Specing out a new PC

"Phil Weldon" wrote in message
news
'DRS' wrote, in part:
The E6600 will draw less than 6A (75W/12*0.9). That adds up to
approximately 19A in my book when you chuck in a couple of fans.
_____

I agree that many are too quick to blindly follow display adapter
manufacturer recommendations for power supply capacity.
But why (75W/12*0.9) for the display adapter draw from the power
supply 12 volt rail? What is the 0.9? If anything, the demand on
the 12 VDC rail should be closer to ((75W/12V)/ 80% conversion
efficiency) = 7.45 Amperes. That still doesn't change your total
significantly.

I assumed 90% efficiency, as Paul does, although I've seen different people
use different assumptions. I see your point about my maths though. My
bad. Call it 8A and you've still got a system load of roughly 22A, maybe
add 1.5A for the DVD for 23.5A. That's only a tad over half of the NeoHE's
12v capacity (42A).

the Intel 6600 costs $313.00 at NewEgg
the Asus P5N32-E-SLI with the 680i chipset cost $239.00
the Asus P5B-Deluxe cost 179.00.........so for $60.00 more you get a
better/newer chipset with better OC
For that 60.00 buck you get an extra PIC-E slot..thats 3 with 2 of them
supporting x16 mode
you get an FSB capable of 1333..extra USB
ports...Asus Quick connect

With FSB support to 1333 I'd say it would last longer before being out dated
but thats just my opinion
peter


"Phil Weldon" wrote in message
rthlink.net...
'peter' wrote:
| Have you looked at the new Nvidea 680 chipset mobo??
| MSI P6N diamond
| Gigabyte GA-N680SLI-DQ6
| ASUS P5N32-E-SLI
| EVGA nForce 680i SLI
_____

Yeah, as long as money is no object, then go for a motherboard that costs
as
much as the CPU B^)

Phil Weldon

"peter" wrote in message
news:Y_mJh.14230$zU1.4170@pd7urf1no...
| Have you looked at the new Nvidea 680 chipset mobo??
| MSI P6N diamond
| Gigabyte GA-N680SLI-DQ6
| ASUS P5N32-E-SLI
| EVGA nForce 680i SLI
|
| http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=2936
|
|
http://www4.tomshardware.com/2007/02...arison_part_2/
|
| peter
| "Jethro" wrote in message
| ...
| Phil Weldon wrote:
| 'Jethro' wrote, in part:
| | I'm soliciting ideas and comments for my new PC build I'm about to
| start.
| | My old Socket A AMD stuff has fallen behind in everything ...
| _____
|
| Well, you could ask 'Skybuck Flying'; he's always posting system
specs
| here B^)
|
| On the other hand, you might get more apt advice if you post details
of
| what you want the system to do.
|
| It's said that in the next quarter that Intel will make all the E6000
| series with 4 MBytes L2 cache.
|
| But you might consider getting an E4300 1.8 GHz CPU; it uses a lower
FSB
| (800 MHz), so you can overclock it to 3 GHz or more, something that's
| hard to do with a 1066 MHz FSB because DDR2 will not handle the speed
| increase involved in overclocking an E6600 to the same speed.
|
| Phil Weldon
|
| "Jethro" wrote in message
| ...
| | I'm soliciting ideas and comments for my new PC build I'm about to
| start.
| | My old Socket A AMD stuff has fallen behind in everything and work
came
| | through with some cash for me.. AND I have wife permission so it's
all
| | good. :-)
| |
| | Have been an AMD man for years now but seems they dropped the ball.
I
| | know it's a hard time to buy as so much is changing while waiting
for
| | AMD to counter Intel's latest offering.
| |
| | Anyway my initial upgrade specs. (Not ever looking at SLI)
| |
| | Intel E6600 Core2Duo
| | Asus P5B-Deluxe
| | OCZ 2GB PC2-6400 Dual channel
| | BFG 8800GTS 640Mb (looking at the OC version but...) GTX probably
too
| | over the top
| | 2 x WD 320GB SATAII 16MB buffer
| |
| | Existing to carry over Antec SLK1650B case with Antec Neo HE500W
power
| | supply. Worried it might not have the juice to run it.
| |
| | Thoughts/Comments/Suggestions?
| | J
| | --
| | Jethro[AGHL] aka Phat_Pinger
| | Reply Email: jethro86 (at) gmail (dot) com
|
| Thanks Phil
|
| After I posted I just assumed everyone would know that I wanted it for
| gaming. :-) Darn telepathic attachment didn't work.
| Straight up gaming is my focus but I also do video conversion from AVI
to
| DVD-Video when I want to watch something... you know.
|
| I am always interested in OCing but in reality never get the
time\energy
| to do it all properly. With the issues of my current PC I tire of
playing
| with it and want to play ON it.
|
|
| --
| Jethro[AGHL] aka Phat_Pinger
| Reply Email: jethro86 (at) gmail (dot) com
|
|

