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View Full Version : VIVO won't capture correctly after a minute?


Edward
January 28th 07, 06:19 AM
When trying to capture video from an analog source, through the
composite or S-video ports, it starts dropping frames and slowing
down.
I know my PC is powerful enough with a 3.4 Ghz Pensium and a gig of
ram. Even if I reduce the wuality to 300 lines its still crappy. I
am using version 4.13 of the WDM driver with the same results.
My video card is an MSI GF7600gt.

What's going on?

DaveW
January 29th 07, 12:55 AM
To capture video to a computer you CANNOT use just a standard video card.
You have to install a special video capture card that are widely available.

--
DaveW

----------------
"Edward" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> When trying to capture video from an analog source, through the
> composite or S-video ports, it starts dropping frames and slowing
> down.
> I know my PC is powerful enough with a 3.4 Ghz Pensium and a gig of
> ram. Even if I reduce the wuality to 300 lines its still crappy. I
> am using version 4.13 of the WDM driver with the same results.
> My video card is an MSI GF7600gt.
>
> What's going on?
>

DRS
January 29th 07, 04:44 AM
"DaveW" > wrote in message

> "Edward" > wrote in message
> ups.com...
>> When trying to capture video from an analog source, through the
>> composite or S-video ports, it starts dropping frames and slowing
>> down.
>> I know my PC is powerful enough with a 3.4 Ghz Pensium and a gig of
>> ram. Even if I reduce the wuality to 300 lines its still crappy. I
>> am using version 4.13 of the WDM driver with the same results.
>> My video card is an MSI GF7600gt.
>>
>> What's going on?

> To capture video to a computer you CANNOT use just a standard video
> card. You have to install a special video capture card that are
> widely available.

Do you know what VIVO means? Free clue: the "V" is for...

Paul
January 29th 07, 07:01 AM
Edward wrote:
> When trying to capture video from an analog source, through the
> composite or S-video ports, it starts dropping frames and slowing
> down.
> I know my PC is powerful enough with a 3.4 Ghz Pensium and a gig of
> ram. Even if I reduce the wuality to 300 lines its still crappy. I
> am using version 4.13 of the WDM driver with the same results.
> My video card is an MSI GF7600gt.
>
> What's going on?
>

If you preview without capturing, is there still a problem ?

If you capture without a preview window being present, does it drop frames ?

Are there any messages in Event Viewer ? Any error messages ?

If you open up Task Manager with ctrl-alt-delete and use the
Performance tab, is there anything strange you see there,
while previewing and capturing ?

The time period of a minute, suggests RAM is
exhausted. And that is why I want you to look at the
Performance tab, just to see if there is anything
visibly bad there.

Paul

Edward
January 29th 07, 07:20 AM
On Jan 28, 6:55 pm, "DaveW" > wrote:
> To capture video to a computer you CANNOT use just a standard video card.
> You have to install a special video capture card that are widely available.
>
> --

you are incorrect.

I only get video cards with VIVO, and this has an analog video in.

Also, one doesn't need a "card" per se, but there are USB video
capture devices all over the place as well.

Edward
January 29th 07, 07:22 AM
On Jan 29, 1:01 am, Paul > wrote:
> Edward wrote:
> > When trying to capture video from an analog source, through the
> > composite or S-video ports, it starts dropping frames and slowing
> > down.
> > I know my PC is powerful enough with a 3.4 Ghz Pensium and a gig of
> > ram. Even if I reduce the wuality to 300 lines its still crappy. I
> > am using version 4.13 of the WDM driver with the same results.
> > My video card is an MSI GF7600gt.
>
> > What's going on?If you preview without capturing, is there still a problem ?
>
> If you capture without a preview window being present, does it drop frames ?
>
> Are there any messages in Event Viewer ? Any error messages ?
>
> If you open up Task Manager with ctrl-alt-delete and use the
> Performance tab, is there anything strange you see there,
> while previewing and capturing ?
>
> The time period of a minute, suggests RAM is
> exhausted. And that is why I want you to look at the
> Performance tab, just to see if there is anything
> visibly bad there.
>
> Paul


That's what I was thinking - RAM.
But why would it happen even when I cap at 320? that shoul dbarely
take up any RAM at all.

