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View Full Version : Power Supplies Going up in smoke!


Hop
May 4th 04, 12:45 AM
I have a system with an AMD 64 3400+ on a K8T Neo MSI mainboard.
Have two SATA WD 120 gig in a raid 0 on the VIA chipset, not the promise!
Have 2 sticks infineon 512 meg pc3200 in dual channel, a Lite on DVD and
a Lite on CDRW, a SB Audigy 2 and an MSI 5900 Ultra XT with 256 megs...
The thing is blazing fast, and stuffed into a Foxconn mid tower with a 450
watt
power supply. The first pwsupply went out while running SiSoft burn in ....
and I figured I caught a weak component. I replaced that one with a 420 watt
Codegen and that one went up in less than 12 hours run time...
I have a 600 watt coming, but I would like to hear from the group on
possible
causes and things to look out for... Like I said this beast is VERY fast but
it gets
a little expensive feeding it power supplies... Thanks in advance...

Jason Cothran
May 4th 04, 01:39 AM
"Hop" > wrote in message
...
| I have a system with an AMD 64 3400+ on a K8T Neo MSI mainboard.
| Have two SATA WD 120 gig in a raid 0 on the VIA chipset, not the promise!
| Have 2 sticks infineon 512 meg pc3200 in dual channel, a Lite on DVD and
| a Lite on CDRW, a SB Audigy 2 and an MSI 5900 Ultra XT with 256 megs...
| The thing is blazing fast, and stuffed into a Foxconn mid tower with a
450
| watt
| power supply. The first pwsupply went out while running SiSoft burn in
.....
| and I figured I caught a weak component. I replaced that one with a 420
watt
| Codegen and that one went up in less than 12 hours run time...
| I have a 600 watt coming, but I would like to hear from the group on
| possible
| causes and things to look out for... Like I said this beast is VERY fast
but
| it gets
| a little expensive feeding it power supplies... Thanks in advance...
|

Assuming everything is OK with input power to the PSU, you have a bad
component pulling too many amps off the power supply frying them.

Craig Coope
May 4th 04, 02:20 AM
"Hop" > wrote in message
...
> I have a system with an AMD 64 3400+ on a K8T Neo MSI mainboard.
> Have two SATA WD 120 gig in a raid 0 on the VIA chipset, not the promise!
> Have 2 sticks infineon 512 meg pc3200 in dual channel, a Lite on DVD and
> a Lite on CDRW, a SB Audigy 2 and an MSI 5900 Ultra XT with 256 megs...
> The thing is blazing fast, and stuffed into a Foxconn mid tower with a
450
> watt
> power supply. The first pwsupply went out while running SiSoft burn in
.....
> and I figured I caught a weak component. I replaced that one with a 420
watt
> Codegen and that one went up in less than 12 hours run time...
> I have a 600 watt coming, but I would like to hear from the group on
> possible
> causes and things to look out for... Like I said this beast is VERY fast
but
> it gets
> a little expensive feeding it power supplies... Thanks in advance...

I have just sent back my A64 3400+ because it had cold boot problems (I
suspect the PSU) but it was only 340W...but it was supposed to be AMD
rated.....

Now I bet I get a replacment that does the exact same thing....if I do I
will be kicking up a stink...

We will see....

Craig...

Peter van der Goes
May 4th 04, 03:09 AM
"Craig Coope" > wrote in message
...
>
>>
> I have just sent back my A64 3400+ because it had cold boot problems (I
> suspect the PSU) but it was only 340W...but it was supposed to be AMD
> rated.....
>
> Now I bet I get a replacment that does the exact same thing....if I do I
> will be kicking up a stink...
>
> We will see....
>
> Craig...
>
I have to ask. The PSU is "AMD rated" for what CPU's? And is the claim of
"AMD Rated" corroborated by what you find on the AMD web site? I've seen a
lot of ads for PSU's claiming "AMD Approved" or whatever. only to find the
approval is for same brand different model or limited to lesser CPU's.
If your system is like the OP's, high end video, multiple drives, etc., it's
going to draw a lot of juice on startup. If your symptom was: no boot from
cold, but OK on reboot, it was likely the PSU.