'peter' wrote, in part:
| the Intel 6600 costs $313.00 at NewEgg
| the Asus P5N32-E-SLI with the 680i chipset cost $239.00
| the Asus P5B-Deluxe cost 179.00.........so for $60.00 more you get a
| better/newer chipset with better OC
..
..
_____

The original poster specs an E6400 that's ~ $179.95 US and the better nVidia
680i chipset motherboards, at $300 US and up are more expensive than an
E6600.

Phil Weldon
"peter" wrote in message
news:xbIJh.17311$zU1.3741@pd7urf1no...
| the Intel 6600 costs $313.00 at NewEgg
| the Asus P5N32-E-SLI with the 680i chipset cost $239.00
| the Asus P5B-Deluxe cost 179.00.........so for $60.00 more you get a
| better/newer chipset with better OC
| For that 60.00 buck you get an extra PIC-E slot..thats 3 with 2 of them
| supporting x16 mode
| you get an FSB capable of 1333..extra USB
| ports...Asus Quick connect
|
| With FSB support to 1333 I'd say it would last longer before being out
dated
| but thats just my opinion
| peter
|

"Jethro" wrote in message
...
Phil Weldon wrote:
'Jethro' wrote, in part:
| I'm soliciting ideas and comments for my new PC build I'm about to
start.
| My old Socket A AMD stuff has fallen behind in everything ...
_____

Well, you could ask 'Skybuck Flying'; he's always posting system
specs here B^)

On the other hand, you might get more apt advice if you post details
of what you want the system to do.

It's said that in the next quarter that Intel will make all the E6000
series with 4 MBytes L2 cache.

But you might consider getting an E4300 1.8 GHz CPU; it uses a lower
FSB (800 MHz), so you can overclock it to 3 GHz or more, something
that's hard to do with a 1066 MHz FSB because DDR2 will not handle
the speed increase involved in overclocking an E6600 to the same
speed.

Phil Weldon

"Jethro" wrote in message
...
| I'm soliciting ideas and comments for my new PC build I'm about to
start.
| My old Socket A AMD stuff has fallen behind in everything and work
came
| through with some cash for me.. AND I have wife permission so it's
all
| good. :-)
|
| Have been an AMD man for years now but seems they dropped the ball.
I
| know it's a hard time to buy as so much is changing while waiting
for
| AMD to counter Intel's latest offering.
|
| Anyway my initial upgrade specs. (Not ever looking at SLI)
|
| Intel E6600 Core2Duo
| Asus P5B-Deluxe
| OCZ 2GB PC2-6400 Dual channel
| BFG 8800GTS 640Mb (looking at the OC version but...) GTX probably
too
| over the top
| 2 x WD 320GB SATAII 16MB buffer
|
| Existing to carry over Antec SLK1650B case with Antec Neo HE500W
power
| supply. Worried it might not have the juice to run it.
|
| Thoughts/Comments/Suggestions?
| J
| --
| Jethro[AGHL] aka Phat_Pinger
| Reply Email: jethro86 (at) gmail (dot) com

Thanks Phil

After I posted I just assumed everyone would know that I wanted it for
gaming. :-) Darn telepathic attachment didn't work.
Straight up gaming is my focus but I also do video conversion from AVI
to DVD-Video when I want to watch something... you know.

I am always interested in OCing but in reality never get the
time\energy to do it all properly. With the issues of my current PC I
tire of playing with it and want to play ON it.


--
Jethro[AGHL] aka Phat_Pinger
Reply Email: jethro86 (at) gmail (dot) com

There he is! Where you been hiding? I'd say you're on the right
track with the Core 2 Duo and DDR2 path. It's not that AMD have
dropped the ball really, anymore. AMD and Intel actually work in each
others pockets any more. Intels own Core 2 Duo came partly from their
technology sharing. They will escalate or snowball technology off of
each other. AMD has stuff in the works too. But for right now, what's
working best is the Core 2 Duo. So what about a Quad core?
And from what I see in the benchmarks, looks like the 8800GTS is as
fast by itself as a pair of 7900 in SLI. And the 8800GTX is even
faster :-D
I'm still using the X2 4800+ and pair of 7800GTX in SLI. I don't go to
SLI mode much at all, but do use 3 monitors on DVI. And yep, HL2
really does play very well in 1600x1200 in Single Display acceleration
mode. No matter which 8800 you get, it will still run circles around
THAT!
McG.

