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#21
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PC has no video and no beep code??
"VanguardLH" wrote in message ... RBM wrote: VanguardLH wrote ... I don't recall seeing if you have already checked the *loaded* voltages from the PSU. With the PSU connected to the motherboard, possibly the video card (if it has a 12V connector), at least one hard disk (the one with the OS partition), are the voltages on the 12V and 5V lines within specs when you check with a multimeter? I'm not even sure what the voltages should be on the different pins. I also don't trust that a voltage reading without a load connected will be accurate when the load is applied, so I just swapped the PSU and still got no beep Does "no beep" also mean you never see the POST screen? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power-on_self-test Yes, no beeps and totally black screen |
#22
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PC has no video and no beep code??
On Tue, 7 Jun 2011 19:31:13 -0400, "RBM" wrote:
"VanguardLH" wrote in message ... RBM wrote: VanguardLH wrote ... I don't recall seeing if you have already checked the *loaded* voltages from the PSU. With the PSU connected to the motherboard, possibly the video card (if it has a 12V connector), at least one hard disk (the one with the OS partition), are the voltages on the 12V and 5V lines within specs when you check with a multimeter? I'm not even sure what the voltages should be on the different pins. I also don't trust that a voltage reading without a load connected will be accurate when the load is applied, so I just swapped the PSU and still got no beep Does "no beep" also mean you never see the POST screen? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power-on_self-test Yes, no beeps and totally black screen I've certainly experienced no beeps when it was just the video card that was faulty. -- (\__/) M. (='.'=) Due to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and (")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking some articles posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by everyone you will need use a different method of posting. |
#23
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PC has no video and no beep code??
You sure you have an Asus P4C800ED motherboard? It isn't listed at
http://usa.asus.com/Motherboards/AllProducts/. The closest I can get is their P4P800-E Deluxe. Did I guess correctly? If this is a really old model, might it have been produced during the era when a bad electrolyte formulae were used for capacitors? See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacitor_plague. If you see electrolytic caps with bulging tops or sides, or see electrolyte that has oozed out, or discoloration around the cap on the motherboard, you have bad caps. There are shops that will replace the bad caps but the cost is probably more than the motherboard is worth. I didn't see (or recall) mention that you tried a different monitor. That the monitor is black doesn't mean the system isn't booting or that Windows isn't loading. With the monitor powered off, you can usually tell that the system got past the POST screen and is loading the OS by the noise that the hard disk makes as its heads thrash around seeking the clusters to load files into memory. Do you have an internal speaker and, if so, is it connected to the motherboard SPKR header? If there's an internal speaker, it came with the system case, not with the motherboard. Are you instead relying on beeps to emanate out of external speakers, like those connected to the line-out jack on your sound card or sound connectors on the motherboard's backpanel or those in the monitor? From the online manual at: http://dlcdnet.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/...0-e_deluxe.pdf page 1-5 "The motherboard offers an exciting feature called the ASUS POST Reporter to provide friendly voice messages and alerts during the Power- On Self-Tests (POST). Through an added external speaker, you will hear the messages informing you of the system boot status and causes of boot errors, if any." Looks like voice alerts get sent to the speaker instead of beeps. This assumes that you haven't disabled the ASUS Speech POST Reporter in the BIOS setup. It is enabled by default. Were you overclocking anything? That can cause a host to hang when adjustments are too far out-of-spec (and why some overclockable mobos have a reset to undo any overclocking to get back to a usable state). Have you yet tried to short the 2-pin header for CMOS Reset? If the BIOS is corrupted, have invalid values, or you've been overclocking and selected invalid or bad values, this will reset them to the factory defaults. If this works, replace the CMOS battery (probably a CR2032) since a weak battery can lead to a corrupted copy of the BIOS that gets saved in the CMOS table. You can get CR2032 batteries pretty cheap at eBay but be sure to ask the seller for the expiration date (they often don't list it and usually don't even look). You want one with an expiration date some 3-5 years out from now. |
#24
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PC has no video and no beep code??
