New ASUS motherboard info

On Sat, 22 Nov 2014 17:47:25 -0500, Paul wrote:

I would have bought the A version, just because VCore has two
heatsinks on it. The A also has one more PCI Express slot.

With the A, there are reviews to read. And then you can look
at the failure cases, and see if there is a common theme to them.

*******

The reason I am suddenly concerned about heatsinks, is I bought
an Asus motherboard about two months ago, it has a single cheap
heatsink on VCore... and it is burning hot to the touch when
running Prime95. I ended up fitting a cooling fan, blowing
down on VCore. And you know how hard it is to mount
cooling fans in odd places. A waste of my time,
to have to set that up, just because a decent heatpipe
cooler wasn't used in place of the flimsy single aluminum
heatsink.

The computer I'm typing this on, Asus uses a huge heatpipe
cooler (three sides), that never gets more than a couple degrees
above room temperature. Which is engineering to the other extreme
(overkill). I wish I could swap coolers between boards, but of
course they don't share common features or footprint.

I've also got a MB, GByte tho, with burning chipsets (could be either
support or video, according to SpeedFan, tho they're both on the hot
side). I'll try pulling from the Big Box of Past Heatsinks something
suitable, first, cutting it down with hacksaw, dremel tool, to fit and
glue it on from the Big Box of Heatsink Compounds.

Can be a mixed bag, effort and time involved, going for optimality
among traditionalists (overclockers especially). First time I did it
was with a pane of glass and car oxidizing compound, "figure-8"
polishing mirror finishes into the bottom of heatsinks.

As well, a lesser/major impediment for accounting engineering. I've
an ART (studio rack stuff) amplifier, for instance, where I'm looking
behind at engineers designing such things. "Well," says one, "when I
walk up to a component and handle it, I don't feel comfortable about
putting out that product, into the market, when I'm uncomfortable and
concerned about burning my fingers." Now, that's quality control.

Damn amp is a little hot box, whole of both its sides are massive
heatsinks formed into the case design to account four power-output
chips, two to a side. And, there's already a newer design model,
(hey, mine is new at least to me, purchased a few, couple of years
ago), supposedly with more efficient cooling. Perhaps fanless. I see
electronics savvy reviewers with their highend gear -- "Well, I pulled
out the fan because I don't need to run it that hard on my efficient
$80K speakers." Ha - I pulled the fan and instead the finned-sides
feeling like a car's radiator, the whole thing turns into a mini-oven.

Now, there's another case of why in the hell can't a decent fan, with
a piezo incorporated, engineered to audibly coincide for a RPM-failure
monitored incident. I'm sure, it's just going to be nothing short of
peachy if that friggin' amp fails and I reach over and find I'm
grabbing a fanless hotbox.

Every one of my tubed amps (four of them), I've flipped over to send
the tubes' 450F radiant filament heat away from the backplane and
underlying support circuitry. In certain terms, by those amps' terms,
they're now acceptably known for "heads." ...Almost, someday I'll
have to buy some wood to stain and slap together for prettier
enclosures, than just grabbing one with a mind to stick not fingers
into cap-circuitry territory, that keep stored their lethal voltages.

On 11/22/2014 5:47 PM, Paul wrote:
Motor T wrote:
On 11/21/2014 11:34 AM, Motor T wrote:
I see an ASUS Z97-E motherboard on Newegg I would like to get. I can't
find any reviews for this board anywhere. Nor can I find a QVI list of
qualified memory. Is this a new board, or is it older/unreliable? Any
help would be appreciated as it quite inexpensive compared to other Z97
boards. Thanks.

Thanks for the replies and the link. I decided to 'go for it',
based on reputation and price. It is very much equal to the Z97-A I
was going to buy. This one $30 cheaper. Thanks again.

I would have bought the A version, just because VCore has two
heatsinks on it. The A also has one more PCI Express slot.

With the A, there are reviews to read. And then you can look
at the failure cases, and see if there is a common theme to them.

*******

The reason I am suddenly concerned about heatsinks, is I bought
an Asus motherboard about two months ago, it has a single cheap
heatsink on VCore... and it is burning hot to the touch when
running Prime95. I ended up fitting a cooling fan, blowing
down on VCore. And you know how hard it is to mount
cooling fans in odd places. A waste of my time,
to have to set that up, just because a decent heatpipe
cooler wasn't used in place of the flimsy single aluminum
heatsink.

The computer I'm typing this on, Asus uses a huge heatpipe
cooler (three sides), that never gets more than a couple degrees
above room temperature. Which is engineering to the other extreme
(overkill). I wish I could swap coolers between boards, but of
course they don't share common features or footprint.

