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Chris
November 21st 04, 07:16 PM
Greets All,

Due to all of the problems I have been having with my Gigabyte
GA-K8NSNXP-939 mobo, I am considering replacing it. It doesn't like a
dual memory configuration with my wallet busting Corsair PC3200XLPRO
memory, unless I relax the timings. Even with manually relaxed
timings, I am still only 90% stable and will randomly bomb out of
applications/games with a memory error. I also tried some Kingston C3
PC3200 memory that I obtained from a machine that I built for work,
and the Gigabyte board was just as unstable.

FWIW, I have all of the latest drivers for all my devices as well as
the F6 Bios, and I am still having fits. I verified that the Corsair
RAM is good by testing it on an ASUS A7V880 VIA KT880 (with an Athlon
XP 3200+, 2 WD Raptors, and an ATI 9200 Video card) and running Prime
95 for 48 hours without a single glitch in the torture test. In my
system I get anywhere from 1 minute to 24 hours before the torture
test bombs with manually relaxed timings. I verified that the memory
problem exists on Win 2k SP4, WinXP SP1, and WinXP SP2 because I was
insane enough to spend a week testing it with each operating system.

Regardless, I was wondering if I should consider the Abit or ASUS VIA
chipset based Socket 939 boards to replace my POS Gigabyte, order a
MSI K8N Neo, or wait? I have read on some forums where users replaced
their Gigabyte with the MSI K8N Neo and it worked fine for them.
Unfortunately, I take everything I read with a grain of salt now
because I read such rave reviews of how the POS board I have now was
so great before I plunked my some hard earned cash.

I guess my other alternative is to yank one of my 512 sticks and just
run with 512 in single channel mode, as this finicky Gigabyte runs
stable with either stick of ram in slot 1. Naturally, that defeats
the purpose of spending a small fortune on my Corsair RAM. I guess
plans B and C would be to replace the ram or wait to see what the
future holds for an ideal motherboard replacement.

Lastly, I have learned some valuable lessons from this experience:

1. The most expensive board out there is not necessarily the best.

2. Reviews tend to be biased and misleading.

3. Adopting new technology too soon is a royal PITA.


Thanks for any advice that you can offer me.

Chris

Wes Newell
November 21st 04, 09:04 PM
On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 12:16:55 -0600, Chris wrote:

> Due to all of the problems I have been having with my Gigabyte
> GA-K8NSNXP-939 mobo, I am considering replacing it. It doesn't like a
> dual memory configuration with my wallet busting Corsair PC3200XLPRO
> memory, unless I relax the timings. Even with manually relaxed
> timings, I am still only 90% stable and will randomly bomb out of
> applications/games with a memory error. I also tried some Kingston C3
> PC3200 memory that I obtained from a machine that I built for work,
> and the Gigabyte board was just as unstable.
>
You didn't mention your PSU which is a critcal part of the system. I
assume you also raised vdimm to test.

--
Abit KT7-Raid (KT133) Tbred B core CPU @2400MHz (24x100FSB)
http://mysite.verizon.net/res0exft/cpu.htm

Bill
November 21st 04, 11:15 PM
In article >,
says...
> Greets All,
>

<snip>

>
> Thanks for any advice that you can offer me.
>
> Chris
>

And the Processor is?

Bill

Chris
November 21st 04, 11:19 PM
On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 20:04:33 GMT, Wes Newell
> wrote:

>On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 12:16:55 -0600, Chris wrote:
>
>> Due to all of the problems I have been having with my Gigabyte
>> GA-K8NSNXP-939 mobo, I am considering replacing it. It doesn't like a
>> dual memory configuration with my wallet busting Corsair PC3200XLPRO
>> memory, unless I relax the timings. Even with manually relaxed
>> timings, I am still only 90% stable and will randomly bomb out of
>> applications/games with a memory error. I also tried some Kingston C3
>> PC3200 memory that I obtained from a machine that I built for work,
>> and the Gigabyte board was just as unstable.
>>
>You didn't mention your PSU which is a critcal part of the system. I
>assume you also raised vdimm to test.

I upped the memory .2v after *******izing it to run at a slower rate
based on the Ram Guy's recommendations on the Corsair forum.