Mark wrote:
On Tue, 7 Jun 2011 19:31:13 -0400, "RBM" wrote: "VanguardLH" wrote in message ... RBM wrote: VanguardLH wrote ... I don't recall seeing if you have already checked the *loaded* voltages from the PSU. With the PSU connected to the motherboard, possibly the video card (if it has a 12V connector), at least one hard disk (the one with the OS partition), are the voltages on the 12V and 5V lines within specs when you check with a multimeter? I'm not even sure what the voltages should be on the different pins. I also don't trust that a voltage reading without a load connected will be accurate when the load is applied, so I just swapped the PSU and still got no beep Does "no beep" also mean you never see the POST screen? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power-on_self-test Yes, no beeps and totally black screen I've certainly experienced no beeps when it was just the video card that was faulty. In which case, pulling the video card, pulling the RAM, and doing a "beep test" and listening for the BIOS to issue a beep code to the computer case speaker, is an easy test to tell you whether the CPU and motherboard are still working. Asus motherboards of that era, also have "Vocal POST". Connect amplified computer speakers, to the green "LineOut" connector on the I/O plate audio, to listen for it. When the computer starts, you may get an audible error message from that. (Whether it is enabled, is set in the BIOS screens, and I don't know under what circumstances it can be completely turned off. None of the CMOS settings should be able to do anything, if your processor is dead...) The vocal message "No CPU Installed", is determined by the grounding of a certain pin in the CPU socket. The messages "System Failed CPU Test" and "System Failed RAM Test" are based on timers in the Winbond chip, timing out when they receive no response from the CPU. The Winbond Vocal Post chip is autonomous, and can function all by itself, which is why the messages can be delivered. The CPU has to "clear a timer" on the chip, to stop the message from occurring. You'd only use the Vocal Post option, if you'd run out of other options, and were desperate for information. For example, if you could not get any "beeps" from the computer case speaker (SPKR header pins), then plugging in your amplified external computer speakers and listening for Vocal Post messages, is your last (free) option. The messages are pretty hard to hear, and it's best to keep a printed copy of the manual handy, and match the "cadence" of the noise you hear, to the length of the message :-) Paul |
#25
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PC has no video and no beep code??
Paul wrote:
In which case, pulling the video card, pulling the RAM, and doing a "beep test" and listening for the BIOS to issue a beep code to the computer case speaker, is an easy test to tell you whether the CPU and motherboard are still working. As I recall, with no system RAM available on the mobo, there will be an immediate beep without even waiting for the video BIOS to load; however, this mobo has vocal error alerts but I don't know if they play through the mobo-connected cheapie case speaker (or a piezo speaker soldered on the mobo) or through the sound connectors in the backpanel from the onboard audio controller. I have seen Dells where the beeps came out the external powered speakers (there was no internal speaker): if the external speakers weren't powered up, you couldn't hear the beeps. I don't recall Roy (who then nymshifted into RBM) has looked to see if the case speaker connected to a 4-pin SPKR header on the mobo (and tested it to make sure it can make noise). If the internal speaker isn't working, isn't connected, or comes out the backpanel audio connectors to go to external speakers (and the external speakers are powered off or muted), the whole issue of beeps might not be relevant to his non-boot problem. Question: If the CPU were defective, missing, or [partially] disconnected, what is going to execute the firmware code in the BIOS? It's machine code (a mini operating system) and something has to load and execute it. I just thought of something else (in case the computer is booting okay but without audible beeps for another reason): I've seen LCD monitor get switched to a different input port. That would make the LCD monitor look black because there is no video signal on the currently selected input port. The user has to play around with the monitor's buttons trying to get it to switch between the various input ports: VGA, DVI, and DPMI (if available). If the video cable is connected to the DVI port but the VGA port is selected in the monitor then the monitor will be black. Roy/RBM said he momentarily saw "no signal" so this isn't the case of a user kicking out the power plug for the monitor when swinging his legs under his desk and wondering why the monitor is black. |
#26
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PC has no video and no beep code??