This didn't happen with my crappy little USB video capture - I think
it was made by IREZ or something.

I'll check the system monitor andlet you know.

Phil Weldon
January 29th 07, 08:34 AM
'Edward' wrote, in part:
| This didn't happen with my crappy little USB video capture - I think
| it was made by IREZ or something.
|
| I'll check the system monitor andlet you know.
_____

Try 'Process Explorer' (free at http://www.sysinternals.com). 'Process
Explorer' will give you much more detail. The capture aids in VIVO cards do
not have hardware encoders... it very well may be that your USB capture
device had a hardware encoder, and thus gave better quality. You haven't
said what kind of compression and encoding you use with your VIVO, but
'Process Explorer' will show the bottleneck.

Phil Weldon

"Edward" > wrote in message
oups.com...
|
|
| On Jan 29, 1:01 am, Paul > wrote:
| > Edward wrote:
| > > When trying to capture video from an analog source, through the
| > > composite or S-video ports, it starts dropping frames and slowing
| > > down.
| > > I know my PC is powerful enough with a 3.4 Ghz Pensium and a gig of
| > > ram. Even if I reduce the wuality to 300 lines its still crappy. I
| > > am using version 4.13 of the WDM driver with the same results.
| > > My video card is an MSI GF7600gt.
| >
| > > What's going on?If you preview without capturing, is there still a
problem ?
| >
| > If you capture without a preview window being present, does it drop
frames ?
| >
| > Are there any messages in Event Viewer ? Any error messages ?
| >
| > If you open up Task Manager with ctrl-alt-delete and use the
| > Performance tab, is there anything strange you see there,
| > while previewing and capturing ?
| >
| > The time period of a minute, suggests RAM is
| > exhausted. And that is why I want you to look at the
| > Performance tab, just to see if there is anything
| > visibly bad there.
| >
| > Paul
|
|
| That's what I was thinking - RAM.
| But why would it happen even when I cap at 320? that shoul dbarely
| take up any RAM at all.
|
| This didn't happen with my crappy little USB video capture - I think
| it was made by IREZ or something.
|
| I'll check the system monitor andlet you know.
|

Mr.E Solved!
January 29th 07, 08:55 AM
DaveW wrote:
> To capture video to a computer you CANNOT use just a standard video card.
> You have to install a special video capture card that are widely available.
>

DaveW, I'm curious, what video card are you currently using?

Edward
January 29th 07, 04:06 PM
On Jan 29, 2:34 am, "Phil Weldon" > wrote:
> 'Edward' wrote, in part:
> | This didn't happen with my crappy little USB video capture - I think
> | it was made by IREZ or something.
> |
> | I'll check the system monitor andlet you know.
> _____
>
> Try 'Process Explorer' (free athttp://www.sysinternals.com). 'Process
> Explorer' will give you much more detail. The capture aids in VIVO cards do
> not have hardware encoders... it very well may be that your USB capture
> device had a hardware encoder, and thus gave better quality. You haven't
> said what kind of compression and encoding you use with your VIVO, but
> 'Process Explorer' will show the bottleneck.
>

I was doing this for You tube... so the 300 line capture device was
fine. now I want to encode some old 8mm videos to DVD - hence I need
better quality.

I think it only happens with WIndows Movie Maker. I tried Virtualdub
with no compression and it appeared to work. I was runing late this
morning, so I had to check it and haul ass out the door. I hate my
job.
It was easier to capture uwing Moviemaker because it would compress it
ont he fly and I wouldn't have to import the video to You Tube it.
As we all know, once I have the HUGE uncompressed video, compressing
it into something else can take a looooooooong time. I wanted to
avoid that step. My end results were good enough for Youtube. When I
to to cap the 8mm video? I'll use Virtualdub with no compression. I
have a 30GB hard drive.
Now being able to capture with VD at full NTSC resolution... (720x480
that's going to be a problem. I don't think VD can do that.