System Specs:

Processor: AMD 64 3500+
Mobo: Gigabyte GA-K8NSNXP-939
Memory: Corsair PC3200XLPRO
Video: Gainward FX5900XT
Power: Enermax 470W
Hard drive1: WD 74GB Raptor
Hard drive2: WD2000JD
CD/DVDRW: LiteON 812S
Case: Cooler Master - Wave Master with stock cooling

Also, the Asus system that I tested my memory in only had the standard
350W Antec power supply AND it had more peripherals drawing power off
of it than my rig does. Should I consider going with a higher wattage
power supply over the current 470W Enermax that I already have? If
so, I do have one power hungry beast on my hands.

I still blame the crappy dual channel memory support on the Gigabyte
board because my system runs fine with either stick in slot one at
default speeds.

Thanks,
Chris

Stings
November 21st 04, 11:56 PM
1- It could also be video ram
2- As the last poster suggested check power supply and settings.
Is it counterfeit chips ? A double digit % of all Hynix ram sold in Europe
is counterfeit. Hynix does not make it public because the ram sales they do
have would stop, would you buy that brand if you knew it may be counterfeit?
I have used allot of Corsair and it was all capable of more than the stated
specs, I had a counterfeit Asus Mainboard once Socket 7 and I suspected a
counterfeit FIC 503.

"Wes Newell" > wrote in message
news:[email protected] .net...
> On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 12:16:55 -0600, Chris wrote:
>
>> Due to all of the problems I have been having with my Gigabyte
>> GA-K8NSNXP-939 mobo, I am considering replacing it. It doesn't like a
>> dual memory configuration with my wallet busting Corsair PC3200XLPRO
>> memory, unless I relax the timings. Even with manually relaxed
>> timings, I am still only 90% stable and will randomly bomb out of
>> applications/games with a memory error. I also tried some Kingston C3
>> PC3200 memory that I obtained from a machine that I built for work,
>> and the Gigabyte board was just as unstable.
>>
> You didn't mention your PSU which is a critcal part of the system. I
> assume you also raised vdimm to test.
>
> --
> Abit KT7-Raid (KT133) Tbred B core CPU @2400MHz (24x100FSB)
> http://mysite.verizon.net/res0exft/cpu.htm

General Schvantzkoph
November 22nd 04, 01:01 AM
On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 16:19:39 -0600, Chris wrote:

> On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 20:04:33 GMT, Wes Newell
> > wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 12:16:55 -0600, Chris wrote:
>>
>>> Due to all of the problems I have been having with my Gigabyte
>>> GA-K8NSNXP-939 mobo, I am considering replacing it. It doesn't like a
>>> dual memory configuration with my wallet busting Corsair PC3200XLPRO
>>> memory, unless I relax the timings. Even with manually relaxed
>>> timings, I am still only 90% stable and will randomly bomb out of
>>> applications/games with a memory error. I also tried some Kingston C3
>>> PC3200 memory that I obtained from a machine that I built for work,
>>> and the Gigabyte board was just as unstable.
>>>
>>You didn't mention your PSU which is a critcal part of the system. I
>>assume you also raised vdimm to test.
>
> I upped the memory .2v after *******izing it to run at a slower rate
> based on the Ram Guy's recommendations on the Corsair forum.
>
> System Specs:
>
> Processor: AMD 64 3500+
> Mobo: Gigabyte GA-K8NSNXP-939
> Memory: Corsair PC3200XLPRO
> Video: Gainward FX5900XT
> Power: Enermax 470W
> Hard drive1: WD 74GB Raptor
> Hard drive2: WD2000JD
> CD/DVDRW: LiteON 812S
> Case: Cooler Master - Wave Master with stock cooling
>
> Also, the Asus system that I tested my memory in only had the standard
> 350W Antec power supply AND it had more peripherals drawing power off
> of it than my rig does. Should I consider going with a higher wattage
> power supply over the current 470W Enermax that I already have? If
> so, I do have one power hungry beast on my hands.

A 470W Enermax should be fine, Enermax is a quality supply. Is the BIOS at
the latest rev?