VanguardLH wrote:
Paul wrote: In which case, pulling the video card, pulling the RAM, and doing a "beep test" and listening for the BIOS to issue a beep code to the computer case speaker, is an easy test to tell you whether the CPU and motherboard are still working. As I recall, with no system RAM available on the mobo, there will be an immediate beep without even waiting for the video BIOS to load; however, this mobo has vocal error alerts but I don't know if they play through the mobo-connected cheapie case speaker (or a piezo speaker soldered on the mobo) or through the sound connectors in the backpanel from the onboard audio controller. I have seen Dells where the beeps came out the external powered speakers (there was no internal speaker): if the external speakers weren't powered up, you couldn't hear the beeps. The "PC Beep" function is electrically separate from Vocal POST. They don't use the same speaker. The Winbond Vocal POST chip, is capacitively coupled into the green LineOut connector on the motherboard. It looks like this in terms of motherboard wiring. PC_Beep --------------------- SPKR pin header (switching transistor drive) AC'97 -------------+-------- Line Out (Lime green colored connector) CODEC | (Motherboard audio stack) capacitor | Vocal Post --------+ (PCI Sound Card) ------------- Line Out (green connector on PCI card) You're right, that some computers choose to insert PC_Beep, into the regular audio path. Lucky for me, all my computers are like the above diagram. If a person is using a separate PCI sound card, they can miss the Vocal Post feature entirely. If you're using "motherboard sound" via the AC'97 CODEC, then you may get to hear the Vocal Post prompts. An annoying one, is "now booting operating system" or the like, played at a healthy volume. On my P4C800-E Deluxe, I had a separate $10 sound card, so never heard any Vocal Post while using it. (Moving the speaker plug to the other connector, would give easy access to it.) The BIOS setup screen on later Asus motherboards, includes two settings to control the more annoying messages, so it's possible to turn off the boot message. Vocal Post was only shipped for around three years or so, and after that Asus stopped including the chip in new designs. The PC_Beep will not be generated, if the processor can't reach through the Northbridge and Southbridge and read some BIOS code. A PC generates a single beep sound, as the equivalent of a "lamp test function", to prove the computer case speaker works. But there have been the odd Asus motherboard, where in fact the beep is broken. The reason it broke, was another code fix they did. Once upon a time, Asus would "beep" for each detected USB peripheral device. This made users very angry, and Asus rushed out a fix to stop it. Their fix ? To disable the path to PC Beep :-) So rather than just comment out the code in the USB module, they cut off virtually everything. I presume that meant only changing one code module. Lazy *******s. I don't recall Roy (who then nymshifted into RBM) has looked to see if the case speaker connected to a 4-pin SPKR header on the mobo (and tested it to make sure it can make noise). If the internal speaker isn't working, isn't connected, or comes out the backpanel audio connectors to go to external speakers (and the external speakers are powered off or muted), the whole issue of beeps might not be relevant to his non-boot problem. Question: If the CPU were defective, missing, or [partially] disconnected, what is going to execute the firmware code in the BIOS? It's machine code (a mini operating system) and something has to load and execute it. If you unplug video card and system RAM modules, the BIOS code can still execute. But the processor has to get to the BIOS code for that to happen. The BIOS code also has access to the PC_Beep. The code doesn't rely on system RAM, and it's possible for the processor to run register based code, until commissioning of the Northbridge is complete (memory map and DIMM parameters are set up). I just thought of something else (in case the computer is booting okay but without audible beeps for another reason): I've seen LCD monitor get switched to a different input port. That would make the LCD monitor look black because there is no video signal on the currently selected input