Wayne @ W.
May 4th 04, 04:35 AM
Craig, Newegg.com has an Enermax 420watt PSU that states it supports AMD 64
chip based systems, and it is less than 70.00


Wayne

Ed Light
May 4th 04, 06:08 AM
"Wayne @ W." > wrote in message
...
> Craig, Newegg.com has an Enermax 420watt PSU that states it supports AMD
64
> chip based systems, and it is less than 70.00
If you're going to get one of those new nvidia monster cards, maybe a 550
would be better.


--
Ed Light

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Send spam to the FTC at

Thanks, robots.

Wayne @ W.
May 4th 04, 07:46 AM
Naw, not needed. LOL Most people only have ONE Hard Drive, and one
Graphics card that has no power connector needed. LOL


"Ed Light" > wrote in message
news:[email protected]
>
> "Wayne @ W." > wrote in message
> ...
>> Craig, Newegg.com has an Enermax 420watt PSU that states it supports AMD
> 64
>> chip based systems, and it is less than 70.00
> If you're going to get one of those new nvidia monster cards, maybe a 550
> would be better.
>
>
> --
> Ed Light
>
> Smiley :-/
> MS Smiley :-\
>
> Send spam to the FTC at
>
> Thanks, robots.
>
>
>

Wes Newell
May 4th 04, 08:39 AM
On Tue, 04 May 2004 02:20:50 +0100, Craig Coope wrote:

>
> "Hop" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I have a system with an AMD 64 3400+ on a K8T Neo MSI mainboard.
>> Have two SATA WD 120 gig in a raid 0 on the VIA chipset, not the promise!
>> Have 2 sticks infineon 512 meg pc3200 in dual channel, a Lite on DVD and
>> a Lite on CDRW, a SB Audigy 2 and an MSI 5900 Ultra XT with 256 megs...
>> The thing is blazing fast, and stuffed into a Foxconn mid tower with a
> 450
>> watt
>> power supply. The first pwsupply went out while running SiSoft burn in
> ....
>> and I figured I caught a weak component. I replaced that one with a 420
> watt
>> Codegen and that one went up in less than 12 hours run time...
>> I have a 600 watt coming, but I would like to hear from the group on
>> possible
>> causes and things to look out for... Like I said this beast is VERY fast
> but
>> it gets
>> a little expensive feeding it power supplies... Thanks in advance...
>
> I have just sent back my A64 3400+ because it had cold boot problems (I
> suspect the PSU) but it was only 340W...but it was supposed to be AMD
> rated.....
>
> Now I bet I get a replacment that does the exact same thing....if I do I
> will be kicking up a stink...
>
> We will see....
>
When I first got my AMD 64 3000+ I couldn't get it to stay boot sometimes.
and other times it would crash during post, etc during the first minute. I
had a 400W PSU. I ordered 3 more, 500, 550, and 600W. All 3 ran the system
fine. The 400W still powers my XP system just fine. So yes, you need good
power. The 500W was $15, the 550 $18, and the 600 was $24. Yeah, I'm a
cheap sob.:-)


--
Abit KT7-Raid (KT133) Tbred B core CPU @2400MHz (24x100FSB)
http://mysite.verizon.net/res0exft/cpu.htm

rstlne
May 4th 04, 10:04 AM
"Hop" > wrote in message
...
> I have a system with an AMD 64 3400+ on a K8T Neo MSI mainboard.
> Have two SATA WD 120 gig in a raid 0 on the VIA chipset, not the promise!
> Have 2 sticks infineon 512 meg pc3200 in dual channel, a Lite on DVD and
> a Lite on CDRW, a SB Audigy 2 and an MSI 5900 Ultra XT with 256 megs...
> The thing is blazing fast, and stuffed into a Foxconn mid tower with a
450
> watt
> power supply. The first pwsupply went out while running SiSoft burn in
.....
> and I figured I caught a weak component. I replaced that one with a 420
watt
> Codegen and that one went up in less than 12 hours run time...
> I have a 600 watt coming, but I would like to hear from the group on
> possible
> causes and things to look out for... Like I said this beast is VERY fast
but
> it gets
> a little expensive feeding it power supplies... Thanks in advance...
>
>

Many power supplys can come bad straight from the box (SWPS's Just do that
sorta thing sometimes).
When you get the new supply in, before checking how well it works under
"Stressful" benchmarks, look at the 5/12/3 v lines and see how well they are
in (If they are kinda far out then that might mean somethings pulling it
down). If everything is working good (but the supply's burn out) then there
is either a short forming somewhere, a ground fault (Check your wall plug),
or part of the equipment is pulling the kit down.