Chris
November 22nd 04, 01:46 AM
On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 19:01:42 -0500, General Schvantzkoph
> wrote:

<Snip>
>A 470W Enermax should be fine, Enermax is a quality supply. Is the BIOS at
>the latest rev?
<Snip>

I have the F6 bios installed. Unfortunately, the system would not run
correctly after applying the bios update, thus I had to re-apply the
RAM Guy's recommended memory settings to obtain my 90% stability rate.

If you check the following thread, you will see why I am pointing the
finger at Gigabyte:
http://www.houseofhelp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28664

Also to spare any onlookers from rooting around, these are the
settings that I applied:

Voltage to +.2 Volts:
CAS Latency CL=2.0
Row Cycle Time tRC 11
Row Refresh Cyc Time tRFC 14
Ras# to CAS# delay tRCD 3
Row to Row delay Bios Default
Min Ras# Active Time tRAS 11
Row Precharge Time tRP 2
Write Recovery Time Bios Default
Write to Read delay Bios Default
Read to Write Delay Bios Default
Refresh Period tREF Bios Default
Enable 2T Timing Disabled

For some reason, when I dink around with the CAS Latency @ 2.5 versus
2.0, I tend to achieve better stability but I still get the random
memory errors when gaming or using photoshop with some heavy
filtering.

Thus far, I have:
1. verified that the memory is good in another system
2. tried my ATI Radeon 9600 All-in-Wonder in the place of the
Gainward Golden Sample 5900 XT, and I still get the weird memory
errors
3. tried slots 3 & 4 versus 1 & 2, same issue.

Gigabyte has been less than helpful as they have ignored any
correspondence regarding technical support. The sad thing is I used
to use Gigabyte boards in all of the systems I built and this is the
first time I have serious memory problems.

I am thinking hard about purchasing a MSI K8N Neo just to see if I am
correct in blaming Gigabyte for a shoddy board. At this point in the
game, what is another $135 to $145 to spend on this system?

Thanks to all who have replied thus far,

Chris

System specs:
Processor: AMD 64 3500+
Mobo: Gigabyte GA-K8NSNXP-939
Memory: Corsair PC3200XLPRO
Video: Gainward FX5900XT
Power: Enermax 470W
Hard drive1: WD 74GB Raptor
Hard drive2: WD2000JD
CD/DVDRW: LiteON 812S
Case: Cooler Master - Wave Master with stock cooling

Also, I have a Soundblaster AUDIGY 2 ZS Platinum that will be going
in the computer ASAP because I hate onboard sound.

General Schvantzkoph
November 22nd 04, 01:51 AM
On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 18:46:45 -0600, Chris wrote:

> On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 19:01:42 -0500, General Schvantzkoph
> > wrote:
>
> <Snip>
>>A 470W Enermax should be fine, Enermax is a quality supply. Is the BIOS at
>>the latest rev?
> <Snip>
>
> I have the F6 bios installed. Unfortunately, the system would not run
> correctly after applying the bios update, thus I had to re-apply the
> RAM Guy's recommended memory settings to obtain my 90% stability rate.
>
> If you check the following thread, you will see why I am pointing the
> finger at Gigabyte:
> http://www.houseofhelp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28664
>
> Also to spare any onlookers from rooting around, these are the
> settings that I applied:
>
> Voltage to +.2 Volts:
> CAS Latency CL=2.0
> Row Cycle Time tRC 11
> Row Refresh Cyc Time tRFC 14
> Ras# to CAS# delay tRCD 3
> Row to Row delay Bios Default
> Min Ras# Active Time tRAS 11
> Row Precharge Time tRP 2
> Write Recovery Time Bios Default
> Write to Read delay Bios Default
> Read to Write Delay Bios Default
> Refresh Period tREF Bios Default
> Enable 2T Timing Disabled
>
> For some reason, when I dink around with the CAS Latency @ 2.5 versus
> 2.0, I tend to achieve better stability but I still get the random
> memory errors when gaming or using photoshop with some heavy
> filtering.
>
> Thus far, I have:
> 1. verified that the memory is good in another system
> 2. tried my ATI Radeon 9600 All-in-Wonder in the place of the
> Gainward Golden Sample 5900 XT, and I still get the weird memory
> errors
> 3. tried slots 3 & 4 versus 1 & 2, same issue.
>
> Gigabyte has been less than helpful as they have ignored any
> correspondence regarding technical support. The sad thing is I used
> to use Gigabyte boards in all of the systems I built and this is the
> first time I have serious memory problems.
>
> I am thinking hard about purchasing a MSI K8N Neo just to see if I am
> correct in blaming Gigabyte for a shoddy board. At this point in the
> game, what is another $135 to $145 to spend on this system?