ShutEye
January 29th 07, 08:39 PM
>> To capture video to a computer you CANNOT use just a standard video card.
>> You have to install a special video capture card that are widely
>> available.
>
> DaveW, I'm curious, what video card are you currently using?

Ask him about his medication instead

Mr.E Solved!
January 29th 07, 10:07 PM
ShutEye wrote:

>>> To capture video to a computer you CANNOT use just a standard video card.
>>> You have to install a special video capture card that are widely
>>> available.
>> DaveW, I'm curious, what video card are you currently using?
>
> Ask him about his medication instead

DaveW's repeated, purposeful spreading of obviously false information is
likely evidence of mental illness and sociopathy. I hope he either gets
help if he wants it, or gets punished for his anti-social behavior.
Either way, he won't be back until he's finished clipping his mother's
toe-nails. Until then, readers, ask and receive correct advice, for a
limited time only!

DaveW, you suck, and I say it in the most heartfelt, kindest way I can.

deimos
January 30th 07, 04:00 AM
Edward wrote:
>
> On Jan 29, 2:34 am, "Phil Weldon" > wrote:
>> 'Edward' wrote, in part:
>> | This didn't happen with my crappy little USB video capture - I think
>> | it was made by IREZ or something.
>> |
>> | I'll check the system monitor andlet you know.
>> _____
>>
>> Try 'Process Explorer' (free athttp://www.sysinternals.com). 'Process
>> Explorer' will give you much more detail. The capture aids in VIVO cards do
>> not have hardware encoders... it very well may be that your USB capture
>> device had a hardware encoder, and thus gave better quality. You haven't
>> said what kind of compression and encoding you use with your VIVO, but
>> 'Process Explorer' will show the bottleneck.
>>
>
> I was doing this for You tube... so the 300 line capture device was
> fine. now I want to encode some old 8mm videos to DVD - hence I need
> better quality.
>
> I think it only happens with WIndows Movie Maker. I tried Virtualdub
> with no compression and it appeared to work. I was runing late this
> morning, so I had to check it and haul ass out the door. I hate my
> job.
> It was easier to capture uwing Moviemaker because it would compress it
> ont he fly and I wouldn't have to import the video to You Tube it.
> As we all know, once I have the HUGE uncompressed video, compressing
> it into something else can take a looooooooong time. I wanted to
> avoid that step. My end results were good enough for Youtube. When I
> to to cap the 8mm video? I'll use Virtualdub with no compression. I
> have a 30GB hard drive.
> Now being able to capture with VD at full NTSC resolution... (720x480
> that's going to be a problem. I don't think VD can do that.
>

Oh yes it can! And I did so for years with a simple Hauppauge WinTV Go
(BT878 chipset) and a meager Athlon 1700 with 512MB RAM.

Normally you don't want to capture pure RGB uncompressed frames. That's
wasteful in terms of color space (since TV is very low chroma res) and
diskspace. Your biggest obstacles will be finding a real time lossless
compression codec and how fast your primary capture disk is.

HuffyUV (http://neuron2.net/www.math.berkeley.edu/benrg/huffyuv.html)
used to be everyone's standby for lossless capture. It provides around
2 or even 3:1 compression ratios. There are some far more advanced
options around nowadays (just browse the doom9.org forums), but Huffy
works reliably as a VFW codec.

Huffy can automatically convert RGB colorspace data to YUV, which is
where most of your compressability comes from, and then losslessly
compresses the rest with a huffman method. YUV is generally
indistinguishable from the original source.

After a little experience capturing, you'll find that you definitely
want a blank drive JUST for capturing. This avoids the problem of
having to defragment before capping and spanning multiple disks (which
Vdub does automatically, but it drops frames occasionally). In the very
least, have an open partition with little to nothing on it. Roughly
20-40GB is good for several hours of lossless video.

When capping audio, always use uncompressed WAV at 44khz/16-bit. Audio
doesn't take up much space at all, even for hours of video. At most you
might wind up with a gig or so. If you really need to save space, ADPCM
works well for TV caps and is very simple to compress.