not to make a big deal out of this but the original poster spec'd an E6600
Intel Core2 duo....$313.00 @ Newegg
680i chipset mobo price from $229 to about $379.00. all American Dollars.
The Asus P5N32-E-SLI selling for $239.00

You should see what they cost up here in the Great White North.........


peter

"Phil Weldon" wrote in message
thlink.net...
'peter' wrote, in part:
| the Intel 6600 costs $313.00 at NewEgg
| the Asus P5N32-E-SLI with the 680i chipset cost $239.00
| the Asus P5B-Deluxe cost 179.00.........so for $60.00 more you get a
| better/newer chipset with better OC
.
.
_____

The original poster specs an E6400 that's ~ $179.95 US and the better
nVidia
680i chipset motherboards, at $300 US and up are more expensive than an
E6600.

Phil Weldon
"peter" wrote in message
news:xbIJh.17311$zU1.3741@pd7urf1no...
| the Intel 6600 costs $313.00 at NewEgg
| the Asus P5N32-E-SLI with the 680i chipset cost $239.00
| the Asus P5B-Deluxe cost 179.00.........so for $60.00 more you get a
| better/newer chipset with better OC
| For that 60.00 buck you get an extra PIC-E slot..thats 3 with 2 of them
| supporting x16 mode
| you get an FSB capable of 1333..extra USB
| ports...Asus Quick connect
|
| With FSB support to 1333 I'd say it would last longer before being out
dated
| but thats just my opinion
| peter
|

DRS wrote:
"Phil Weldon" wrote in message
news
'DRS' wrote, in part:
The E6600 will draw less than 6A (75W/12*0.9). That adds up to
approximately 19A in my book when you chuck in a couple of fans.
_____

I agree that many are too quick to blindly follow display adapter
manufacturer recommendations for power supply capacity.
But why (75W/12*0.9) for the display adapter draw from the power
supply 12 volt rail? What is the 0.9? If anything, the demand on
the 12 VDC rail should be closer to ((75W/12V)/ 80% conversion
efficiency) = 7.45 Amperes. That still doesn't change your total
significantly.

I assumed 90% efficiency, as Paul does, although I've seen different people
use different assumptions. I see your point about my maths though. My
bad. Call it 8A and you've still got a system load of roughly 22A, maybe
add 1.5A for the DVD for 23.5A. That's only a tad over half of the NeoHE's
12v capacity (42A).



The processor power rating is at the output of the Vcore regulator.
Working back to the input of the Vcore regulator, means including
the efficiency of the Vcore regulator circuit.

On a video card, the typical quoted values are measured ones from
Xbitlabs. Since the values are measured at the 12V input point to
the card, the efficiency is already included. No 0.90 correction
factor is needed for the video card.

Paul

"Paul" wrote in message

[...]

On a video card, the typical quoted values are measured ones from
Xbitlabs. Since the values are measured at the 12V input point to
the card, the efficiency is already included. No 0.90 correction
factor is needed for the video card.

I didn't.

Anyway, in this case the 8800GTX power consumption figure not an Xbitlabs
measurement. The article I read said they were not able to measure it
themselves so they quoted what Nvidia told them.

peter wrote:
not to make a big deal out of this but the original poster spec'd an E6600
Intel Core2 duo....$313.00 @ Newegg
680i chipset mobo price from $229 to about $379.00. all American Dollars.
The Asus P5N32-E-SLI selling for $239.00

You should see what they cost up here in the Great White North.........


peter

"Phil Weldon" wrote in message
thlink.net...
'peter' wrote, in part:
| the Intel 6600 costs $313.00 at NewEgg
| the Asus P5N32-E-SLI with the 680i chipset cost $239.00
| the Asus P5B-Deluxe cost 179.00.........so for $60.00 more you get a
| better/newer chipset with better OC
.
.
_____

The original poster specs an E6400 that's ~ $179.95 US and the better
nVidia
680i chipset motherboards, at $300 US and up are more expensive than an
E6600.

