclonline.com/product/990...eries/NET0748/ -- Faster, cheaper, quieter than HS2 and built in 5 years; UKUltraspeed http://www.500kmh.com/ |
#5
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Could a network connection work like a phone jack
On Mon, 20 Oct 2014 21:26:26 +0100 (BST), "Rodney Pont"
wrote: On Mon, 20 Oct 2014 15:36:42 -0400, Seymore4Head wrote: It was just a general question posted in hopes that someone that actually worked in the field might think it was a good idea. I rarely (never) use the smart TV Internet anyway. If I did I could just switch the cable. Just thinking out loud, it would be nice if electronics came with an in/out port to enable connection sharing. While sharing a connection might not be the most efficient for computers, it may be adequate for TVs and such. It sounds as if you need a switch. Something like the below. You plug the modem into one port and your other devices into the others. http://www.cclonline.com/product/990...eries/NET0748/ I actually have a spare one of those. I never use the Internet part of the TV any way. It is just I can see a day where every TV location could use more than one Internet connection. |
#6
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Could a network connection work like a phone jack
On Tue, 21 Oct 2014 23:29:08 -0400, Seymore4Head wrote:
It was just a general question posted in hopes that someone that actually worked in the field might think it was a good idea. I rarely (never) use the smart TV Internet anyway. If I did I could just switch the cable. Just thinking out loud, it would be nice if electronics came with an in/out port to enable connection sharing. While sharing a connection might not be the most efficient for computers, it may be adequate for TVs and such. It sounds as if you need a switch. Something like the below. You plug the modem into one port and your other devices into the others. http://www.cclonline.com/product/990...eries/NET0748/ I actually have a spare one of those. I never use the Internet part of the TV any way. It is just I can see a day where every TV location could use more than one Internet connection. Does that do the sort of thing you are asking about or is it something else you want to know? The gig switches sort out there own in/out settings and do both ways simultaneously (full duplex), providing you have one at each end. -- Faster, cheaper, quieter than HS2 and built in 5 years; UKUltraspeed http://www.500kmh.com/ |
#7
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Could a network connection work like a phone jack
On Wed, 22 Oct 2014 06:08:19 +0100 (BST), Rodney Pont wrote:
On Tue, 21 Oct 2014 23:29:08 -0400, Seymore4Head wrote: It was just a general question posted in hopes that someone that actually worked in the field might think it was a good idea. I rarely (never) use the smart TV Internet anyway. If I did I could just switch the cable. Just thinking out loud, it would be nice if electronics came with an in/out port to enable connection sharing. While sharing a connection might not be the most efficient for computers, it may be adequate for TVs and such. It sounds as if you need a switch. Something like the below. You plug the modem into one port and your other devices into the others. http://www.cclonline.com/product/990...eries/NET0748/ I actually have a spare one of those. I never use the Internet part of the TV any way. It is just I can see a day where every TV location could use more than one Internet connection. Does that do the sort of thing you are asking about or is it something else you want to know? The gig switches sort out there own in/out settings and do both ways simultaneously (full duplex), providing you have one at each end. Should have said I meant a gigabit port at each end, not a gigabit switch at each end. -- Faster, cheaper, quieter than HS2 and built in 5 years; UKUltraspeed http://www.500kmh.com/ |
#8
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Could a network connection work like a phone jack
On Sun, 19 Oct 2014 20:12:52 -0400, Seymore4Head
wrote: I have a WDTV and a smart TV. I only have one network connection at the location. I really don't need another one, or the current one for that matter. Both are also wireless. It just made me wonder if the devices could be made with an in/out Cat5 port. I say that because I would only be using one or the other at any time anyway. I do understand that to use both would cut the through put in half, but that would probably still be better than wireless. Well, if you really want to you can wire something like this. The error rate on the link will be abysmal but I have seen it function. (Some electrician didn't understand how you're supposed to it and simply spliced like you would an electric wire. We thought the errors on the wire were due to interference and it went undetected for years.) |
#9
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Could a network connection work like a phone jack
On Mon, 20 Oct 2014 15:36:42 -0400, Seymore4Head
wrote: It was just a general question posted in hopes that someone that actually worked in the field might think it was a good idea. I rarely (never) use the smart TV Internet anyway. If I did I could just switch the cable. Just thinking out loud, it would be nice if electronics came with an in/out port to enable connection sharing. While sharing a connection might not be the most efficient for computers, it may be adequate for TVs and such. (And I would hope it would work without having to use a crossover.) I couldn't imagine streaming working properly over such a setup. If you want to make a junction like that you get the tool for the job--an ethernet switch. Note that these are powered devices that retransmit the signal, not merely splitters. They act as the traffic cops of the internet ensuring packets go where they are supposed to rather than the collisions that would abound if the wires were simply connected together. Connect the wires together and if two systems try to talk at once both packets are simply lost. Eventually the computers involved realize the packet wasn't delivered but that takes time. |
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