Paul
What you have here is one for my side. I am a firm believer in the "you
get what you pay for" school of thought. In the long run it never pays
to cheap out for a measly few bucks. While this good purchasing practice
doesn't necessarily mean you have to though money away it does mean you
can look for an affordable boat while not settling for a dingy. If you
can't afford the bait don't go fishing or you might be left floundering.
I have had several ASUS based systems but have now settled for Gigabyte.

On 22/11/14 3:34 AM, Motor T wrote:
I see an ASUS Z97-E motherboard on Newegg I would like to get. I
can't find any reviews for this board anywhere.

Did you google "asus z97-e review"?

Nor can I find a QVI list of qualified memory.

Asus' website for the motherboard got a list:
http://www.asus.com/Motherboards/Z97E/specifications/

You don't need to worry too much about RAM compatibility issues...

--
@~@ Remain silent. Nothing from soldiers and magicians is real!
/ v \ Simplicity is Beauty! May the Force and farces be with you!
/( _ )\ (Fedora 19 i686) Linux 3.14.23-100.fc19.i686
^ ^ 18:06:01 up 3 days 23:34 0 users load average: 0.00 0.01 0.05
�借貸! ��騙! ��交! �打交! �打劫! �自殺! 請考慮綜� (CSSA):
http://www.swd.gov.hk/tc/index/site_...sub_addressesa

Al Drake wrote:
On 11/22/2014 5:47 PM, Paul wrote:
Motor T wrote:
On 11/21/2014 11:34 AM, Motor T wrote:
I see an ASUS Z97-E motherboard on Newegg I would like to get. I can't
find any reviews for this board anywhere. Nor can I find a QVI list of
qualified memory. Is this a new board, or is it older/unreliable? Any
help would be appreciated as it quite inexpensive compared to other Z97
boards. Thanks.

Thanks for the replies and the link. I decided to 'go for it',
based on reputation and price. It is very much equal to the Z97-A I
was going to buy. This one $30 cheaper. Thanks again.

I would have bought the A version, just because VCore has two
heatsinks on it. The A also has one more PCI Express slot.

With the A, there are reviews to read. And then you can look
at the failure cases, and see if there is a common theme to them.

*******

The reason I am suddenly concerned about heatsinks, is I bought
an Asus motherboard about two months ago, it has a single cheap
heatsink on VCore... and it is burning hot to the touch when
running Prime95. I ended up fitting a cooling fan, blowing
down on VCore. And you know how hard it is to mount
cooling fans in odd places. A waste of my time,
to have to set that up, just because a decent heatpipe
cooler wasn't used in place of the flimsy single aluminum
heatsink.

The computer I'm typing this on, Asus uses a huge heatpipe
cooler (three sides), that never gets more than a couple degrees
above room temperature. Which is engineering to the other extreme
(overkill). I wish I could swap coolers between boards, but of
course they don't share common features or footprint.

Paul
What you have here is one for my side. I am a firm believer in the "you
get what you pay for" school of thought. In the long run it never pays
to cheap out for a measly few bucks. While this good purchasing practice
doesn't necessarily mean you have to though money away it does mean you
can look for an affordable boat while not settling for a dingy. If you
can't afford the bait don't go fishing or you might be left floundering.
I have had several ASUS based systems but have now settled for Gigabyte.

I took my eye off the ball, and missed the important details at the time.

The receipt for the motherboard says $281.37 with tax included.
Price isn't a guarantee of anything, really.

The analysis at the time was a bit rushed, and I was more worried about
whether the CPU cooler would fit, that the DIMMs could be fitted without
having to take off the CPU cooler, and that the computer case side panel
would close on the computer case, with the cooler in place. There's maybe
a quarter inch between the top of the cooler, and the side of the case. So
I was kinda fixated on getting that detail right.

And they fooled me on the DIMMs too. The DIMM sockets are two-tone colored,
which makes it look like the lock latches both move. When in fact one
of the lock latches is the "fixed" kind that doesn't move. I would
not have bought the motherboard if I'd known that. Normally, if the
DIMM socket is all one color of plastic (one latch white, other latch
matches the socket plastic), that's a hint it's the "half a socket"
type.

It's a good thing I bench tested and happened to poke it with a
finger while it was sitting there. If I'd built up the system
straight into the case, it would probably be frying itself
to death at this very moment.

Paul

On Friday, November 21, 2014 11:34:56 AM UTC-8, Motor T wrote:
I see an ASUS Z97-E motherboard on Newegg I would like to get.

Here's a more general question: who cares about the mobo? if a mobo supports certain operations, isn't that only true for bootup, and after that it becomes irrelevant?

For example, supposed the motherboard supports SATA3. After bootup, the mobo hands off to the OS, and the OS supports these SATA drives, yes? So if can bootup, the mobo has performed its duties, and no need to worry anymore? Hence any mobo that supports the hardware you have is 'good enuf'? There is no interaction between OS and mobo after bootup?