port. The user has to play around with the monitor's buttons trying to get it to switch between the various input ports: VGA, DVI, and DPMI (if available). If the video cable is connected to the DVI port but the VGA port is selected in the monitor then the monitor will be black. Roy/RBM said he momentarily saw "no signal" so this isn't the case of a user kicking out the power plug for the monitor when swinging his legs under his desk and wondering why the monitor is black. But ignoring those symptoms for a moment, we should be able to get a beep test going, if the motherboard isn't a vegetable. Without video card or RAM installed, there should be a repeating two beep or three beep pattern coming from the computer case speaker (PC_Beep). If that works, and there are beeps, next you insert RAM, and see if the beeps stop. If they stop, replace RAM. IF the beep pattern is maintained, but the pattern changes (one more or one less beep in pattern), now the motherboard is looking for the next item, which is the video card. If inserting the video card stops the beeps, then the video card is bad. Quite a bit of testing can be done with the beeps as guidance. If you pass all those steps, and there is no joy in terms of starting up, a PCI Port 80 card can be used to find out why. If there are zero beeps (and the user knows for a fact, that the system normally beeps once), then the suspects would include bad cpu missing ATX12V power cable or bad power supply feeding it bad Northbridge, Southbridge, BIOS chip contents bad PC_Beep speaker, bad driver transistor bad motherboard local power regulation functions (tied into Power_Good) Since the board features the "known bad" ICH5/ICH5R Southbridge, it's kinda easy for me to jump to the conclusion there will be no beeps, and "she's a vegetable". Until some contrary evidence shows up. If Roy hooks up the Vocal Post, clears CMOS with power off, and the Vocal Post reports "System failed CPU test", then that is a second confirmation that BIOS code is not able to run. The BIOS code includes a call, to clear the timer on the Winbond, before the "System failed CPU test" message can start to play. If the CPU is dead in the water, then the Vocal Post gets to play that voice message. If the user has erased the Vocal Post serial EEPROM chip, using the available software, then no voice will be present. Otherwise, you could get some message from the Vocal thing. Paul |
#27
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PC has no video and no beep code??
On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 16:43:40 -0400, Paul wrote:
Mark wrote: On Tue, 7 Jun 2011 19:31:13 -0400, "RBM" wrote: "VanguardLH" wrote in message ... RBM wrote: VanguardLH wrote ... I don't recall seeing if you have already checked the *loaded* voltages from the PSU. With the PSU connected to the motherboard, possibly the video card (if it has a 12V connector), at least one hard disk (the one with the OS partition), are the voltages on the 12V and 5V lines within specs when you check with a multimeter? I'm not even sure what the voltages should be on the different pins. I also don't trust that a voltage reading without a load connected will be accurate when the load is applied, so I just swapped the PSU and still got no beep Does "no beep" also mean you never see the POST screen? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power-on_self-test Yes, no beeps and totally black screen I've certainly experienced no beeps when it was just the video card that was faulty. In which case, pulling the video card, pulling the RAM, and doing a "beep test" and listening for the BIOS to issue a beep code to the computer case speaker, is an easy test to tell you whether the CPU and motherboard are still working. I'm not the OP and this problem was solved a while ago. I was just pointing out that not all boards are the same. This board would not beep /at all/ unless it had a working graphics card fitted. -- (\__/) M. (='.'=) Due to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and (")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking some articles posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by everyone you will need use a different method of posting. |
#28
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PC has no video and no beep code??