Phil Weldon
"peter" wrote in message
news:xbIJh.17311$zU1.3741@pd7urf1no...
| the Intel 6600 costs $313.00 at NewEgg
| the Asus P5N32-E-SLI with the 680i chipset cost $239.00
| the Asus P5B-Deluxe cost 179.00.........so for $60.00 more you get a
| better/newer chipset with better OC
| For that 60.00 buck you get an extra PIC-E slot..thats 3 with 2 of them
| supporting x16 mode
| you get an FSB capable of 1333..extra USB
| ports...Asus Quick connect
|
| With FSB support to 1333 I'd say it would last longer before being out
dated
| but thats just my opinion
| peter
|





Mind if I interject, Gentlemen? :-)

Me being up in the Great White North myself the pricing is kicking me hard.
Yes I was specing out the E6600 as the leap to the E6700 was too drastic.
As to the P5B-Deluxe.. further specing showed a consistent issue with
the OB sound so I have dropped it and was looking at..
taadaaaaa the P5N32-E SLI. Nice to get confirmation form some
knowledgeable folks. Decided to drop the Intel chipset and go with the
nVidia just like I always did with the AMD boards.

Costing at local shop:
E6600 CAN$387
P5N32-E-SLI CAN$253
OCZ RAM CAN$190

BFG 8800GTS CAN$520 (now gone from site)
BFG 8800GTS OC CAN$574

--
Jethro[AGHL] aka Phat_Pinger
Reply Email: jethro86 (at) gmail (dot) com

McG. wrote:

big snip


There he is! Where you been hiding? I'd say you're on the right
track with the Core 2 Duo and DDR2 path. It's not that AMD have
dropped the ball really, anymore. AMD and Intel actually work in each
others pockets any more. Intels own Core 2 Duo came partly from their
technology sharing. They will escalate or snowball technology off of
each other. AMD has stuff in the works too. But for right now, what's
working best is the Core 2 Duo. So what about a Quad core?
And from what I see in the benchmarks, looks like the 8800GTS is as
fast by itself as a pair of 7900 in SLI. And the 8800GTX is even
faster :-D
I'm still using the X2 4800+ and pair of 7800GTX in SLI. I don't go to
SLI mode much at all, but do use 3 monitors on DVI. And yep, HL2
really does play very well in 1600x1200 in Single Display acceleration
mode. No matter which 8800 you get, it will still run circles around
THAT!
McG.



Hey McG. Not hiding.. always lurking and reading. If I don't have
anything to say, why natter on. :-)

Been trying to spec out the 1-2 steps down for the top to future proof
the system.
So your saying that it would out perform my current AMD3200+ Barton with
6600GT? **Shock.. horror**
:-)

--
Jethro[AGHL] aka Phat_Pinger
Reply Email: jethro86 (at) gmail (dot) com

Tecknomage wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2007 13:55:09 -0400, Jethro wrote:

I'm soliciting ideas and comments for my new PC build I'm about to start.
My old Socket A AMD stuff has fallen behind in everything and work came
through with some cash for me.. AND I have wife permission so it's all
good. :-)

Have been an AMD man for years now but seems they dropped the ball. I
know it's a hard time to buy as so much is changing while waiting for
AMD to counter Intel's latest offering.

Anyway my initial upgrade specs. (Not ever looking at SLI)

Intel E6600 Core2Duo
Asus P5B-Deluxe
OCZ 2GB PC2-6400 Dual channel
BFG 8800GTS 640Mb (looking at the OC version but...) GTX probably too
over the top
2 x WD 320GB SATAII 16MB buffer

Existing to carry over Antec SLK1650B case with Antec Neo HE500W power
supply. Worried it might not have the juice to run it.


Up the power supply, suggest 600w

Make sure the case has its own fan, and if you live in a hot-zone, 2
fans.

Going to partition the hard drives? I would.
Drive 0 - C: to 20gb for OS only, D: the remaining for applications
Drive 1 - 50% partitioning = E: & F: (I use these for games)
Also, I move "My Documents" to my D: so C: is a true OS only drive

You don't mention a CD drive, get a DVD-RW Dual Layer Recorder, my
choice is Memorex. Note Memorex supplies a NERO Essentials package
which is ****, pay for the full NERO 7 & make _sure_ to download any
update. Better, just buy & download from NERO and get the latest
version from the get-go.


Also, regarding Dual Core, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_core
and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyper-threading
pay attention to the down-side. I am _not_ saying Dual Core
processors are bad, just be aware of what they are not.


--
==== Tecknomage ====
"A billion here, a billion there, and pretty soon you're talking real
money." - Sen. Everett Dirksen (R) Illinois

Thanks.
The PSU is my concern but I have seen some testing on the PSU itself
with someone using a E6700 cpu in the test PC.

I do partition drives if I only have one but I always end up running
with 2 HDD's. C: for Windows\Apps and D: for games\Movies.

CD-RW\DVD-RW are being pulled from the old system.

Thanks,
J
--
Jethro[AGHL] aka Phat_Pinger
Reply Email: jethro86 (at) gmail (dot) com