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View Full Version : Request to be incorporated in the next NVidia reference driver.


Paul Duffy
November 30th 03, 04:09 PM
I own a Quadro FX card that is driving an IBM T221 monitor at 3840 x
2400 and I wonder if you could think about the following for the next
Nvidia driver release.

The problem is that under Windows XP the drivers see the card outputs as
if to two monitors (not in itself a problem) and can drive the monitor
in one of two modes:-

Mode 1.

The Card outputs to a Single monitor at 3840 x 2400 @ 12Hz (I would
assume when it's doing this it's only using one of the DVI outputs from
the card). This is fine except that 12Hz is a very low refresh rate and
causes the monitor to flicker.

Mode 2.

The card outputs to the monitor as if it's two monitors using 2 x 1920 x
2400 @ 25Hz (I would assume in this mode it's using both DVI's from the
card) and the settings in Windows allow me to extend the desktop across
the 'second' monitor...using Horizontal Span it merges to appear as one
monitor and runs at 25Hz.

Here is the problem....

3D applications (for example Flight Simulator 2004) that run in
'FullScreen' mode cannot utilise Mode 2 the way the drivers are
currently configured...the reason for this is that if the application is
configured for 3840 x 2400 resolution it forces the card to go into Mode
1 above and therefore drops the frequency to 12Hz and therefore 12FPS.
If the application is configured for 2 x 1920 x 2400 mode then you can't
utilise FullScreen mode as it'll only go FullScreen on the first monitor
(and therefore not utilise the second monitor properly).

So ideally what would be perfect in the next driver release would be a
new driver mode...

Appear to be mode 1 above but work as mode 2...I'll try to describe what
I mean.

In the Windows video settings box I would ideally want an option box
that says something like "Very High Resolution Monitor in use?" and if
it's ticked I then can ONLY output to a single monitor at 3840 x 2400
(so that's what windows sees...1 Monitor) but behind the scenes the
driver at a low level is actually pushing the data out to two monitors
using both DVI's and therefore any applications can output to ONE
monitor when in fact the driver is pushing the data to TWO monitors at
25Hz. I hope this makes sense and someone reading it can understand the
problem.

To get a further insight have a look at the Matrox Parhelia driver with
specific regard to how it operates using Surround Mode..it does pretty
much what I'm asking for here in that even though you have up to three
monitors physically attached the OS sees them as 1 monitor and the
driver handles how the data is pushed.

Paul

Egil Solberg
November 30th 03, 04:42 PM
Try e-mailing nVIDIA instead. I doubt that they are reading this.

Wilson
December 1st 03, 08:40 PM
Paul Duffy <paul at scim dot co dot uk> wrote in message >...

> So ideally what would be perfect in the next driver release would be a
> new driver mode...
>
> Appear to be mode 1 above but work as mode 2...I'll try to describe what
> I mean.
>

Or you can upgrade to the 9503DG5 with a dual-link DVI converter box.

Paul Duffy
December 2nd 03, 07:18 AM
In article >,
says...
> Paul Duffy <paul at scim dot co dot uk> wrote in message >...
>
> > So ideally what would be perfect in the next driver release would be a
> > new driver mode...
> >
> > Appear to be mode 1 above but work as mode 2...I'll try to describe what
> > I mean.
> >
>
> Or you can upgrade to the 9503DG5 with a dual-link DVI converter box.
>
What's a Dual Link DVI Convertor box?

Googled it and can't find an appropriate link.

P

Wilson
December 2nd 03, 06:12 PM
Paul Duffy <paul at scim dot co dot uk> wrote in message >...
> What's a Dual Link DVI Convertor box?
>
> Googled it and can't find an appropriate link.
>
> P

IBM released a newer version of the T221 called the 9503DG5. It has
an internal refresh rate of 48Hz while the DG0, DG1, and DG3 have a
41Hz rate. The DG5 also comes with a dual-link DVI to 2x single-link
converter box. Dual-link DVI has 2 data channels to support up to
330MHz pixel clock. Single-link DVI maxes out at 165MHz. What this
means is that your Quadro FX 2000 would be able to drive the DG5 at
[email protected] using just the dual-link connector. Supposedly the
Quadro FX 3000 has a special mode to support [email protected] using both
the dual-link and single-link ports when driving the DG5.

IBM's site still doesn't have much info on the DG5 but it's available
for sale.