"VanguardLH" wrote in message ... Paul wrote: In which case, pulling the video card, pulling the RAM, and doing a "beep test" and listening for the BIOS to issue a beep code to the computer case speaker, is an easy test to tell you whether the CPU and motherboard are still working. As I recall, with no system RAM available on the mobo, there will be an immediate beep without even waiting for the video BIOS to load; however, this mobo has vocal error alerts but I don't know if they play through the mobo-connected cheapie case speaker (or a piezo speaker soldered on the mobo) or through the sound connectors in the backpanel from the onboard audio controller. I have seen Dells where the beeps came out the external powered speakers (there was no internal speaker): if the external speakers weren't powered up, you couldn't hear the beeps. I don't recall Roy (who then nymshifted into RBM) has looked to see if the case speaker connected to a 4-pin SPKR header on the mobo (and tested it to make sure it can make noise). If the internal speaker isn't working, isn't connected, or comes out the backpanel audio connectors to go to external speakers (and the external speakers are powered off or muted), the whole issue of beeps might not be relevant to his non-boot problem. ** Sorry about the morph, I've used RBM for years, and just set it up wrong on a temp PC. The case speaker is connected and was working Question: If the CPU were defective, missing, or [partially] disconnected, what is going to execute the firmware code in the BIOS? It's machine code (a mini operating system) and something has to load and execute it. ** I did replace the power supply ,video card (agp), and CPU, with no change I just thought of something else (in case the computer is booting okay but without audible beeps for another reason): I've seen LCD monitor get switched to a different input port. That would make the LCD monitor look black because there is no video signal on the currently selected input port. The user has to play around with the monitor's buttons trying to get it to switch between the various input ports: VGA, DVI, and DPMI (if available). If the video cable is connected to the DVI port but the VGA port is selected in the monitor then the monitor will be black. Roy/RBM said he momentarily saw "no signal" so this isn't the case of a user kicking out the power plug for the monitor when swinging his legs under his desk and wondering why the monitor is black. |
#29
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PC has no video and no beep code??
"Paul" wrote in message ... VanguardLH wrote: Paul wrote: In which case, pulling the video card, pulling the RAM, and doing a "beep test" and listening for the BIOS to issue a beep code to the computer case speaker, is an easy test to tell you whether the CPU and motherboard are still working. As I recall, with no system RAM available on the mobo, there will be an immediate beep without even waiting for the video BIOS to load; however, this mobo has vocal error alerts but I don't know if they play through the mobo-connected cheapie case speaker (or a piezo speaker soldered on the mobo) or through the sound connectors in the backpanel from the onboard audio controller. I have seen Dells where the beeps came out the external powered speakers (there was no internal speaker): if the external speakers weren't powered up, you couldn't hear the beeps. The "PC Beep" function is electrically separate from Vocal POST. They don't use the same speaker. The Winbond Vocal POST chip, is capacitively coupled into the green LineOut connector on the motherboard. It looks like this in terms of motherboard wiring. PC_Beep --------------------- SPKR pin header (switching transistor drive) AC'97 -------------+-------- Line Out (Lime green colored connector) CODEC | (Motherboard audio stack) capacitor | Vocal Post --------+ (PCI Sound Card) ------------- Line Out (green connector on PCI card) You're right, that some computers choose to insert PC_Beep, into the regular audio path. Lucky for me, all my computers are like the above diagram. If a person is using a separate PCI sound card, they can miss the Vocal Post feature entirely. If you're using "motherboard sound" via the AC'97 CODEC, then you may get to hear the Vocal Post prompts. An annoying one, is "now booting operating system" or the like, played at a healthy volume. On my P4C800-E Deluxe, I had a separate $10 sound card, so never heard any Vocal Post while using it. (Moving the speaker plug to the other connector, would give easy access to it.) The BIOS setup screen on later Asus motherboards, includes two settings to control the more annoying messages, so it's possible to turn off the boot message. Vocal Post was only shipped for around three years or so, and after that Asus stopped including the chip in new designs. ** This board has "speech post reporting" as a setting in the bios, which can be enabled or disabled. It was so annoying, I've always had it disabled The PC_Beep will not be generated, if the processor can't reach through the Northbridge and Southbridge and read some BIOS code. A PC generates a single beep sound, as