When your done, take that fine 720x480 YUV source and try an AVC codec
like X264 or Nero Digital. Then AAC the audio and combine them into an
MP4. This has the added benefit of being compliant with an MPEG-4
standard container.

deimos
January 30th 07, 04:02 AM
deimos wrote:
> Edward wrote:
>>
>> On Jan 29, 2:34 am, "Phil Weldon" > wrote:
>>> 'Edward' wrote, in part:
>>> | This didn't happen with my crappy little USB video capture - I think
>>> | it was made by IREZ or something.
>>> |
>>> | I'll check the system monitor andlet you know.
>>> _____
>>>
>>> Try 'Process Explorer' (free athttp://www.sysinternals.com). 'Process
>>> Explorer' will give you much more detail. The capture aids in VIVO
>>> cards do
>>> not have hardware encoders... it very well may be that your USB capture
>>> device had a hardware encoder, and thus gave better quality. You
>>> haven't
>>> said what kind of compression and encoding you use with your VIVO, but
>>> 'Process Explorer' will show the bottleneck.
>>>
>>
>> I was doing this for You tube... so the 300 line capture device was
>> fine. now I want to encode some old 8mm videos to DVD - hence I need
>> better quality.
>>
>> I think it only happens with WIndows Movie Maker. I tried Virtualdub
>> with no compression and it appeared to work. I was runing late this
>> morning, so I had to check it and haul ass out the door. I hate my job.
>> It was easier to capture uwing Moviemaker because it would compress it
>> ont he fly and I wouldn't have to import the video to You Tube it.
>> As we all know, once I have the HUGE uncompressed video, compressing
>> it into something else can take a looooooooong time. I wanted to
>> avoid that step. My end results were good enough for Youtube. When I
>> to to cap the 8mm video? I'll use Virtualdub with no compression. I
>> have a 30GB hard drive.
>> Now being able to capture with VD at full NTSC resolution... (720x480
>> that's going to be a problem. I don't think VD can do that.
>>
>
> Oh yes it can! And I did so for years with a simple Hauppauge WinTV Go
> (BT878 chipset) and a meager Athlon 1700 with 512MB RAM.
>
> Normally you don't want to capture pure RGB uncompressed frames. That's
> wasteful in terms of color space (since TV is very low chroma res) and
> diskspace. Your biggest obstacles will be finding a real time lossless
> compression codec and how fast your primary capture disk is.
>
> HuffyUV (http://neuron2.net/www.math.berkeley.edu/benrg/huffyuv.html)
> used to be everyone's standby for lossless capture. It provides around
> 2 or even 3:1 compression ratios. There are some far more advanced
> options around nowadays (just browse the doom9.org forums), but Huffy
> works reliably as a VFW codec.
>
> Huffy can automatically convert RGB colorspace data to YUV, which is
> where most of your compressability comes from, and then losslessly
> compresses the rest with a huffman method. YUV is generally
> indistinguishable from the original source.
>
> After a little experience capturing, you'll find that you definitely
> want a blank drive JUST for capturing. This avoids the problem of
> having to defragment before capping and spanning multiple disks (which
> Vdub does automatically, but it drops frames occasionally). In the very
> least, have an open partition with little to nothing on it. Roughly
> 20-40GB is good for several hours of lossless video.
>
> When capping audio, always use uncompressed WAV at 44khz/16-bit. Audio
> doesn't take up much space at all, even for hours of video. At most you
> might wind up with a gig or so. If you really need to save space, ADPCM
> works well for TV caps and is very simple to compress.
>
> When your done, take that fine 720x480 YUV source and try an AVC codec
> like X264 or Nero Digital. Then AAC the audio and combine them into an
> MP4. This has the added benefit of being compliant with an MPEG-4
> standard container.

Of course, that's all great... if you're using VFW and you're probably
not... I'm an idiot.