I assume you mean the K8N Neo2 Platinum not the K8N Neo. The K8N Neo is a
754 board, the Neo2 is the 939.

Chris
November 22nd 04, 01:58 AM
On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 19:51:44 -0500, General Schvantzkoph
> wrote:

>On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 18:46:45 -0600, Chris wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 19:01:42 -0500, General Schvantzkoph
>> > wrote:
>>
>> <Snip>
>>>A 470W Enermax should be fine, Enermax is a quality supply. Is the BIOS at
>>>the latest rev?
>> <Snip>
>>
>> I have the F6 bios installed. Unfortunately, the system would not run
>> correctly after applying the bios update, thus I had to re-apply the
>> RAM Guy's recommended memory settings to obtain my 90% stability rate.
>>
>> If you check the following thread, you will see why I am pointing the
>> finger at Gigabyte:
>> http://www.houseofhelp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28664
>>
>> Also to spare any onlookers from rooting around, these are the
>> settings that I applied:
>>
>> Voltage to +.2 Volts:
>> CAS Latency CL=2.0
>> Row Cycle Time tRC 11
>> Row Refresh Cyc Time tRFC 14
>> Ras# to CAS# delay tRCD 3
>> Row to Row delay Bios Default
>> Min Ras# Active Time tRAS 11
>> Row Precharge Time tRP 2
>> Write Recovery Time Bios Default
>> Write to Read delay Bios Default
>> Read to Write Delay Bios Default
>> Refresh Period tREF Bios Default
>> Enable 2T Timing Disabled
>>
>> For some reason, when I dink around with the CAS Latency @ 2.5 versus
>> 2.0, I tend to achieve better stability but I still get the random
>> memory errors when gaming or using photoshop with some heavy
>> filtering.
>>
>> Thus far, I have:
>> 1. verified that the memory is good in another system
>> 2. tried my ATI Radeon 9600 All-in-Wonder in the place of the
>> Gainward Golden Sample 5900 XT, and I still get the weird memory
>> errors
>> 3. tried slots 3 & 4 versus 1 & 2, same issue.
>>
>> Gigabyte has been less than helpful as they have ignored any
>> correspondence regarding technical support. The sad thing is I used
>> to use Gigabyte boards in all of the systems I built and this is the
>> first time I have serious memory problems.
>>
>> I am thinking hard about purchasing a MSI K8N Neo just to see if I am
>> correct in blaming Gigabyte for a shoddy board. At this point in the
>> game, what is another $135 to $145 to spend on this system?
>
>I assume you mean the K8N Neo2 Platinum not the K8N Neo. The K8N Neo is a
>754 board, the Neo2 is the 939.

Yup, the K8N Neo2 Platinum is what I mean. Unfortunately Newegg
doesn't have them in stock right now, otherwise I would have already
ordered one!