Paul Duffy
December 2nd 03, 10:36 PM
In article >,
says...
> Paul Duffy <paul at scim dot co dot uk> wrote in message >...
> > What's a Dual Link DVI Convertor box?
> >
> > Googled it and can't find an appropriate link.
> >
> > P
>
> IBM released a newer version of the T221 called the 9503DG5. It has
> an internal refresh rate of 48Hz while the DG0, DG1, and DG3 have a
> 41Hz rate. The DG5 also comes with a dual-link DVI to 2x single-link
> converter box. Dual-link DVI has 2 data channels to support up to
> 330MHz pixel clock. Single-link DVI maxes out at 165MHz. What this
> means is that your Quadro FX 2000 would be able to drive the DG5 at
> [email protected] using just the dual-link connector. Supposedly the
> Quadro FX 3000 has a special mode to support [email protected] using both
> the dual-link and single-link ports when driving the DG5.
>
> IBM's site still doesn't have much info on the DG5 but it's available
> for sale.
>
OK Thanks for that....

IBM Brought out a BIOS/EDID upgrade for the others (I've got a DG3) to
address the frequency upgrade rate. I still can't visualise what you
mean by this dual link DVI box....

I know about the Genlock on the 3000 but I still don't think that would
fix this problem (but I haven't seen the drivers yet!!).

The problem is the way 'Application control' takes over the card and
chooses the resolution. If the Quadro 3000 does it the same way it'll
have the same fault. Unless the driver has an option to allow you to
present the monitor device as one monitor while it pushes it as two
monitors 'below the surface' what will always happen is that the
application forces the card to drive the 'first' monitor as 3840x2400
and therefore only uses one DVI and therefore drives at 12Hz.

Matrox with the new Parhelia HR256 actually drive the monitor using 4
DVI channels so can drive it at 48Hz...but in Windows you choose an
option to tell it you've got an appropriate screen and it then in the
Windows Screen Setup display shows it as a single monitor (even though
it's internally driving it as 4) and therefore application full screen
mode opens across all 4 screens.

I think we're going to end up buying Parhelia's for the next batch of
screens (it's only half a dozen) which is a shame because I quite like
the Quadro's and the drivers are stable (except for this one issue!!.

If Nvidia even came back to me and said they were looking at it that
would be good...but they seem to just be ignoring the question.

P

Wilson
December 7th 03, 07:17 AM
Paul Duffy <paul at scim dot co dot uk> wrote in message >...

> IBM Brought out a BIOS/EDID upgrade for the others (I've got a DG3) to
> address the frequency upgrade rate. I still can't visualise what you
> mean by this dual link DVI box....
>

The firmware upgrade doesn't change the refresh rate of the DG3, it's
still at 41Hz.

The Quadro FX 3000 has a dual-link DVI port that can talk to the DG5
at [email protected] That way you don't have to use horizontal span.
It's 1 screen using 1 DVI port. The FX2k has a dual-link DVI port
also but no one has tested it with the DG5.

Paul Duffy
December 7th 03, 09:49 AM
In article >,
says...
> Paul Duffy <paul at scim dot co dot uk> wrote in message >...
>
> > IBM Brought out a BIOS/EDID upgrade for the others (I've got a DG3) to
> > address the frequency upgrade rate. I still can't visualise what you
> > mean by this dual link DVI box....
> >
>
> The firmware upgrade doesn't change the refresh rate of the DG3, it's
> still at 41Hz.
>
> The Quadro FX 3000 has a dual-link DVI port that can talk to the DG5
> at [email protected] That way you don't have to use horizontal span.
> It's 1 screen using 1 DVI port. The FX2k has a dual-link DVI port
> also but no one has tested it with the DG5.
>
Hi

Is that using the Genlock on the 3k or is it handled through the
EDID/BIOS settings?

While you're right in your suggestion would a driver that 'hid' it's
processing mode also fix the problem? i.e. Present in Windows as one
monitor while working as a horizontal span' two monitor setup in the
background. The problem isn't windows...it's 3D apps that want to go
into 3840x2400 mode.

Paul

Wilson Chan
December 10th 03, 08:50 AM
Paul Duffy wrote:
> In article >,
> says...
>
>>Paul Duffy <paul at scim dot co dot uk> wrote in message >...
>>
>>
>>>IBM Brought out a BIOS/EDID upgrade for the others (I've got a DG3) to
>>>address the frequency upgrade rate. I still can't visualise what you
>>>mean by this dual link DVI box....
>>>
>>
>>The firmware upgrade doesn't change the refresh rate of the DG3, it's
>>still at 41Hz.
>>
>>The Quadro FX 3000 has a dual-link DVI port that can talk to the DG5
>>at [email protected] That way you don't have to use horizontal span.
>>It's 1 screen using 1 DVI port. The FX2k has a dual-link DVI port
>>also but no one has tested it with the DG5.
>>
>
> Hi
>
> Is that using the Genlock on the 3k or is it handled through the
> EDID/BIOS settings?
>

No, dual-link DVI supports up to 330MHz pixel clock rate by having an
extra set of channel while single-link DVI supports up to 165MHz only.
The dual-link port of your QFX2K can run the DG5 at [email protected] Do
a google on "dual-link DVI" if you want more info.

--wilson