I guess all the other standard rules apply too, Make sure all the standoffs
are in the correct place, make sure all the cables are tight fitting, double
check anything that has external power (USB), so on so forth

rstlne
May 4th 04, 10:17 AM
"Craig Coope" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Hop" > wrote in message
> ...
> > I have a system with an AMD 64 3400+ on a K8T Neo MSI mainboard.
> > Have two SATA WD 120 gig in a raid 0 on the VIA chipset, not the
promise!
> > Have 2 sticks infineon 512 meg pc3200 in dual channel, a Lite on DVD and
> > a Lite on CDRW, a SB Audigy 2 and an MSI 5900 Ultra XT with 256 megs...
> > The thing is blazing fast, and stuffed into a Foxconn mid tower with a
> 450
> > watt
> > power supply. The first pwsupply went out while running SiSoft burn in
> ....
> > and I figured I caught a weak component. I replaced that one with a 420
> watt
> > Codegen and that one went up in less than 12 hours run time...
> > I have a 600 watt coming, but I would like to hear from the group on
> > possible
> > causes and things to look out for... Like I said this beast is VERY fast
> but
> > it gets
> > a little expensive feeding it power supplies... Thanks in advance...
>
> I have just sent back my A64 3400+ because it had cold boot problems (I
> suspect the PSU) but it was only 340W...but it was supposed to be AMD
> rated.....
>
> Now I bet I get a replacment that does the exact same thing....if I do I
> will be kicking up a stink...
>
> We will see....
>
> Craig...
>

OOOOOPS
I sent this via email instead of NG .. laugh..

I am glad there are people like you out there..
You make me understand why companys have **** tech support staff and why
companys have to inflate prices to cover their loss of returned - non faulty
product.

Hellraiser
May 4th 04, 01:36 PM
> The thing is blazing fast, and stuffed into a Foxconn mid tower with a
450
> watt
> power supply. The first pwsupply went out while running SiSoft burn in
.....
> and I figured I caught a weak component. I replaced that one with a 420
watt
> Codegen and that one went up in less than 12 hours run time...
> I have a 600 watt coming, but I would like to hear from the group on
> possible
> causes and things to look out for... Like I said this beast is VERY fast
but
> it gets
> a little expensive feeding it power supplies... Thanks in advance...

That's your problem - Codegen and Foxconn are cheap and nasty generic PSUs,
be grateful that they didn't take your motherboard and CPU out with them
when they died. Quit being such a cheap sod, and spend some cash on a decent
PSU - if you look at it as a percentage of the amount spent on the system,
even a decent Antec will be very little, and will ensure your components
continue to work in the way they're supposed to :)

Hellraiser............>

Craig Coope
May 4th 04, 08:13 PM
"Peter van der Goes" > wrote in message
news:[email protected]
>
> "Craig Coope" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> >>
> > I have just sent back my A64 3400+ because it had cold boot problems (I
> > suspect the PSU) but it was only 340W...but it was supposed to be AMD
> > rated.....
> >
> > Now I bet I get a replacment that does the exact same thing....if I do I
> > will be kicking up a stink...
> >
> > We will see....
> >
> > Craig...
> >
> I have to ask. The PSU is "AMD rated" for what CPU's? And is the claim of
> "AMD Rated" corroborated by what you find on the AMD web site? I've seen a
> lot of ads for PSU's claiming "AMD Approved" or whatever. only to find the
> approval is for same brand different model or limited to lesser CPU's.
> If your system is like the OP's, high end video, multiple drives, etc.,
it's
> going to draw a lot of juice on startup. If your symptom was: no boot from
> cold, but OK on reboot, it was likely the PSU.

The compnay I have bought from have only just started selling the newer A64s
so it is likely (going by the company's reputation) that they are
underestimating the power needed for the system....but I can't test out the
theory as the only other PSU I have is 300W and not higher than 340W...