Sheldon Roger
November 23rd 04, 06:34 AM
Chris > wrote in message >...
> Greets All,
>
> Due to all of the problems I have been having with my Gigabyte
> GA-K8NSNXP-939 mobo, I am considering replacing it. It doesn't like a
> dual memory configuration with my wallet busting Corsair PC3200XLPRO
> memory, unless I relax the timings. Even with manually relaxed
> timings, I am still only 90% stable and will randomly bomb out of
> applications/games with a memory error. I also tried some Kingston C3
> PC3200 memory that I obtained from a machine that I built for work,
> and the Gigabyte board was just as unstable.
>
> FWIW, I have all of the latest drivers for all my devices as well as
> the F6 Bios, and I am still having fits. I verified that the Corsair
> RAM is good by testing it on an ASUS A7V880 VIA KT880 (with an Athlon
> XP 3200+, 2 WD Raptors, and an ATI 9200 Video card) and running Prime
> 95 for 48 hours without a single glitch in the torture test. In my
> system I get anywhere from 1 minute to 24 hours before the torture
> test bombs with manually relaxed timings. I verified that the memory
> problem exists on Win 2k SP4, WinXP SP1, and WinXP SP2 because I was
> insane enough to spend a week testing it with each operating system.
>
> Regardless, I was wondering if I should consider the Abit or ASUS VIA
> chipset based Socket 939 boards to replace my POS Gigabyte, order a
> MSI K8N Neo, or wait? I have read on some forums where users replaced
> their Gigabyte with the MSI K8N Neo and it worked fine for them.
> Unfortunately, I take everything I read with a grain of salt now
> because I read such rave reviews of how the POS board I have now was
> so great before I plunked my some hard earned cash.
>
> I guess my other alternative is to yank one of my 512 sticks and just
> run with 512 in single channel mode, as this finicky Gigabyte runs
> stable with either stick of ram in slot 1. Naturally, that defeats
> the purpose of spending a small fortune on my Corsair RAM. I guess
> plans B and C would be to replace the ram or wait to see what the
> future holds for an ideal motherboard replacement.
>
> Lastly, I have learned some valuable lessons from this experience:
>
> 1. The most expensive board out there is not necessarily the best.
>
> 2. Reviews tend to be biased and misleading.
>
> 3. Adopting new technology too soon is a royal PITA.
>
>
> Thanks for any advice that you can offer me.
>
> Chris

Before you give up on the Gigabyte try this:

1. Lower the dram to 4x (166)

2. Change the memory settings to:

11,15,4,3,8,4,3,2,3

3. Change the CL to 2.5

4. Increase the CPU upward from 200, in steps to increase
your memory bus speed. If you can get to 234 you will be running
memory at 400.

This is what I have done with two sticks of Mushkin, LII,
3200 memory in Dual Memory in Dimm 3 & 4. I am using the Win XP 64
evaluation OS so I can't really accurately evaluate a change in
benchmarking as I haven't found a program yet to evaluate memory
accurately.Note that Sandra is now releasing a 64 bit program. If
you are running Win XP you should be able to benchmark memory changes.

I recall an evaluation of memory settings which mentioned changes
int TRP,TRAS,Cl, TRCD and how little they affected peformance. 2T-1T
had the largest effect 1.1 to 2.1%. Can't locate this URL, but
if you can find it would be helpful.

BTW I chose the Gigabyte board because of hearing about memory problems
with the MSI.

Chris
November 25th 04, 05:46 PM
On 22 Nov 2004 21:34:15 -0800, (Sheldon Roger)
wrote:
>Before you give up on the Gigabyte try this:
>
>1. Lower the dram to 4x (166)

Tried it and it worked, but.....

>2. Change the memory settings to:
>
> 11,15,4,3,8,4,3,2,3

Tried it and it worked, but.....

>3. Change the CL to 2.5

Tried it and it worked, but.....

>4. Increase the CPU upward from 200, in steps to increase
>your memory bus speed. If you can get to 234 you will be running
>memory at 400.

Over clocking did not fare so well.

I first tried over clocking with Easy Tune 5, then by manually
changing things in the BIOS. The highest I could get this system
running without encountering stability problems was between 218 and
220 with the above memory settings. Also, I had to bump the processor
voltage slightly and it caused the temp to go a little higher than I
was willing to live with. So........

This is what I ended up doing. I set the memory back to automatic,
BUT, I limited the frequency to a max of 166. Now I can run Prime95
until the cows come home (well 24 hours plus and counting). As
before, I encountered no problems with Memtest & Microsoft's Memory
tester, therefore I am more than assured that this memory is good (It
was also tested on an ASUS A7V880 for 48 hours).

In the future, I am going to do as I have always done, WAIT before
building a new rig versus purchasing the latest and greatest on the
market. In fact, I will continue to consider Gigabyte as my board of
choice because they, along with ASUS and ABIT, have proven reliable in
the systems I have built over the years. Unfortunately, I can't say
the same for MSI as I had two boards die just after the one year mark.

Thanks again to everyone for all the help and suggestions.