RL

RayLopez99 wrote:
On Friday, November 21, 2014 11:34:56 AM UTC-8, Motor T wrote:
I see an ASUS Z97-E motherboard on Newegg I would like to get.

Here's a more general question: who cares about the mobo? if a mobo supports certain operations, isn't that only true for bootup, and after that it becomes irrelevant?

For example, supposed the motherboard supports SATA3. After bootup, the mobo hands off to the OS, and the OS supports these SATA drives, yes? So if can bootup, the mobo has performed its duties, and no need to worry anymore? Hence any mobo that supports the hardware you have is 'good enuf'? There is no interaction between OS and mobo after bootup?

RL

There is a small amount of BIOS code that runs, while the
OS is running. This is only an issue with audio workstation
design (only people working with low latency audio,
care about the side effects of this issue). The code runs
under System Management Mode. When SMM is invoked, the OS
is no longer running. It's a very crude form of timesharing
(and I don't know if the concept has been updated over the
years by Intel or not). Maybe SMM steals 30*100usec or
about 3 milliseconds per second of operation time. I don't
really know what controls SMM rate, whether it's just
a timer signal connected to SMI, or some system timer
is set up to do it. There have been motherboards, with the
Asus iPanel connected, where it appeared the SMI signal
on the iPanel header, triggered SMM to update the iPanel
display.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System_Management_Mode

(Suspected to use SMM code for support...)
http://ht4u.net/old/2001/asusipanel/...eingebaut2.jpg

*******

You buy motherboards, according to the set of hardware
interfaces they support. Say, for example, you're holding
an M.2 drive in your hand, and want to plug it in. Then
you need a motherboard with an M.2 socket. Or, with expansion
slots (PCI Express), that could hold a separate card. The
advantage of integrated connectors (onboard M.2) is the
overall system cost is lower. I can get a USB3 port on
a motherboard for peanuts, whereas adding a separate card
might cost me $25. For example, in an impulse buy at the
computer store, it cost me $25 for a serial port, $25 for
a parallel port, and so on. If those ports are already
on the motherboard, the incremental cost is a lot lower.
For the manufacturer, back in the day, those two interfaces
could be added for the cost of the connector alone.

For gamer purposes, you may want slots for more than one
video card. They make more expensive designs, from the
CPU on down, for that purpose (LGA2011 with 40 lanes). That
can double the cost of the basic system, if you throw in
the bells and whistles (best of everything). But the video
cards might cost $500 a piece, so it's all relative. The
whole project is going to be expensive, and mainly for
bragging rights. That's what some of those people do,
is waggle their three or four video cards, in your
face. What they don't tell you, is how uncomfortably
warm it is in their computer room, when they're gaming :-)
You don't need a home heating system, if you buy
all that stuff.

Another selector for motherboards, is the adequacy of the
design. Whether there were shortcuts taken or not. In a past
Anandtech review, they managed to "burn out" several
motherboards under their review, by putting 130W
processors in the socket. And as it turned out later,
there was advanced information available that would
in a subtle way, have warned that the motherboards
in question were only good with 65W or 89W processors.
So when you're looking at the cheapest motherboards,
there's a danger they could burn out on the first
day, if you haven't been reading all possible documentation
before hand. If you select a mid-range priced motherboard,
one with good reviews from hundreds of buyers, less is
likely to go wrong with them.

Paul

RayLopez99 wrote:
On Friday, November 21, 2014 11:34:56 AM UTC-8, Motor T wrote:
I see an ASUS Z97-E motherboard on Newegg I would like to get.
Here's a more general question: who cares about the mobo? if a mobo supports certain operations, isn't that only true for bootup, and after that it becomes irrelevant?

For example, supposed the motherboard supports SATA3. After bootup, the mobo hands off to the OS, and the OS supports these SATA drives, yes? So if can bootup, the mobo has performed its duties, and no need to worry anymore? Hence any mobo that supports the hardware you have is 'good enuf'? There is no interaction between OS and mobo after bootup?

RL
What you say is not true. For instance, many buses are on the
motherboard. An OS is just software (which is going to be loaded into
RAM, caches, hard drives). The motherboard is facilitating the
computers communication--even through it's network interface.

On Fri, 28 Nov 2014 22:02:01 -0800 (PST), RayLopez99
wrote:

Here's
a more general question: who cares about the mobo? if a mobo supports
certain operations, isn't that only true for bootup, and after that it
becomes irrelevant?

For example,
supposed the motherboard supports SATA3. After bootup, the mobo hands
off to the OS, and the OS supports these SATA drives, yes? So if can
bootup, the mobo has performed its duties, and no need to worry
anymore? Hence any mobo that supports the hardware you have is 'good
enuf'? There is no interaction between OS and mobo after bootup?