The PC has been sent back today so I will find out what the problem was (I
hope) on Friday or so......

Craig...

Craig Coope
May 4th 04, 08:16 PM
"Wayne @ W." > wrote in message
...
> Craig, Newegg.com has an Enermax 420watt PSU that states it supports AMD
64
> chip based systems, and it is less than 70.00
>
>
> Wayne

Thanks....I may look into this but my point remains that I should have been
supplied with a capable PSU from the start.... If they send the PC back with
another 340W and it develops the same fault I will "suggest" that they put
in a higher rated PSU...

Craig...

Craig Coope
May 4th 04, 08:17 PM
"Ed Light" > wrote in message
news:[email protected]
>
> "Wayne @ W." > wrote in message
> ...
> > Craig, Newegg.com has an Enermax 420watt PSU that states it supports AMD
> 64
> > chip based systems, and it is less than 70.00
> If you're going to get one of those new nvidia monster cards, maybe a 550
> would be better.

I have an ATI 9800 XT and that will keep me going for ages yet....Far Cry
runs amazing even with AA and AF on...

Craig...

Craig Coope
May 4th 04, 08:22 PM
"Wes Newell" > wrote in message
news:[email protected] .net...

> When I first got my AMD 64 3000+ I couldn't get it to stay boot sometimes.
> and other times it would crash during post, etc during the first minute. I
> had a 400W PSU. I ordered 3 more, 500, 550, and 600W. All 3 ran the system
> fine. The 400W still powers my XP system just fine. So yes, you need good
> power. The 500W was $15, the 550 $18, and the 600 was $24. Yeah, I'm a
> cheap sob.:-)

Damn...mine is only 340W...

I have a A64 3400+

It has one HDD
2 DVD drives
1 ATI 9800 XT
Creative labs Audiology 2 6.1 sound card
A Floppy
Ethernet Card
A ****ty TV tuner
A 56K modem
and two sticks of 512Meg RAM

I have no idea about power consumption.....but is 340W within reason for my
Spec?

If not I may have to kick up a stink....

Craig....

Peter van der Goes
May 4th 04, 08:31 PM
>
> The PC has been sent back today so I will find out what the problem was (I
> hope) on Friday or so......
>
> Craig...
>
My bad, Craig.
I was assuming components, not an entire computer. So, when you said you'd
returned it, I was thinking you had returned the CPU.
Now, it all makes sense...

rstlne
May 4th 04, 08:49 PM
> >
> > The PC has been sent back today so I will find out what the problem was
(I
> > hope) on Friday or so......
> >
> > Craig...
> >
> My bad, Craig.
> I was assuming components, not an entire computer. So, when you said you'd
> returned it, I was thinking you had returned the CPU.
> Now, it all makes sense...
>


DOH
yea, you shoulda seen what I sent him via email
Hey Craig, I am sorry too! ..
It's not you that's a moron, it's your system builder!

Craig Coope
May 4th 04, 08:53 PM
"rstlne" > wrote in message
...
> > >
> > > The PC has been sent back today so I will find out what the problem
was
> (I
> > > hope) on Friday or so......
> > >
> > > Craig...
> > >
> > My bad, Craig.
> > I was assuming components, not an entire computer. So, when you said
you'd
> > returned it, I was thinking you had returned the CPU.
> > Now, it all makes sense...
> >
>
>
> DOH
> yea, you shoulda seen what I sent him via email
> Hey Craig, I am sorry too! ..
> It's not you that's a moron, it's your system builder!

Tell me about it :o( ...I have just emailed AMD...if they say that the 340W
isn't recommended for the system I have I will take it further with the PC
place....(With my "official email" from AMD :op )

Craig...