the equivalent of a "lamp test function", to prove the computer case speaker works. But there have been the odd Asus motherboard, where in fact the beep is broken. The reason it broke, was another code fix they did. Once upon a time, Asus would "beep" for each detected USB peripheral device. This made users very angry, and Asus rushed out a fix to stop it. Their fix ? To disable the path to PC Beep :-) So rather than just comment out the code in the USB module, they cut off virtually everything. I presume that meant only changing one code module. Lazy *******s. I don't recall Roy (who then nymshifted into RBM) has looked to see if the case speaker connected to a 4-pin SPKR header on the mobo (and tested it to make sure it can make noise). If the internal speaker isn't working, isn't connected, or comes out the backpanel audio connectors to go to external speakers (and the external speakers are powered off or muted), the whole issue of beeps might not be relevant to his non-boot problem. Question: If the CPU were defective, missing, or [partially] disconnected, what is going to execute the firmware code in the BIOS? It's machine code (a mini operating system) and something has to load and execute it. If you unplug video card and system RAM modules, the BIOS code can still execute. But the processor has to get to the BIOS code for that to happen. The BIOS code also has access to the PC_Beep. The code doesn't rely on system RAM, and it's possible for the processor to run register based code, until commissioning of the Northbridge is complete (memory map and DIMM parameters are set up). I just thought of something else (in case the computer is booting okay but without audible beeps for another reason): I've seen LCD monitor get switched to a different input port. That would make the LCD monitor look black because there is no video signal on the currently selected input port. The user has to play around with the monitor's buttons trying to get it to switch between the various input ports: VGA, DVI, and DPMI (if available). If the video cable is connected to the DVI port but the VGA port is selected in the monitor then the monitor will be black. Roy/RBM said he momentarily saw "no signal" so this isn't the case of a user kicking out the power plug for the monitor when swinging his legs under his desk and wondering why the monitor is black. But ignoring those symptoms for a moment, we should be able to get a beep test going, if the motherboard isn't a vegetable. Without video card or RAM installed, there should be a repeating two beep or three beep pattern coming from the computer case speaker (PC_Beep). If that works, and there are beeps, next you insert RAM, and see if the beeps stop. If they stop, replace RAM. IF the beep pattern is maintained, but the pattern changes (one more or one less beep in pattern), now the motherboard is looking for the next item, which is the video card. If inserting the video card stops the beeps, then the video card is bad. Quite a bit of testing can be done with the beeps as guidance. If you pass all those steps, and there is no joy in terms of starting up, a PCI Port 80 card can be used to find out why. If there are zero beeps (and the user knows for a fact, that the system normally beeps once), then the suspects would include bad cpu missing ATX12V power cable or bad power supply feeding it bad Northbridge, Southbridge, BIOS chip contents bad PC_Beep speaker, bad driver transistor bad motherboard local power regulation functions (tied into Power_Good) Since the board features the "known bad" ICH5/ICH5R Southbridge, it's kinda easy for me to jump to the conclusion there will be no beeps, and "she's a vegetable". Until some contrary evidence shows up. If Roy hooks up the Vocal Post, clears CMOS with power off, and the Vocal Post reports "System failed CPU test", then that is a second confirmation that BIOS code is not able to run. The BIOS code includes a call, to clear the timer on the Winbond, before the "System failed CPU test" message can start to play. If the CPU is dead in the water, then the Vocal Post gets to play that voice message. If the user has erased the Vocal Post serial EEPROM chip, using the available software, then no voice will be present. Otherwise, you could get some message from the Vocal thing. Paul |
#30
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PC has no video and no beep code??
RBM wrote:
** This board has "speech post reporting" as a setting in the bios, which can be enabled or disabled. It was so annoying, I've always had it disabled But it is enabled by default in the BIOS. If the CMOS battery is weak or dead, could be your BIOS settings are corrupt or have been reset. If you have the P4P800E Deluxe that I could find (your P4C800ED wasn't listed at the ASUS site), its manual at: http://dlcdnet.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/...0-e_deluxe.pdf says the default is enabled for Speech Post Reporter. If the BIOS got reset then you're back to that annoying vocal error reporting that comes out the line-out jack instead of the internal speaker for beeps. |
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