Chris

System specs:

Processor: AMD 64 3500+
Mobo: Gigabyte GA-K8NSNXP-939
Memory: 512 X 2 Corsair PC3200XLPRO in slots 3 & 4
Video: Gainward FX5900XT Golden Sample
Power: Enermax 470W
Hard drive1: WD 74GB Raptor
Hard drive2: WD2000JD
CD/DVDRW: LiteOn 812S
DVD ROM: LiteOn 167T
Floppy: MITSUMI FA404A
Sound: Audigy 2 ZS Platinum
Case: Cooler Master - Wave Master with stock cooling

Sheldon Roger
November 26th 04, 12:21 PM
(snip)
>
> Thanks again to everyone for all the help and suggestions.
>
> Chris
>
> System specs:
>
> Processor: AMD 64 3500+
> Mobo: Gigabyte GA-K8NSNXP-939
> Memory: 512 X 2 Corsair PC3200XLPRO in slots 3 & 4
> Video: Gainward FX5900XT Golden Sample
> Power: Enermax 470W
> Hard drive1: WD 74GB Raptor
> Hard drive2: WD2000JD
> CD/DVDRW: LiteOn 812S
> DVD ROM: LiteOn 167T
> Floppy: MITSUMI FA404A
> Sound: Audigy 2 ZS Platinum
> Case: Cooler Master - Wave Master with stock cooling

Chris: Sorry.

But after going thru similar happenings, and many different BIOS
settings I'm now running my memory, Dual Channel, 6-2-2-2-1T
with a very mild overclock, 204. Can raise this (OC) with slower memory
settings and an associated reduction in memory bandwidth, so I'm
sitting still.

Hope you find a winning combination.

Shawn B.
December 11th 04, 07:52 AM
I had problems with the same Gigabyte/Corsair PC3200XLPRO 1GB . I first
thought it was memory, but after chaning the memory 3 times, power supply
once, video card, sound card and SATA HDD to IDE-133 and having the same
problems, and then replacing the motherboard with an identicle replacement
and still having the problems, I changed to the Asus A8V Deluxe and never
looked back, not one problem since (even with my original Corsair memory).
Bottom line, I'll never buy Gigabyte again.


Thanks,
Shawn


"Chris" > wrote in message
...
> Greets All,
>
> Due to all of the problems I have been having with my Gigabyte
> GA-K8NSNXP-939 mobo, I am considering replacing it. It doesn't like a
> dual memory configuration with my wallet busting Corsair PC3200XLPRO
> memory, unless I relax the timings. Even with manually relaxed
> timings, I am still only 90% stable and will randomly bomb out of
> applications/games with a memory error. I also tried some Kingston C3
> PC3200 memory that I obtained from a machine that I built for work,
> and the Gigabyte board was just as unstable.
>
> FWIW, I have all of the latest drivers for all my devices as well as
> the F6 Bios, and I am still having fits. I verified that the Corsair
> RAM is good by testing it on an ASUS A7V880 VIA KT880 (with an Athlon
> XP 3200+, 2 WD Raptors, and an ATI 9200 Video card) and running Prime
> 95 for 48 hours without a single glitch in the torture test. In my
> system I get anywhere from 1 minute to 24 hours before the torture
> test bombs with manually relaxed timings. I verified that the memory
> problem exists on Win 2k SP4, WinXP SP1, and WinXP SP2 because I was
> insane enough to spend a week testing it with each operating system.
>
> Regardless, I was wondering if I should consider the Abit or ASUS VIA
> chipset based Socket 939 boards to replace my POS Gigabyte, order a
> MSI K8N Neo, or wait? I have read on some forums where users replaced
> their Gigabyte with the MSI K8N Neo and it worked fine for them.
> Unfortunately, I take everything I read with a grain of salt now
> because I read such rave reviews of how the POS board I have now was
> so great before I plunked my some hard earned cash.
>
> I guess my other alternative is to yank one of my 512 sticks and just
> run with 512 in single channel mode, as this finicky Gigabyte runs
> stable with either stick of ram in slot 1. Naturally, that defeats
> the purpose of spending a small fortune on my Corsair RAM. I guess
> plans B and C would be to replace the ram or wait to see what the
> future holds for an ideal motherboard replacement.
>
> Lastly, I have learned some valuable lessons from this experience:
>
> 1. The most expensive board out there is not necessarily the best.
>
> 2. Reviews tend to be biased and misleading.
>
> 3. Adopting new technology too soon is a royal PITA.
>
>
> Thanks for any advice that you can offer me.
>
> Chris