Jason Cothran
May 4th 04, 11:10 PM
"Craig Coope" > wrote in message
...
|
| "Wes Newell" > wrote in message
| news:[email protected] .net...
|
| > When I first got my AMD 64 3000+ I couldn't get it to stay boot
sometimes.
| > and other times it would crash during post, etc during the first minute.
I
| > had a 400W PSU. I ordered 3 more, 500, 550, and 600W. All 3 ran the
system
| > fine. The 400W still powers my XP system just fine. So yes, you need
good
| > power. The 500W was $15, the 550 $18, and the 600 was $24. Yeah, I'm a
| > cheap sob.:-)
|
| Damn...mine is only 340W...
|
| I have a A64 3400+
|
| It has one HDD
| 2 DVD drives
| 1 ATI 9800 XT
| Creative labs Audiology 2 6.1 sound card
| A Floppy
| Ethernet Card
| A ****ty TV tuner
| A 56K modem
| and two sticks of 512Meg RAM
|
| I have no idea about power consumption.....but is 340W within reason for
my
| Spec?
|
| If not I may have to kick up a stink....
|

If it is a good 340W power supply, you are fine. I have one running on a
high quality 300W PSU. It is only an A64 3200+ though. Two HDs, DVD writer,
DVD burner, 9800XT, Audigy2 platinum, floppy, ethernet, four active USB
devices. Obviously, they are not all pulling loads at the same time, but my
system has ran without a hiccup.

Craig Coope
May 4th 04, 11:14 PM
"Jason Cothran" > wrote in message
. ..

>
> If it is a good 340W power supply, you are fine. I have one running on a
> high quality 300W PSU. It is only an A64 3200+ though. Two HDs, DVD
writer,
> DVD burner, 9800XT, Audigy2 platinum, floppy, ethernet, four active USB
> devices. Obviously, they are not all pulling loads at the same time, but
my
> system has ran without a hiccup.

Hmmm...I was hoping it would be more black and white than that.....

The PSU is a Chieftec.....no idea it that is good...I seriously doubt tho
:op

I'll wait to see what happens when I get the PC back....

Craig...

Hop
May 5th 04, 03:39 AM
"Hellraiser" > wrote in message
...
> > The thing is blazing fast, and stuffed into a Foxconn mid tower with a
> 450
> > watt
> > power supply. The first pwsupply went out while running SiSoft burn in
> ....
> > and I figured I caught a weak component. I replaced that one with a 420
> watt
> > Codegen and that one went up in less than 12 hours run time...
> > I have a 600 watt coming, but I would like to hear from the group on
> > possible
> > causes and things to look out for... Like I said this beast is VERY fast
> but
> > it gets
> > a little expensive feeding it power supplies... Thanks in advance...
>
> That's your problem - Codegen and Foxconn are cheap and nasty generic
PSUs,
> be grateful that they didn't take your motherboard and CPU out with them
> when they died. Quit being such a cheap sod, and spend some cash on a
decent
> PSU - if you look at it as a percentage of the amount spent on the system,
> even a decent Antec will be very little, and will ensure your components
> continue to work in the way they're supposed to :)
>
> Hellraiser............>
>
>
> My Mistake, Hellraiser....it was a PowMax case....came with a 450 watt
power supply...
I'm inclined to fear it is the MSI 5900 Ultra sucking the life out of the
PWS, it has a 12 volt plug in...
I guess it could be the two hard drives but I think the video card has got
to be the prime suspect...
Does anyone know how to test the current draw of a video card while the pc
is running?

Wes Newell
May 5th 04, 07:57 AM
On Tue, 04 May 2004 20:22:14 +0100, Craig Coope wrote:

>
> "Wes Newell" > wrote in message
> news:[email protected] .net...
>
>> When I first got my AMD 64 3000+ I couldn't get it to stay boot sometimes.
>> and other times it would crash during post, etc during the first minute. I
>> had a 400W PSU. I ordered 3 more, 500, 550, and 600W. All 3 ran the system
>> fine. The 400W still powers my XP system just fine. So yes, you need good
>> power. The 500W was $15, the 550 $18, and the 600 was $24. Yeah, I'm a
>> cheap sob.:-)
>
> Damn...mine is only 340W...
>
The 400W that didn't work was a Powerline. I really think it was a
mislabeled 250W or it was just junk. The ones I bought were Lead Power,
and Power Magic. The Powerline Came with the case I bought some time back.

A decent 340W PSU is probably ok, but it would also make a good backup for
a 500 or 600W.

--
Abit KT7-Raid (KT133) Tbred B core CPU @2400MHz (24x100FSB)
http://mysite.verizon.net/res0exft/cpu.htm

Ed Light
May 5th 04, 08:34 AM
"Hop" > wrote
> Does anyone know how to test the current draw of a video card while the pc
> is running?