-
If that's all you want, then that holds true: 'The richest man in town
is the man whose games are the cheapest [to play].' Buy into
mid-level MB reputability, as Paul's saying, or let it 'hang' with
some of the better reviewed, cheaper, if at best, among lesser-known,
though qualified MB brandnames.

To extrapolate:

-
(excerpts from Pensées [Blaise Pascal] part III, §233):
"God is, or He is not"
A Game is being played... where heads or tails will turn up.
According to reason, you can defend neither of the propositions.
You must wager (it is **not** optional). [Emphasis -Fl.]
Let us weigh the gain and the loss in wagering that God is. Let us
estimate these two chances. If you gain, you gain all; if you lose,
you lose nothing.
Wager, then, without hesitation that He is. (...)

Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem.
(Entities must not be multiplied beyond necessity).

[however... -Fl.]

....Indeed, Ockham's contribution seems to be to restrict the operation
of this principle in matters pertaining to miracles and God's power:
so, in the Eucharist, a plurality of miracles is possible, simply
because it pleases God.[17]

This principle is sometimes phrased as:
Pluralitas non est ponenda sine necessitate
(Plurality should not be posited without necessity).[23]

Frustra fit per plura quod potest fieri per pauciora.
(It is futile to do with more things that which can be done with
fewer).

-wiki

-
Caveat emptor: May he beware, the subjunctive of cavere, to beware and
emptor, buyer.

[Beware -1) to be aware, -2) not without impunity, you are
conjunctively -3) ware(s). -Fl.)

On Fri, 28 Nov 2014 22:02:01 -0800 (PST), RayLopez99 wrote:

| On Friday, November 21, 2014 11:34:56 AM UTC-8, Motor T wrote:
| I see an ASUS Z97-E motherboard on Newegg I would like to get.
|
| Here's a more general question: who cares about the mobo? if a mobo supports certain operations, isn't that only true for bootup, and after that it becomes irrelevant?
|
| For example, supposed the motherboard supports SATA3. After bootup, the mobo hands off to the OS, and the OS supports these SATA drives, yes? So if can bootup, the mobo has performed its duties, and no need to worry anymore? Hence any mobo that supports the hardware you have is 'good enuf'? There is no interaction between OS and mobo after bootup?
|
| RL

The OS only takes over operational control of the functions, not the functions
themselves. The MB and OS relationship is a lot like a car and driver situation. No
matter how good the driver, he can only do what the car lets him do (you are the
owner of the car and employer of the driver telling him where you want to go).

Larc

Regular Google Groups troll...

--
RayLopez99 raylopez88 gmail.com wrote in news:88c37247-3c9a-4ac8-a725-7e265d4b1c9d googlegroups.com:

X-Received: by 10.70.44.161 with SMTP id f1mr18698431pdm.7.1417240921873; Fri, 28 Nov 2014 22:02:01 -0800 (PST)
X-Received: by 10.140.36.231 with SMTP id p94mr409qgp.13.1417240921826; Fri, 28 Nov 2014 22:02:01 -0800 (PST)
Path: eternal-september.org!mx02.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!news.glorb.com!h15no1920563igd.0!new s-out.google.com!m4ni576qag.1!nntp.google.com!w8no32 11503qac.0!postnews.google.com!glegroupsg2000goo.g ooglegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt
Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2014 22:02:01 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: m4o44q$giq$1 speranza.aioe.org
Complaints-To: groups-abuse google.com
Injection-Info: glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com; posting-host=108.175.163.243; posting-account=fRZa_AkAAACE3nlFA9zM1Eq00OKq1Ycq
NNTP-Posting-Host: 108.175.163.243
References: m4o44q$giq$1 speranza.aioe.org
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: 88c37247-3c9a-4ac8-a725-7e265d4b1c9d googlegroups.com
Subject: New ASUS motherboard info
From: RayLopez99 raylopez88 gmail.com
Injection-Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2014 06:02:01 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Xref: mx02.eternal-september.org alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt:31648

On Friday, November 21, 2014 11:34:56 AM UTC-8, Motor T wrote:
I see an ASUS Z97-E motherboard on Newegg I would like to get.

Here's a more general question: who cares about the mobo? if a mobo supports certain operations, isn't that only true for bootup, and after that it becomes irrelevant?

For example, supposed the motherboard supports SATA3. After bootup, the mobo hands off to the OS, and the OS supports these SATA drives, yes? So if can bootup, the mobo has performed its duties, and no need to worry anymore? Hence any mobo that supports the hardware you have is 'good enuf'? There is no interaction between OS and mobo after bootup?

RL