Edward
January 30th 07, 04:53 AM
On Jan 29, 10:00 pm, deimos > wrote:
> Edward wrote:
>
> > On Jan 29, 2:34 am, "Phil Weldon" > wrote:
> >> 'Edward' wrote, in part:
> >> | This didn't happen with my crappy little USB video capture - I think
> >> | it was made by IREZ or something.
> >> |
> >> | I'll check the system monitor andlet you know.
> >> _____
>
> >> Try 'Process Explorer' (free athttp://www.sysinternals.com). 'Process
> >> Explorer' will give you much more detail. The capture aids in VIVO cards do
> >> not have hardware encoders... it very well may be that your USB capture
> >> device had a hardware encoder, and thus gave better quality. You haven't
> >> said what kind of compression and encoding you use with your VIVO, but
> >> 'Process Explorer' will show the bottleneck.
>
> > I was doing this for You tube... so the 300 line capture device was
> > fine. now I want to encode some old 8mm videos to DVD - hence I need
> > better quality.
>
> > I think it only happens with WIndows Movie Maker. I tried Virtualdub
> > with no compression and it appeared to work. I was runing late this
> > morning, so I had to check it and haul ass out the door. I hate my
> > job.
> > It was easier to capture uwing Moviemaker because it would compress it
> > ont he fly and I wouldn't have to import the video to You Tube it.
> > As we all know, once I have the HUGE uncompressed video, compressing
> > it into something else can take a looooooooong time. I wanted to
> > avoid that step. My end results were good enough for Youtube. When I
> > to to cap the 8mm video? I'll use Virtualdub with no compression. I
> > have a 30GB hard drive.
> > Now being able to capture with VD at full NTSC resolution... (720x480
> > that's going to be a problem. I don't think VD can do that.Oh yes it can! And I did so for years with a simple Hauppauge WinTV Go
> (BT878 chipset) and a meager Athlon 1700 with 512MB RAM.
>
> Normally you don't want to capture pure RGB uncompressed frames. That's
> wasteful in terms of color space (since TV is very low chroma res) and
> diskspace. Your biggest obstacles will be finding a real time lossless
> compression codec and how fast your primary capture disk is.
>
> HuffyUV (http://neuron2.net/www.math.berkeley.edu/benrg/huffyuv.html)
> used to be everyone's standby for lossless capture. It provides around
> 2 or even 3:1 compression ratios. There are some far more advanced
> options around nowadays (just browse the doom9.org forums), but Huffy
> works reliably as a VFW codec.
>
> Huffy can automatically convert RGB colorspace data to YUV, which is
> where most of your compressability comes from, and then losslessly
> compresses the rest with a huffman method. YUV is generally
> indistinguishable from the original source.
>
> After a little experience capturing, you'll find that you definitely
> want a blank drive JUST for capturing. This avoids the problem of
> having to defragment before capping and spanning multiple disks (which
> Vdub does automatically, but it drops frames occasionally). In the very
> least, have an open partition with little to nothing on it. Roughly
> 20-40GB is good for several hours of lossless video.
>
> When capping audio, always use uncompressed WAV at 44khz/16-bit. Audio
> doesn't take up much space at all, even for hours of video. At most you
> might wind up with a gig or so. If you really need to save space, ADPCM
> works well for TV caps and is very simple to compress.
>
> When your done, take that fine 720x480 YUV source and try an AVC codec
> like X264 or Nero Digital. Then AAC the audio and combine them into an
> MP4. This has the added benefit of being compliant with an MPEG-4
> standard container.


Here's what I did, the video seems OK when I view it.
I captured in uncompressed AVI - I know that's bad but it worked.
It is a 140 GB file on a 300GB disk.
I edited certain scened out with Sony Vegas - you know accidentally
taping my feet and useless crap. I was 16 at the time this was teken
and I was a pretty lousy cameraman.
Now Its rendering it to another uncompressed AVI and from there I'll
use Nero to put it to DVD.
But I'll have to start using that Huffy codec from here on in if I'm
going to keep screwing around with these 100+ GB files. Since my plan
is to put multiple home videos on a single DVD.