You can use one of these little things to measure the entire system during
idle and during intense 3D.

http://store.yahoo.com/ahernstore/p4400.html

You could use Motherboard Monitor and set it to update every 15 seconds,
then run 3D for 30 seconds, then alt-tab out with the Motherboard Monitor
Dashboard showing and check the voltages. Try it a few times in case it
updated just after you tabbed out.


--
Ed Light

Smiley :-/
MS Smiley :-\

Send spam to the FTC at

Thanks, robots.

Hop
May 6th 04, 12:53 AM
"Ed Light" > wrote in message
news:[email protected]
>
> "Hop" > wrote
> > Does anyone know how to test the current draw of a video card while the
pc
> > is running?
>
> You can use one of these little things to measure the entire system during
> idle and during intense 3D.
>
> http://store.yahoo.com/ahernstore/p4400.html
>
> You could use Motherboard Monitor and set it to update every 15 seconds,
> then run 3D for 30 seconds, then alt-tab out with the Motherboard Monitor
> Dashboard showing and check the voltages. Try it a few times in case it
> updated just after you tabbed out.
>
>
> --
> Ed Light
>
> Smiley :-/
> MS Smiley :-\
>
> Send spam to the FTC at
>
> Thanks, robots.
>
> Thank you Ed, a very useful tip indeed!!

Sick Willie
May 6th 04, 07:15 PM
"Hop" > wrote in message
...
> I have a system with an AMD 64 3400+ on a K8T Neo MSI mainboard.
> Have two SATA WD 120 gig in a raid 0 on the VIA chipset, not the promise!
> Have 2 sticks infineon 512 meg pc3200 in dual channel, a Lite on DVD and
> a Lite on CDRW, a SB Audigy 2 and an MSI 5900 Ultra XT with 256 megs...
<snip>

It probably has something to do with you running that memory in dual channel
mode with a processor that doesn't support that configuration. <g> Switch
to single channel mode and see what happens.

I know, I know...., I'm a smartass, but I can't help it. Learn a little
about computers, spend a little money on a good quality power supply - such
as, but not limited to, Antec, and you should be good to go.

Sick Willie

Ben Pope
May 7th 04, 11:35 PM
Ed Light wrote:
> "Hop" > wrote
>> Does anyone know how to test the current draw of a video card while the
>> pc is running?
>
> You can use one of these little things to measure the entire system during
> idle and during intense 3D.
>
> http://store.yahoo.com/ahernstore/p4400.html
>
> You could use Motherboard Monitor and set it to update every 15 seconds,
> then run 3D for 30 seconds, then alt-tab out with the Motherboard Monitor
> Dashboard showing and check the voltages. Try it a few times in case it
> updated just after you tabbed out.

Or you could just set it to update the min/max readings as often as
possible, and use the system for a while. Then go and check the min. Also
check that the range of values isn't too high, as this is also a bad sign.

Ben
--
A7N8X FAQ: www.ben.pope.name/a7n8x_faq.html
Questions by email will likely be ignored, please use the newsgroups.
I'm not just a number. To many, I'm known as a String...

Ed Light
May 7th 04, 11:47 PM
"Ben Pope" > wrote in message
...
> Ed Light wrote:
> > "Hop" > wrote
> >> Does anyone know how to test the current draw of a video card while the
> >> pc is running?
> >
> > You can use one of these little things to measure the entire system
during
> > idle and during intense 3D.
> >
> > http://store.yahoo.com/ahernstore/p4400.html
> >
> > You could use Motherboard Monitor and set it to update every 15 seconds,
> > then run 3D for 30 seconds, then alt-tab out with the Motherboard
Monitor
> > Dashboard showing and check the voltages. Try it a few times in case it
> > updated just after you tabbed out.
>
> Or you could just set it to update the min/max readings as often as
> possible, and use the system for a while. Then go and check the min.
Also
> check that the range of values isn't too high, as this is also a bad sign.

Wow, I hadn't noticed the high/low feature. Now I must test...


--
Ed Light

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MS Smiley :-\

Send spam to the FTC at

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